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Thank you OWI for making FOB spam again

3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

Just a tip of the hat to OWI for making spamming FOBs with nothing but a hab and an ammo crate the best way to win a game instead of building something useful. I created a screengrab for your enjoyment but can't include it here, but it was glorious spam. We were on RAAS Mutaha and our team had 11 fobs down on that fairly small map. We were able to spawn transport ALLL over the map in glorious fashion to absolutely destroy the enemy. If it weren't for OWI making this possible, I just don't know how I could have teleported so quickly. Thanks OWI, for Making FOB Spam Again!

Comments

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    I had another wonderful FOB spam game! We had them speckled all over the map, which allowed us to dominate the entire game.


    If OWI hadn't made the cost of sand bags, razor wire, emplacements, etc so expensive (not just build cost, but time to dig and ammo cost) and if they weren't so easy to destroy via mortars, we never could have enjoyed the FOB spam! If FOBs were actually defensible, the team would have spent more time building a few super fobs and defending them instead of the joy of spamming undefended HABs and ammo crates all over the map. I mean, when you have 10+ FOBs on the map, why guard a FOB? Let them take it down, we have spares! If you destroy it, we will deploy it!


    So thank you again OWI, for Making FOB Spam Again. If you actually made the buildables more varied, cheaper, quicker to dig and less susceptible to mortar fire, I never would have enjoyed seeing a map littered with spawn points.


    And, and one other little gem that you just hit outta the park... The -60 ticket/min ticket bleed. Wow, where would a game be if we didn't have that, right? I mean, the other team might have a fighting chance, but by building in a -60 ticket/min bleed out system, you have successfully enabled the other team to literally give up the fight and hate playing as there is no way to recover from that big of a loss. Makes me wonder, perhaps instead of a -60 ticket bleed, could you just have the game end immediately if the enemies last point is captured? Then we could just end the destruction even faster and really make the other team hate playing even more and then leave a server so that nobody can play! After all, who in their right mind enjoys a good come-back game that keeps servers full???? NOT ME... I like to see servers emptied out because we spammed FOBs everywhere and then the other team hit -60 tickets/min bleed and left the server out of complete frustration! WOO HOO BABY, that's my kind of game!

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★

    That's what they get for not limiting number of fobs.

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    That's what they get for not limiting number of fobs.

    There is another way than just limiting fobs. Instead, they could make the cost to build things cheaper, and the cost to dig them cheaper (ie. instead of like 10 shovel digs for something, make it 5), and then they could make them a little less likely to get blown up by mortars, and get rid of the retarded proxy system to disable a FOB.


    People LIKE to build things, but when the build cost is high, and the ability to destroy them is easy (mortars and proxy system,) it's just not worth it. FOB spam is the result of it not being worth the cost to build up a FOB from a defensive perspective because they are so easily taken down. If OWI will make the system reward SL's that actually build up fewer FOB's, then we'll see FOB spam go down. Until then, the best way to win a battle is to spam.


    OWI, please...

    1) Reduce build costs on items. Sandbags and razor wire should NOT cost 50 build points. Razor wire should be like 10 build points.

    2) Reduce the time for shovels to build items. Razor wire should NOT take 7 shovels. Razor wire is meant to be rapid deployment protection, not the same shovel time as a sandbag line (which also takes too long to shovel.)

    3) Reduce the impact of mortars on all this stuff. I realize mortars should be able to blow things to pieces, but there needs to be a bit of balance here. It takes soooo long to build stuff up, only to see it all destroyed with like 4 well placed mortars that it makes it not worth it.

    4) Get rid of the stupid proxy system to disable a HAB. I still don't get the purpose of this? So what if my team wants to turn it into a meat grinder where we just keep tossing bodies at it and dying, that's OUR choice if we feel the HAB is worth trying to save! The proxy system alone is probably the greatest reason for FOB spam because it allows the enemy to take down a FOB with hardly any effort. Get a few guys close enough, sit and pick off the remaining enemies while the HAB is disabled, then move in with literally ZERO resistance. I mean, come on, that is just ridiculous. I have guided a team of bandits all over the map that has done nothing but destroy FOBs. As soon as the enemy has nowhere to spawn, and we have FOBs spammed all over the map, the game is over, especially with that equally stupid ticket bleed system. You have basically designed a system that once the scale has been tipped slightly, there is NO coming back, and it's easy to tip if you are a good SL that knows how to exploit all this stuff.

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★
    edited January 24

    Reducing the cost means too much bs pulled from a pickup truck.

    If you want to make them easy to build then they will have to be even easier to destroy.


    Mortar needs to be much less accurate in general but that's a different issue(even without mortar, there is airstrike).


    Getting rid of proxy is the dumbest thing I ever heard; it needs more work such as making rally only last 60s but getting rid of proxy is entirely backwards and does nothing to solve the fob-spam issue(you made them more powerful -> they will get spammed more and defenses are even less useful).

  • GeebusGeebus Member Posts: 120 ★★

    This. FOB spam is the result of the FOB being a semi permanent spawn that is capable of moving entire teams. You don't nerf it by making it even harder to kill.

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    FOB spam is the result of the FOB being a semi permanent spawn that is capable of moving entire teams. You don't nerf it by making it even harder to kill.

    I'm sure you and I both have the same goal, but a different vision of how to get there. I couldn't disagree with you more.


    FOBs are supposed to be Forward Operating Bases, which means, hard to take out. We aren't really building FOBs right now, but teleportation devices (as you describe.) Why? It's because they are too easy to take down, so nobody takes the time to actually build it up as a Forward Operating Base. It's simply not worth the time and effort. You can go build all the sandbags, razor wires, bunkers, MG nests that you want. As soon as the enemy gets withing 80m with enough people, your HAB is down. Your only solution is to leave the comfort of your MG nest or sandbag hidey hole and go find the enemy that is 80m out so that you can get the HAB re-activated. The problem is, then you get killed because you leave the safety of cover while they sit and wait for you. That, in my opinion, results in more FOB spam because it's simply not worth it to try a defend a single FOB. It's better to try and get 12 FOBs on the map so that if they take one down, it just doesn't matter.

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    OWI, time to stop the insanity. Make server side game play settings to change the type of game play on the servers, and then change the interface on the client side to allow us to filter for servers that match the type of game play that we want. Provide a One-Life-To-Live option. Provide hab proxy on/off/distance settings, fob quantity and fob distance options. Allow build costs / build time to be adjusted, and countless other ideas that other people have come up with, and let's let the community at large have a go at these different ways to play Squad. You literally are hearing from someone every day with some idea because they want a slightly different version of the game you have created, and you are sitting back trying to figure out what the ONE best way is to design squad. Stop the insanity and give us options and you'll probably get less people requesting changes because they are more likely to find a server that matches the type of squad game they enjoy.

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★

    Making fob harder to kill just means it will get spammed more. Why waste time on "defenses" that give away its location(and still doesn't hold up against mortar/155mm) when people can spam more habs?

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    Why waste time on "defenses" that give away its location(and still doesn't hold up against mortar/155mm) when people can spam more habs?

    Sooooo basically you are making my point for me? That when FOBs are easy to take down, you spam FOB's more with less build up.

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★
    edited January 29


    1. lower cost "defenses" still give away the location of a fob.
    2. when fobs are harder to take down for the same cost, they will get spammed even more.
    3. mortars and 155 are still going to nuke whatever "defenses" you pretend to build; especially when your "defenses" cost less material/time.
    4. you're getting overrun because of skill issue(because defending a hab isn't just sitting inside it waiting for enemy to show up) and bad setup(fob build radius is bigger than 80m, if you have enough people to disable spawning by proxy, problem is you - probably because you wanted to hide the radio so you built hab on edge of build circle, hence zero defenses in that direction - and none of your terrible suggestions will help with that because you literally can't build there, let alone worry about time/material cost)

    In conclusion, you have no point; you don't even understand the cause of fob spam issue.


    There are many causes for fob spam problem and you haven't addressed even one of them.


    Hell, you don't even understand that FOB can be tiny:

    https://www.army.mil/article/87862/all_fobs_are_not_the_same

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    Yeah sorry, I totally disagree with you. I think we have the same goal, but we differ on how to get there. I could just as easily say you do not understand the cause of FOB spam. According to your logic, making FOB's more expensive to build, more timely to build up, harder to defend and easier to take down will reduce FOB spam.


    Let's see if we can find some agreement on something instead of mindless bantering back and forth. Would you support the idea of server side settings that allow the actual game play to be adjusted, and then client side filters that allow you to find the type of servers that have the game play you like? I'd love it if a server could be configured as a one-life server (I realize there are one-life matches out there, but that's not the same as it being baked into the game and that's just how the server is configured 24/7.) And in those server settings, they could also provide options to turn on/off the proxy system or modify the distances, same with the build radius, or maybe they could define how many fobs you can build per map and the rally point changes you're asking for. Then you could just join the server that you like that has the game play you like. Is that something you could get behind?


    I'm totally willing to admit that my ideas may not yield the results I desire (hopefully you're old enough to do the same) and that's why my #1 feature request is server side side game play settings with client side filter options. I'd love to see ALL of these ideas fleshed out in the community. Let's flesh out your feelings about rally points. Let's flesh out my feelings about FOB build costs, FOB proxy and ticket bleed system. The community at large will vote based on which servers they join the most and how they ask the admins to configure the game play. And in the end, it might be that ALL the ideas here are great ideas, they just yield different game play and you as a gamer can now decide on a nightly basis just what type of game you want to join. I'm just done with this "one-size-fits-all" mentality that the tech industry has moved to (which I personally blame Apple for dumbing us down to after years of choices.)

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★
    edited January 31

    "making FOB's more expensive to build, more timely to build up, harder to defend and easier to take down will reduce FOB spam."

    First of all I never said FOBs need to be more expensive to build. What I posted previously: "Reducing the cost means too much bs pulled from a pickup truck.

    If you want to make them easy to build then they will have to be even easier to destroy."


    Scaling the other way: It needs to be more expensive and take more time to build if you want it to be more resistant to attacks/overrun.

    You also neglected my comment on nerfing of rallypoint. I wasn't calling for nerfing of fob any further without nerfing rally point, because that would just push people to use rallypoint as habs(as it already has done).


    "mindless bantering back and forth" - that's just you refusing to reconsider what you "thought" was the way.


    IIRC Squad already has server settings("custom option" for modders), they're just in "custom servers" section(something about squad server licenses, which is what's required to not get segregated to custom servers tab, forces you to adhere to some kind of guideline). But of course nobody plays those. There are supposed to be mods that change these aspects of the game that you mentioned(but of course, again, nobody plays those).


    The game would have been better if it was "one size fits all" because currently it's leaning way too hard toward casuals.

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    "mindless bantering back and forth" - that's just you refusing to reconsider what you "thought" was the way.

    Best juvenile comment of the day.


    IIRC Squad already has server settings("custom option" for modders), they're just in "custom servers" section

    I'm sorry, I don't know how to get through to you. You literally do not see the bigger picture and you think what exists today somehow remotely represents the scale of what I'm talking about with server side settings. It's like you're from Texas thinking the Hill Country area is amazing, never having been to the Grand Canyon and understanding the difference in scale. Keep gaming little buddy, with time comes experience and eventually, hopefully, you'll understand what "choice and competition" really means.

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★

    >Best juvenile comment of the day.

    Right back at you.


    >I'm sorry, I don't know how to get through to you. You literally do not see the bigger picture and you think what exists today somehow remotely represents the scale of what I'm talking about with server side settings. It's like you're from Texas thinking the Hill Country area is amazing, never having been to the Grand Canyon and understanding the difference in scale. Keep gaming little buddy, with time comes experience and eventually, hopefully, you'll understand what "choice and competition" really means.

    Projection. You're the one who doesn't see the bigger picture.

    Hopefully eventually you'll understand that mods exist.

  • 3S_Moe3S_Moe Member Posts: 91 ★★

    Projection. You're the one who doesn't see the bigger picture.

    Bwahahahaha

    Hopefully eventually you'll understand that mods exist.

    Juvenile. I already discussed it. You still are not understanding. Nice job little EcchiRevenge

  • EcchiRevengeEcchiRevenge Member Posts: 297 ★★
    edited February 10

    You can only choose awkward laughter as you get owned.


    Projection again. I already discussed it. Nice fail little 3S_Moe

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