Jump to content
bumfluff

Please no raised weapon as default

Recommended Posts

Elirah   
On 11/15/2016 at 9:39 AM, koschilein said:

I don´t get why it is so complicated to have a dedicated button for one more function....

 

...that people who dont want to use it, dont have to use it.

I dont get it either.

Its like a key you dont have to bind to anything, unless you want to lower and raise your weapon.

So its just for the people who want to use lower and raise weapon. It doesnt affect the people who argue against this feature in any way.

Thats what baffles me most.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
naezro   

I believe there is a way to achieve this without any overly complicated keybindings or controls. 

 

I think the primary benefit to game play is that it remind players to slow down and observe their surroundings.  Listen to sounds and focus.  A lot of players get into the "meat grinder" mentality and always push into the fight and try to take fights head on and rely on their twitch shooting skills.

 

This would encourage more tactical and strategical play.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
34 minutes ago, naezro said:

I believe there is a way to achieve this without any overly complicated keybindings or controls. 


Can you explain?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
16 hours ago, Elirah said:

 

...that people who dont want to use it, dont have to use it.

I dont get it either.

Its like a key you dont have to bind to anything, unless you want to lower and raise your weapon.

So its just for the people who want to use lower and raise weapon. It doesnt affect the people who argue against this feature in any way.

Thats what baffles me most.

 

Well that's not actually what everyone is suggesting; some people are suggesting that the default mode of play constitutes you running around without your weapon raised, and that in order to raise your weapon and shoot you'd need to do that, which would also slow your movement down, or at the very least induce arm-fatigue which would increase sight sway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
13 hours ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

Well that's not actually what everyone is suggesting; some people are suggesting that the default mode of play constitutes you running around without your weapon raised, and that in order to raise your weapon and shoot you'd need to do that, which would also slow your movement down, or at the very least induce arm-fatigue which would increase sight sway.


That doesn't mean it's the default mode of play or whatever you want to call it.
It's just a different mode for your weapon.

If I am in an urban environment or aproaching a flag and I move at walking speed I'll keep my weapon up, because I am not consuming any stamina while walking anyway. If I am running over a field in intervals or fleeing from an area while crouched I'd put my weapon down so that I regain the lost stamina faster.
But yeah - adding a separate stamina bar for "arm fatigue" would be iffy.

Let me put it this way. Would you like the addition of a weapon down/up button, if...
- everything about walking with your weapon raised stayed the same as it is now
- only thing changed would be an added stamina recovery buff for when you put your weapon down

Who would say no to that?

Edited by Peerun

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Peerun said:


That doesn't mean it's the default mode of play or whatever you want to call it.
It's just a different mode for your weapon.

If I am in an urban environment or aproaching a flag and I move at walking speed I'll keep my weapon up, because I am not consuming any stamina while walking anyway. If I am running over a field in intervals or fleeing from an area while crouched I'd put my weapon down so that I regain the lost stamina faster.
But yeah - adding a separate stamina bar for "arm fatigue" would be iffy.

Let me put it this way. Would you like the addition of a weapon down/up button, if...
- everything about walking with your weapon raised stayed the same as it is now
- only thing changed would be an added stamina recovery buff for when you put your weapon down

Who would say no to that?

 

Well, no, but I actually want the default mode of transportation to be "lowered weapon during movement" with a "combat stance" like how ArmA 3 achieves it.

 

I would settle for simply doing what you said, though, but I think the most realistic pace of gameplay would be achieved by, well, emulating ArmA in that (and many other) regards.

 

While the argument for not changing Squad is often "don't fix what ain't broke," Squad isn't done being developed, and can be improved.  ArmA works, so why not emulate it in some respects in that same vein?  ArmA ain't broke (for the most part) so don't bother fixing what wasn't broken with that game.

 

That said I feel like that's a needlessly conservative attitude and features and refinements ought to be implemented based on their merit, not whether or not they change the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
35 minutes ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

Well, no, but I actually want the default mode of transportation to be "lowered weapon during movement" with a "combat stance" like how ArmA 3 achieves it.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Shields   
On 15.11.2016 at 4:49 AM, NikolaiLev said:

 

I'd like to point out that the issue you cited is caused by using arma 3's "combat stance for 3 sec." button, which is a pretty irrelevant button since you can just toggle combat stance off and on, and you won't get the "continue to walk straight" issue.

I am not using "Combat pace 3 sec". I use toggle combat pace and simply "toggle raise weapon" for raising/lowering my weapon and that does not eliminate the issue.

If you know an actual fix to prevent the 3 sec combat pace after raising a weapon, tell me what keybinds you're referring to then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/01/2016 at 7:49 AM, KlasiK116 said:

. . .  topic to make Squad the best realistic/tactical/Mil Sim game as described on the front page, notice all the qualifying words that are underlined in the description that was taken from the official webpage. These would all be descriptors of any realistic/tactical/Mil Sim shooter on the market.

ALONE ON THIS BATTLEFIELD, YOU WILL NOT SURVIVE.

Squad is an online, team-based military experience where high levels of teamwork and communication are crucial to success.

 

Built from the ground up in Unreal Engine 4, Squad pits teams of up to 50 people against each other in intense modern day combined-arms combat scenarios. In this realistic environment, the flow of the game is dictated by the players, with organic and emergent gameplay reigning supreme.

 

The same(Bolded in quote) could have been said (described) of Joint Operations, which is/was never a MilSim.

Realistic, yes

Tactical, yes

MilSim, . . . - nowhere does it say Squad is a Military Simulation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

TBh everything that has been suggested in this thread bar those who dont want it at all.. needs to be spoken about because if they are going to implement penaltys to your body via registered hits EG.. getting hit in the leg slows yadda yadda or hit in the arm stuffs with your weapon control.. then how can weapn raised and lowered not be talked about.

Edited by Bigsmokeee

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 11/22/2016 at 4:03 AM, Shields said:

I am not using "Combat pace 3 sec". I use toggle combat pace and simply "toggle raise weapon" for raising/lowering my weapon and that does not eliminate the issue.

If you know an actual fix to prevent the 3 sec combat pace after raising a weapon, tell me what keybinds you're referring to then.

 

Gee, I dunno what your problem is then, sorry!  But it's not an issue I've ever encountered.  Could be a hardware or lag issue, I dunno.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
1 hour ago, Arduras said:

Just make it like Insurgency - your weapon is down if you're not ADSing or haven't hip-fired for a moment, just make it an automatic animation.


Taking control from the player. I don't think that's a good thing in any game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Arduras said:

Just make it like Insurgency - your weapon is down if you're not ADSing or haven't hip-fired for a moment, just make it an automatic animation.

 

57 minutes ago, Peerun said:


Taking control from the player. I don't think that's a good thing in any game.

 

If it worked in Insurgency, RO1, RO2, and Resistance&Liberation why wouldn't it work here?  I was thinking earlier of how much I wish Squad had free-floating hipfiring.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
19 minutes ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

 

If it worked in Insurgency, RO1, RO2, and Resistance&Liberation why wouldn't it work here?  I was thinking earlier of how much I wish Squad had free-floating hipfiring.


Well I didn't play Insurgency so I just went off of " your weapon is down if you're not ADSing or haven't hip-fired for a moment ". Don't know how hipfire even enters into this, unless you mean "lowered weapon = hipfire".

Edited by Peerun

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Arduras   

The control is still in the player's hands, if they're ADSing the weapon is  raised. If they hip fire, the weapon is raised quickly (no consequence to the player) and shoots without delay. It's a mild animation trade off (that only applies to third person model, but should be easy to make it 1p as well) The main consequence is you can stand behind cover and crouch /etc and not have your arms and weapon clipping through as much since it's aimed downwards unless you're aiming. I love the gun play in Insurgency, I'd urge you to try it some time as it's a great example of tactical play in small instances - or watch youtube videos of the game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   

In that case you just completely ruined my immersion with "have to go ADS every time I want to bring my weapon up" and "a lowered weapon goes up instantly if you hipfire"
If the above isn't the case then you've taken control away from the player because the weapon goes automatically into a lowered position and takes a moment to go back up, so I have to click every time it goes down, if I am still near enemies.
The word automatically, automatically means you're taking control from the player and making something automatic.
The only pro that you raised as an argument for your method is that which is already implied in the name of the feature - lowering your weapon.
I also don't understand why you keep referring to non-ads as hipfire.

Edited by Peerun

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Arduras   

Man I don't get why you can't understand that if the player controls it, it's in player control.. They shoot or aim and their weapon is raised, no cumbersome bullshit keybinding like DayZ. So what if it's lowered automatically, you have the agency to raise it whenever it's needed and honestly you SHOULD be aiming before shooting when possible.

 

Also, doesn't matter what game your playing, non ADS is called hipfire since it's the equivalent of firing from the hip (ie, quick, reactive, inaccurate)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Peerun   
31 minutes ago, Arduras said:

Man I don't get why you can't understand that if the player controls it, it's in player control.. They shoot or aim and their weapon is raised, no cumbersome bullshit keybinding like DayZ. So what if it's lowered automatically, you have the agency to raise it whenever it's needed


Yes, I have the ability to raise it, but I don't have the ability to lower it when needed. That's the point.
 

31 minutes ago, Arduras said:

and honestly you SHOULD be aiming before shooting when possible.


Yes and that's why I want my barrel pointing into the general direction of where I am looking BEFORE I aim, so I can shoot instantly.
 

31 minutes ago, Arduras said:

Also, doesn't matter what game your playing, non ADS is called hipfire since it's the equivalent of firing from the hip (ie, quick, reactive, inaccurate)


Let's take this apart. Hip and fire. No it's not a really cool looking flame, it means firing your weapon from the hip, as opposed to firing it from your shoulder.
It matters only in games where hip-fire is the only mode of firing, next to ADS.


I can't understand what the apeal is for you to want self-lowering weapons. You might aswell want automatic reload, automatic bipod, automatic aim and an automatic trigger.

If you make every single thing automatic we'd soon be playing call of squad, though I understand that if you made everything manual, we'd be playing IL2, so maybe a wise compromise could be to bind lowering your weapon to sprinting. That way you can easily choose to lower your weapon by pressing Shift and to bring it back up, you go ADS, like you said. 2 clicks for people that have toggle ADS and 1 click for people who have it set to hold.

 

Edited by Peerun

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Rybec   
1 hour ago, Peerun said:

I also don't understand why you keep referring to non-ads as hipfire.

Because before aiming down sights was standard in first person shooters, that's what it all was.

1481043-untitled.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×