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Gobx

Helis Update / Sling loading / Logistic support

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If we could get some containers (like arma) that could be sling loaded on the transport heli (one for building other for ammo and another for vehicle repair) each with 10,000 points to get your fob/hab built quick using logi to move ammo and building between HABS/FOB that would be amazing. Also the ability to sling load vehicles and armor. 

 

If you HAB has a repair container the heli can sling it back to HAB to be repaired. 

 

Which would be awesome to coordinate especially in dangerous areas. 

 

I'm also not sure if you're doing flares and any AA systems possibly just a build feature like the tow. with a short distance lock. (which would take large amounts of building and ammo so you'd need a container) etc. The better we can safe guard and build the better. It really makes the experience in this game worth playing more so than any other game. If you can build solid FOBS quickly with the heli support it will only make it the experience that much better.

 

Any insight from the community on building with these features is welcome!

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I would personally prefer simulating it as internal loads and not sling-loads, simply because of how unrealistic it would be to make combat insertions with a sling-load. If you've ever tried it in a flight simulator like X-plane or DCS, you know how slow you have to take it when doing even simple things, like transitioning from hover to forward flight and back. It's a royal pain in the butt and you have to take things so slow and smooth, it feels like trying to be a neurosurgeon. Choppers are very maneuverable machines (they are unstable by nature after all), as long as you don't have a few hundred kilos in a pendulum swinging below you, then it's like you're walking on eggshells and trying not to break them xD.

Seeing choppers with sling loads making fast insertions and hot drops would be immersion breaking. I think that having supply crates carried internally and being able to be dropped would be a good compromise between gameplay and realism, while maintaining immersion to an acceptable standard.

 

It was like that in Project Reality (the BF2 mod that Squad is based on), so i expect it will be pretty similar for Squad too.

Back then we only had ammo supplies that were dropped in visible crates from logis and helicopters. It was all or nothing as it was dropped in a crate, so you couldn't unload partial supplies like we do now. We didn't have construction points, but the crates themselves counted as construction points and there were small and large crates. The way it worked was that 2 small crates = 1 large crate. You needed 2 small or 1 large to build a FOB and they had to be up to a specific distance from where you tried to place the FOB (similar to the recently introduced mechanic in Squad that needs a logi within 30 meters). To place static weapon emplacements (like mortars and HMGs), you needed another large crate nearby (or 2 small ones). All of the above was in order to build stuff.

 

To change kits and rearm you had to stand close to the crates. To rearm static weapon emplacements you had to have riflemen drop their ammo bags on them and then go back to the crate to pick up more. You didn't get any visual indication of remaining ammo in the crate. I i think there was a slight graphics change when it was depleted past a certain percentage, and depleted crates had a dismantling animation, at which point you knew you needed a logi run.

So, it was more or less similar to the buildable ammo crates and other mechanics we have in Squad, but with a few differences.

 

What i liked better in PR was that you could destroy supplies with explosives and disable/disorganize FOBs before pushing them (eg, some HE rounds from an APC, a grenadier or mortars to destroy the enemy supply crates), and the more realistic resupply of static weapons with ammo bags (as opposed to Squad's "there are all these invisible ammo supplies around you and they magically get into the HMG whenever you need to reload" mechanic).

 

What i like better in Squad is that we get an exact readout of the supplies remaining, we can load supplies back up into a truck and we can make customized and partial loads/unloads (eg, load 30% build and 70% ammo, or take building supplies from your last FOB so you can make the next one faster). I think a combination of the two systems would offer the best flexibility and also give rise to more tactical shennanigans, which is good for gameplay.

 

They will probably have to add crates anyway with helicopters, because the whole point of them is to get in, drop and get out fast. If they have to stick around unloading like a logi, we'll have a lot of dead choppers initially, and they'll only be used for the safest of runs in the long run. Having the ability to do both methods would be nice. You could load/unload like we do now when the situation is safe, but you could also dump everything in a single crate out the back of the logi or the helicopter's side door when you are in danger, and get out as fast as you can.

 

As for AA, we had heat seeking missiles in Project Reality, both as static weapons built on FOBs and as a separate AA kit you could pick (similar to LAT, but against helicopters). The aircraft also had countermeasure flares they could launch. Things were very simplified, with most systems being a hybrid of how heat seekers and radar guided missiles work in reality. Basically, the missiles were heat seeking and the countermeasures were heat based (we had flares but not chaff), but you could hear a lock warning tone in your aircraft when they were locking you, which only happens with radar guided weapons.

In reality heat seekers are passive, they don't emit anything for your defensive systems to pick up on and warn you. The most that can be done (and it's not unusual for helicopters, since they fly lower and slower than other aircraft and they need the extra bit of warning) is to have a different sensor warn you when a missile has been launched and is approaching you. The difference between game and reality is that in the game you knew you were about to be locked and could act in advance (which is only possible with radar guided missiles), while in reality you would get the warning only after the heat seeking missile had already been launched against you (so you have less time to react).

 

However, i don't know if they'll add AA missiles immediately to Squad. in PR we needed them because apart from purely transports, there were also attack helicopters and attack jets that could wipe a full squad in a single pass. So, if you were playing on an open, desert map (similar to Tallil for example), your SL might ask for a guy to take the AA kit, just so you could scare some of them away while you cross 600 meters of open desert with no cover from enemy aircraft.

 

For Squad, i suspect they'll first wait and see how balanced it is with the current weapons. After all, the ZSU is an AA gun and we get it on both static and vehicle mounted versions (militia trucks, MTLB) for irregular factions. For the regular armies, they have fast firing APCs/IFVs and guided anti-tank missiles, which both work wonders against low and slow helicopters in a hover. But if they prove to not be enough, i expect them to add AA missiles for the ground troops and countermeasures for the pilots to use. It will be interesting nevertheless and i honestly can't wait.

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