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scallops

Bad game culture at the moment

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Posted (edited)

So I came back to squad after a long break and can't help but notice the call of duty players seem to outnumber the legit players. At least on the aussie servers

 

You have to abuse teammates standing on top of you just to get a medic and even then it will take almost 3 minutes, for some reason they always sigh on the mic before getting you up. Sorry to interrupt your mad kill streak! And maybe sigh without the mic button pressed down so we don't hear what a depressed wierdo you are. I legit can't believe how many sighs ive heard

 

Everyone seems to just zerg rush these days, with little to no communication and if you try do anything different like for instance a winning strat, half your squad will just abuse you and rebel so they can go zerg rush and lose the game while convincing themselves theyre Rambo cuz of their mad kill streaks.

 

Almost no one wants to follow orders, no one wants to be SL, no one wants to defend, and you put all these factors together and what you end up with is on average about 5-10 minutes of combat per game, and about an hour of failure and waiting to spawn. It's fairly unplayable... invasion is probably the only game mode where you can get some good combat.

 

It's like everyone good stacks the easy team, but the people on the hard team are so bad they refuse to even relax, have fun, follow orders or banter with the squad... they are just wierdo GI joe kids who might be tolerable if they had even the slightest clue about playing squad or living life in general.

 

If any relaxed players see me squad leading please join because im sick of these desperate to win fools who turn left when I say turn right because they are freakin out in a permanent state of fear where everyone is against them including the squad leader. Grab a beer, grab your gun, and have some fun with the boys.

 

You might actually watch a game play out differently for once

Edited by scallops

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Posted (edited)

I have come back recently after quite some time away, and I have a somewhat similar experience. Not nearly as bad as you, but I can definitely relate. 

 

There are all kinds of issues with how people play, but the one thing that makes no sense whatsoever to me is mods on servers not allowing you to lock squads. I played this server for a while and a game of invasion loaded up. I created a squad and called it "small inf" or something similar. I did this for different reasons. I wanted to scope out the second to first flag on this particular map as it's a hot spot for enemy habs, but I didn't want to pull nine guys out of defending the first flag. I locked it after three guys joined, explained my intentions, and we started to make our way to the area between the flags. Mods told me to unlock the squad, I replied with my intentions, still got denied, so I unlocked my squad and five more guys joined and cried out for a rally. At this point we were pretty much in location, enemies started pouring into the first flag from where I had predicted they would. We started engaging and halting their progress. Unquestionably doing our part. 

 

How long do you think it took before command comms were nothing but full-blown screeching that my squad was in the wrong location? 

Blaming me for everything that is wrong with the world, their dirty laundry, that it's raining outside, and so on. 

 

I agree, play the goddamn objective, but the on-going "casualization" of this game is preventing much of the creative squad leading aspects. It's linear as hell, and then you get these squad members who feel they know better than the squad leader. They just joined your squad to get that LMG and bumrush the frontlines. 

 

The apparent and continuous development towards a more arcade and accessible experience is ruining it for player who want more depth. I am going to get flak for saying this, but that's how it is. I guess joining a community with modded servers is the only option left, but I have heard bad things about that too, like it's a toxic try-hard environment instead of a toxic manchild environment. 

 

Having all of that said, I do enjoy the game at the moment, and can't wait for when I have a couple of days off next so I can spend some late night hours playing this mess.

Edited by PuddleMurda

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52 minutes ago, PuddleMurda said:

How long do you think it took before command comms were nothing but full-blown screeching that my squad was in the wrong location? 

Blaming me for everything that is wrong with the world, their dirty laundry, that it's raining outside, and so on. 

I agree. Don't listen to the haters, you knew what you were doing. But this happens when new players join a game and think they're playing the meta. They don't realize what is popular is not cutting edge, and the meta always changes. Literally just don't engage with noob SLs. My usual response is simply to laugh if they all start shouting at me. At round end, my squad always topfrags and you can laugh again when they say those frags don't matter as much.

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1 hour ago, PuddleMurda said:

...but the one thing that makes no sense whatsoever to me is mods on servers not allowing you to lock squads.

Ahh yes. An inconsistent ruleset that negates features the devs worked their asses off programming into the game make zero sense to me as well. Anything the coding of the game allows should be permitted and if not then the game should be reprogrammed for the desired result instead.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, scallops said:

Almost no one wants to follow orders, no one wants to be SL, no one wants to defend, and you put all these factors together and what you end up with is on average about 5-10 minutes of combat per game, and about an hour of failure and waiting to spawn. It's fairly unplayable... invasion is probably the only game mode where you can get some good combat.

To play pubbie AAS: All you need is one obedient squaddie and a logi to drop two HABs. Set yourself up on defence and make the flag your own personal killhouse. Place one HAB off the point and one on it. If your team loses the attack they will have to spawn on defence. If they win, make another two HABs at the new defence point. 

 

The fact that the team's SLs are playing predictably means you can cater your strategy to accommodate their weaknesses, even if they're not communicating and coordinating.

Edited by pinko
more strats

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4 minutes ago, pinko said:

To play pubbie AAS: All you need is one obedient squaddie and a logi to drop a HAB. Set yourself up on defence and make the flag your own personal killhouse. If your team loses the attack they will have to spawn at your HAB. If they win, make another HAB at the new defence point. 

Another tip is; Always volunteer to back-cap. Grab a logi, and get going. Once you have arrived at the second flag, and maybe dropped a back-up FOB there using about half of your supplies, you can check the map and see where and how your team is screwing everything up, and you are in a good position to make some game changing decisions. Swoop around and place an offensive FOB, or reinforce the next flag. 

 

In 9/10 matches you will end up as both the first line of defense and aggressor when the other 3-4 squads have bumrushed themselves into a meat grinder. 

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17 minutes ago, PuddleMurda said:

Swoop around and place an offensive FOB, or reinforce the next flag. 

 

In 9/10 matches you will end up as both the first line of defense and aggressor when the other 3-4 squads have bumrushed themselves into a meat grinder. 

Yep. The flanking HAB to clean up the middle cap is always a fun option. Just make sure the team gets the cap first and holds it. :P

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Posted (edited)

I don't have experiences as bad as you, but parts of it are definitely there. I especially agree with what was said about linearity. Sure, 9 guys in the middle of nowhere "providing recon" may be detrimental if they only care about camping for their killstreaks. But if you are communicating properly and spotting targets you should be able to get a lightly armed recon squad up with 5 people, and the same should go for mortars which most people don't even use. Even better, a 9 person mortar squad with 2 fireteams. The SL with half the squad on the FOB manning emplacements and running supplies, the secondary fireteam with long range kits (MGs with optics, marksmen, etc) out in the field spotting, calling out targets and correcting fire.

 

If you do that, you'll be yelled at for "not playing the objectives". Most people (SLs included) do not understand the value of flanking and positioning. Heck, most people do not understand the value of defense either. I've had a good SL actually make a proper FOB for us that is not directly on the point (you know, where enemies will definitely come and disable it as a result) but a short distance away in an easily held compound. Spawn, cross a couple of poppy fields and walls (ample cover and concealment to move safely) and after a minute or less you're on the flag. Drop a rally just outside the flag too and you are set to defend it easily while the rest of the team pushes up to take the next flag. Well, guess what. The moment we finished blocking off our FOB entrances with some razor wire, our SL told us we had to go push the next point because everybody was yelling at him. As soon as we were 100 meters off the FOB, the HAB was disabled because enemies started coming in. Our team got slaughtered on the cap before we got there and because they insisted so much on the entire team attacking, we also lost our HAB. Let me also mention that ours was the only FOB close to both the attack and defend objectives, so they had nowhere to spawn afterwards and spent 10-15 minutes twiddling their thumbs until we lost the game.

 

That being said, it's not just the fault of the meta. Buddy rallies for example have been confirmed as getting a do-over once the helicopters are in the game (a dev was quoted by one of the forum admins here). A lot of this is squarely on the players. And how do you go about fixing that? Well, server rules that make sense and a willingness to enforce them. There are multiplayer games you can pretty much play solo and there are multiplayer games that are by design team oriented. Squad is the second, so if some people are messing up the round for everyone (including themselves, because their playstyle fails to take into account essentials such as FOBs and logistics), the community as a whole should not be afraid to rustle a few feathers and get those guys in line. I've joined laid back squads and i've joined squads with "strict" SLs. Well, i have more fun with the second, because there is a structure and a plan which most people get behind and enjoy themselves more. An SL is not your boss and he's not "preventing you from playing the game you paid for the way you want to". If your way of playing the game results in diminished fun for everyone, you are playing the wrong game. An SL is a person who volunteers personal time and gray matter to organize some fun for you. I'd say a bit of respect is in order there and we should at the very least try to play along with their directions and orders.

 

Mechanically speaking, i think that the arrival of helicopters (more flanking opportunities) and 100 player servers (you'll be able to take a squad out of the meat grinder to do other useful stuff without being blamed for not playing the objectives) will somewhat shake up the current meta. That being said though, i still believe the majority of these issues are for the community to solve. I'd prefer if people in positions of leadership (SLs, the upcoming commander and server admins) are strict but fair, over having a "do your own thing guys" mentality and not having a single place to spawn 10 minutes into the round. People who can't adjust to that are just expecting a milsim game (even if it's milsim light) to work like an arena shooter. It's not going to work and they're just dragging everyone else down with them in the process.

Edited by Burningbeard80

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8 minutes ago, Burningbeard80 said:

I've had a good SL actually make a proper FOB for us that is not directly on the point (you know, where enemies will definitely come and disable it as a result) but a short distance away in an easily held compound. Spawn, cross a couple of poppy fields and walls (ample cover and concealment to move safely) and after a minute or less you're on the flag. Drop a rally just outside the flag too and you are set to defend it easily while the rest of the team pushes up to take the next flag. Well, guess what. The moment we finished blocking off our FOB entrances with some razor wire, our SL told us we had to go push the next point because everybody was yelling at him. As soon as we were 100 meters off the FOB, the HAB was disabled because enemies started coming in. Our team got slaughtered on the cap before we got there and because they insisted so much on the entire team attacking, we also lost our HAB. Let me also mention that ours was the only FOB close to both the attack and defend objectives, so they had nowhere to spawn afterwards and spent 10-15 minutes twiddling their thumbs until we lost the game.

Hahaha! Classic! I bet he was the one blamed for losing the game in unison by the other squad leaders. Story of my (Squad) life. 

Good post in general, mate. 

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Damn, what servers do you guys play on to get such bad experiences? I mean, the Aussie servers seem bad from what i read here, but it can't be all of em right? And what about the rest of you, what regions are you from and what servers do you play on? Because if it's that bad i'd definitely stay away from those.

 

I do notice that the game has become a lot less tactical due to (in my opinion) poor game design choices. And more new players who have no idea of what to do are trying out Squad because of people like Shroud suddenly playing this game (good for the devs income, but my god it's a mess at times).

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Damn, what servers do you guys play on to get such bad experiences?

I'm on EU servers myself. I jump around on whatever is available, now that most of the tried and tested servers usually have quite long queues. My experience is not as bad as OPs, but I do not have any tolerance for loudmouths, so it doesn't take much for me to straight up disconnect if the other squad leaders are cretins. In my experience it takes 2-3 matches on any given server for the rotation of squad leaders to end up with a bunch of, or just one (which is enough), absolute muppet(s). Then I disconnect and jump on another one that has recently started a new match (for anyone wondering, just join a server with 10-20 open slots as that indicates recent map change). 

Edited by PuddleMurda

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Burningbeard80 said:

That being said, it's not just the fault of the meta. Buddy rallies for example have been confirmed as getting a do-over once the helicopters are in the game (a dev was quoted by one of the forum admins here). A lot of this is squarely on the players. And how do you go about fixing that? Well, server rules that make sense and a willingness to enforce them.

That's asking an awful lot from admins. I think the better fix is in game design. The buddy rally do-over is a good example of that (though personally I'd like to see it just gone). 

 

Some of the most common server rules are fixes for camping Main, locking too many squads, and using map exploits. These issues should ideally be fixed by game design decisions before the game launches, along with other flaws in the game.

 

Game design can drive the meta by dictating possibilities. The rush and rally tactic was unlocked after rallies and vehicles were implemented. Before vehicles, rallies were typically placed behind friendly lines by sheer lack of manoeuvrability. Now we have to worry about multiple rally flanks, buddy rally reinforcements, and soon to be helicopter drops.

 

 Right now rallies are quite powerful. A massive, sustained, multi-flank team rush has proven to be a strong strategy, at least in the minds of players on public servers. Of course there are ways to counter this, like using vehicles to stomp on rallies if the terrain is open. In response, HABs have become useful secondary spawn points that are ideally hidden and unguarded to get more players on the cap. This all makes the ~30v30 meatgrinder on the central cap so familiar today. Combat is fast and sustained and tends to break down comms and coordination quickly. 

 

To slow combat down, you must slow down redeployment or increase redeployment distance. Rallies have an effective redeployment range of <100 m from the enemy, or <200 m if you're being safe. That's well within modern "seeing the whites of their eyes". It's just a constant bloodbath.

Edited by pinko

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, scallops said:

So I came back to squad after a long break and can't help but notice the call of duty players seem to outnumber the legit players. 

 

3 hours ago, PuddleMurda said:

I have come back recently after quite some time away, and I have a somewhat similar experience. Not nearly as bad as you, but I can definitely relate. 

I´ve been forcing myself to play lately.

After a round I always go "meh! this isn´t special anymore"

The experience is to "normal". No immersion. No need to communicate. And the funny thing is that my K/D ratio is better tan ever. I don´t need my squad in this versión. And my squad doesn´t need the other squads. Just some rally where to spawn. Period.

 

If you follow the other threads there are people arguing for removing suppression. They argue that it´s basically not FPS skills that are tested with this mechanic. So basically the new changes have made people feel, and attracted new people that have no idea what the initial philosophy of SQUAD was. Don´t even asl about experience or knowledge of PR. For these new people this is just the new BF, and to be honest…..for me too.

 

 

Edited by Nightingale87

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Posted (edited)
27 minutes ago, pinko said:

To slow combat down, you must slow down redeployment or increase redeployment distance.

Hear, hear! 

 

If I was the omnipotent ruler over Squad's development I'd remove rallies completely, only allow spawn at main and on a HAB, but only allow one HAB per team, and make it quite the effort to set up. Bring back instant death, only medics can revive, etc. The whole hardcore milsim advocate shebang. Make the game as unforgiving as humanly possible, to encourage true team work and coordination, "never leave a man behind"-mentality, making real life tactics as viable as possible within the limits of the digital world. But that's me... will never happen... ever, in any game. It's just not appealing to players for some, to me, very strange reason. 

Edited by PuddleMurda

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6 minutes ago, Nightingale87 said:

If you follow the other threads there are people arguing for removing suppression. They argue that it´s basically not FPS skills that are tested with this mechanic. So basically the new changes have made people feel, and attracted new people that have no idea what the initial philosophy of SQUAD was. Don´t even asl about experience or knowledge of PR. For these new people this is just the new BF, and to be honest…..for me too.

Hey buddy, 

 

Man, I don't want to follow those threads. It would give me an aneurysm pretty damn fast, as the arguments to remove anything trying to simulate authentic combat never have any form of logical reasoning behind them. It's just the usual "waaaah... it's no fuuun!!" or "It's boooring to respaaawn!!". 

 

Yeah, I feel the same when I play, but as it's been a while I do enjoy the gunplay, sounds, and the odd crazy thing that happens every now and then. Give me another "weekend" with a couple of sessions, and I'll probably be taking another long break. 

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Posted (edited)
26 minutes ago, PuddleMurda said:

Hear, hear! 

 

If I was the omnipotent ruler over Squad's development I'd remove rallies completely, only allow spawn at main and on a HAB, but only allow one HAB per team, and make it quite the effort to set up. Bring back instant death, only medics can revive, etc. The whole hardcore milsim advocate shebang. Make the game as unforgiving as humanly possible, to encourage true team work and coordination, "never leave a man behind"-mentality, making real life tactics as viable as possible within the limits of the digital world. But that's me... will never happen... ever, in any game. It's just not appealing to players for, to me, some very strange reason. 

My dream system would have spawning at Main, ammo-dependent spawning at HABs, and no rallies. Movement across the map should look like an RTS game capped at 50 supply. The Main is where units are trained or enter the field. HABs are bunkers which can be filled with reinforcements requiring resources (ammo). All transport of assets and personnel would be by vehicle or by foot. Oh, also Commander/SL vehicle purchasing at Main, where vehicles cost tickets at purchase, not when they go down :) 

Edited by pinko

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Posted (edited)

@Nightingale87

 

I am going to paint a picture of a short scenario, one of many events that "could" take place during a match. 

 

You are leading a squad. You command a nine man squad and a logi-truck. Your objective is to push up north through an Afghani type landscape, with poppy fields, hedgerows, and small ridges dividing these fields. You have Bravo, consisting of six soldiers, pushing north slowly and in cover, as you, the logi-truck, and the remaining two grunts trail about 100-150 meters behind. 

 

Bravo tries to push through and over a field-dividing strip of elevated ground, they take fire from the north somewhere. "Cover, COVER!!!" is shouted in local voice, and Bravo retreats and takes cover. The FTL realizes that the enemy has a good fix on their position, so he commands two guys to push west along cover while the other four moves east, to avoid being hit by enemy artillery that could be dropping within 40-50 seconds. If their medic is taken out, their fighting capability is greatly reduced. Not taking any chances. 

 

The FTL radios back to you, informing you of the situation. You tell him to pin-point the enemy position as you find a good spot, throw up a radio and two mortars. 

 

The FTL orders the two guys pushing west to fire and maneuver, direction west-north west, to draw attention while they try to locate the enemy. 

 

You are set up, mortars directed in the general direction and estimation of the enemy position, ready to fire. 

 

It's pretty quiet, other than the occasional couple of rounds being fired. All of a sudden your FTL shouts out coordinates, marks on map, "Unload hell, squad lead". You relay given information, make sure mortars are accurate, and tell the guys to let 'em fly. "Sending 12 shells" you report back. 

 

Some time later, you hear the splashes, closely followed by small arms fire. A moment of silence. "Enemy squad wiped, clear to move up". Confirmation, pack up mortars, dig down radio, let's go. 

 

 

 

These types of moments were what I was hoping for, and expected. Those hopes and expectations are long gone, my friend. Long gone. 

Edited by PuddleMurda

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25 minutes ago, pinko said:

My dream system would have spawning at Main, ammo-dependent spawning at HABs, and no rallies. Movement across the map should look like an RTS game capped at 50 supply. The Main is where units are trained or enter the field. HABs are bunkers which can be filled with reinforcements requiring resources (ammo). All transport of assets and personnel would be by vehicle or by foot. Oh, also Commander/SL vehicle purchasing at Main, where vehicles cost tickets at purchase, not when they go down :) 

I guess I have found myself another brutha! Good to see "we" are still out there, even if a very small minority.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, pinko said:

That's asking an awful lot from admins. I think the better fix is in game design. The buddy rally do-over is a good example of that (though personally I'd like to see it just gone). 

 

Some of the most common server rules are fixes for camping Main, locking too many squads, and using map exploits. These issues should ideally be fixed by game design decisions before the game launches, along with other flaws in the game.

 

Game design can drive the meta by dictating possibilities. The rush and rally tactic was unlocked after rallies and vehicles were implemented. Before vehicles, rallies were typically placed behind friendly lines by sheer lack of manoeuvrability. Now we have to worry about multiple rally flanks, buddy rally reinforcements, and soon to be helicopter drops.

 

 Right now rallies are quite powerful. A massive, sustained, multi-flank team rush has proven to be a strong strategy, at least in the minds of players on public servers. Of course there are ways to counter this, like using vehicles to stomp on rallies if the terrain is open. In response, HABs have become useful secondary spawn points that are ideally hidden and unguarded to get more players on the cap. This all makes the ~30v30 meatgrinder on the central cap so familiar today. Combat is fast and sustained and tends to break down comms and coordination quickly. 

 

To slow combat down, you must slow down redeployment or increase redeployment distance. Rallies have an effective redeployment range of <100 m from the enemy, or <200 m if you're being safe. That's well within modern "seeing the whites of their eyes". It's just a constant bloodbath.

 

 

99% of your points are valid, i just disagree that it's asking too much of admins to police their own servers. People did in in PR all the time with a much more limited tool set and it was very successful. Of course it was not done 24/7,  but during the server's prime time when a lot of the owners/admins/clan members were online, it was the norm.

 

You can automate quite a few things to be done by the game itself, but i prefer a human in the loop because he can make decisions based on the circumstances at a given time. For example, the most popular PR servers had very strict rules and the most common was that if you wanted any vehicle assets of a higher tier than logis/transports/techies you had to create or join a dedicated squad for it and there could only be one such squad per team. So on vehicle-heavy maps you usually had a tank squad, an APC/IFV squad, a squad for transport choppers and a CAS squad for the attack choppers and jets.

Soloing vehicles when it's against the rules? "Stealing" vehicles that belong to a dedicated squad? SLs that don't communicate? People who join squads just to get kits and then leave? 3 warnings and then you're out. Rejoin the server and do the same? Enjoy your 10-day ban from the server. It worked very well because the game was structured efficiently for the people who enjoyed teamwork, while the occasional troublemakers didn't have a choice but to adapt to the rules or find somewhere else to play.

 

Now, some of those things that admins did in PR have been automated in more recent games. Squad has the vehicle approval function for example, as well as reverting you to a recruit kit if you are not assigned to a squad. These are good examples that make it possible to punish non-teamwork playstyles, but they are not enough to cure everything. Still, i think this is the way to go, automate the small stuff and let admins deal with the rest on a case by case basis.

 

For example, Post Scriptum has pretty much hard-coded dedicated squads. But sometimes there can be problems with that. In PR if a server was below 50% capacity and there were not enough players online to form dedicated squads for every vehicle class, you could ask an admin if you could take a transport chopper or APC to move your infantry squad up to the front, and in such cases they allowed it (think of it as relaxed rules during server seeding). When it's something hard coded into the game though, you don't have those choices and i've heard a lot of PS players complaining about the rigid and predefined squad hierarchy during times of low server population.

 

Finally, active admins were also good for keeping the server enjoyable by handling map rotation on the fly whenever they were online. Sure, the server had its own predefined sequence of maps. Sometimes things would go bad though (eg, an update might cause server crashes) and you might get the same skirmish map (used for seeding at the start of the rotation) 3 times within 2 hours. Admins would put up a vote and players responded in chat if they wanted to bypass the map. In a similar fashion, whenever admins were online they were talking map suggestions. Then you'd see a poll with 2-4 map choices and as soon as a map was voted, there was a game mode poll to choose between insurgency or AAS. Players voted, results were calculated automatically and flashed across the top of the screen for everyone to see, and the admin just set the next map and layer through a console command.

 

It's a much more hands-on approach for sure. But it helps servers retain players for longer (if you can convince your squad to vote for your favorite map, you'll probably stick around for one more round) and it makes it more of a community. You gradually come to recognize all those guys that provide this service for you and start to respect them more, so you in turn start to play by the rules and if the rules are sensible like they were, everyone gets better matches as a result.

Edited by Burningbeard80

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3 minutes ago, Burningbeard80 said:

You can automate quite a few things to be done by the game itself, but i prefer a human in the loop because he can make decisions based on the circumstances at a given time.

Yea, there will always be admin responsibilities. My hope is that the gameplay can run itself so admins can focus on trolls and griefers, or other server objectives.

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Posted (edited)

Regardless of the server, layer or map no sooner than an AAS flag is captured everyone runs away from it as fast as possible like its some kind of Ebola hotspot. Nobody wants to defend because of course its boring and bad guys may or may not even show up anyway so peace out, push the next flag and of course every single time the team gets back capped, everyone's completely out of position and the command chat blame game starts. Its really no wonder people lock their squads at 1 or 2 and go feral just looking to pad their K/D ratio.

 

Honestly there needs to be a built in game mechanic that forces people to stay on defend flags like say for example as soon as everyone leaves the flag goes neutral.

Edited by Zylfrax791
the

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1 minute ago, Zylfrax791 said:

Regardless of the server, layer or map no sooner than an AAS flag is captured everyone runs away from it as fast as possible like its some kind of Ebola hotspot. Nobody wants to defend because of course its boring and bad guys may or may not even show up anyway so peace out, push the next flag and of course every single time the team gets back capped, everyone's completely out of position and the command chat blame game starts. Its really no wonder people lock their squads at 1 or 2 and go feral just looking to pad their K/D ratio.

 

Honestly there needs to be a built in game mechanic that forces people to stay on defend flags like say for example as soon as everyone leaves the flag goes neutral.

Those moments of respite are among my favorites. You and your squad have just accomplished your mission, to secure and capture an objective. A sigh of relief, and a hell yeah in local voice. "Alright boys, I want a 360 defense. Check your map, cover any vulnerable angle". Then you have a moment to chat a bit in local and bond with the guy next to you. Spit some USMC movie clichés, have a laugh. Keep an eye on the map, how things develop around the next objective, trying to come up with a plan for your next move, while the guys pick off a couple of stragglers, successfully defending the objective. 

 

It's a complete mind f*ck to me how often players lack the attention span to chill for 3-4 minutes before the next move, or the next incoming assault. 

 

(excuse me if I spam the thread, but I am at work and having a slow night)

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, pinko said:

My dream system would have spawning at Main, ammo-dependent spawning at HABs, and no rallies. Movement across the map should look like an RTS game…

AMEN!!!!!!   +1

(although rallies in a vanilla kinda game that disappear after a while dont bother me)

 

1 hour ago, PuddleMurda said:

@Nightingale87

 

I am going to paint a picture of a short scenario, one of many events that "could" take place during a match. 

 

You are leading a squad. You command a nine man squad and a logi-truck. Your objective is to push up north through an Afghani type landscape, with poppy fields, hedgerows, and small ridges dividing these fields. You have Bravo, consisting of six soldiers, pushing north slowly and in cover, as you, the logi-truck, and the remaining two grunts trail about 100-150 meters behind. 

 

Bravo tries to push through and over a field-dividing strip of elevated ground, they take fire from the north somewhere. "Cover, COVER!!!" is shouted in local voice, and Bravo retreats and takes cover. The FTL realizes that the enemy has a good fix on their position, so he commands two guys to push west along cover while the other four moves east, to avoid being hit by enemy artillery that could be dropping within 40-50 seconds. If their medic is taken out, their fighting capability is greatly reduced. Not taking any chances. 

 

The FTL radios back to you, informing you of the situation. You tell him to pin-point the enemy position as you find a good spot, throw up a radio and two mortars. 

 

The FTL orders the two guys pushing west to fire and maneuver, direction west-north west, to draw attention while they try to locate the enemy. 

 

You are set up, mortars directed in the general direction and estimation of the enemy position, ready to fire. 

 

It's pretty quiet, other than the occasional couple of rounds being fired. All of a sudden your FTL shouts out coordinates, marks on map, "Unload hell, squad lead". You relay given information, make sure mortars are accurate, and tell the guys to let 'em fly. "Sending 12 shells" you report back. 

 

Some time later, you hear the splashes, closely followed by small arms fire. A moment of silence. "Enemy squad wiped, clear to move up". Confirmation, pack up mortars, dig down radio, let's go. 

 

 

 

These types of moments were what I was hoping for, and expected. Those hopes and expectations are long gone, my friend. Long gone. 

Dude....

Oh dude...

I had a moment...

oh dude...

 

I only experienced that in PR (mostly ONE LIFE EVENTS, which are actually the only reason i´m still interested in the game)

Edited by Nightingale87

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Posted (edited)
25 minutes ago, Nightingale87 said:

Dude....

Oh dude...

I had a moment...

oh dude...

 

I only experienced that in PR (mostly ONE LIFE EVENTS)

The closest I have come to a moment like that in Squad was this one time when I managed to get my entire squad to actually hold fire for once, and we more or less crawled around an enemy infested area. We located their HAB, and everyone got into position in a hedgerow / treeline overlooking the enemy HAB. We had a good mortar squad on our team, so I marked the HAB and asked them to send one shell for confirmation. Perfect hit! 

"Perfect splash!! Give 'em hell boys, give 'em hell!!!"

 

"Hold your fire boys until the shells start dropping" in local voice. Moments later the shells were dropping accurately and consistently and all of us opened fire simultaneously. It was an absolute slaughter. Memorable moment. It would have been even better if those ferocious 30-40 seconds of absolute carnage would have meant more than it actually did in the end. 

 

With the right set of rules and game mechanics implemented in Squad, this would not be a one time in hundreds of hours of gameplay-moment. I think most players simply fail to realize this. They don't see the big picture. They wanna spawn and shoot, not build up to that moment and have that overwhelming feeling of accomplishment wash over them. Maybe not because they "don't want to", but because they do not realize the potential. 

Edited by PuddleMurda

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I had a moment the other day (Aussie server too). We were defending a flag. I overheard another squad leader saying "chuck down your ammo bag and lob grenades". I then watched on as the player then proceeded to lob grenades, refill from the ammo bag and continued to lob grenade after grenade in the enemy's direction.

 

The devs clearly want this game to go in the BF/COD direction. I wouldn't be surprised if we get crosshairs and player radars in the near future...

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