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paragonid

FTL rangefinder changes: incomplete solution

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Posted (edited)

Making FTL unable to determine range presented in a13 is an incomplete solution.

A12 algorithm was:

1. FTL sets marker
2. FTL reads range to the marker

A13 algorithm is:
1. FTL sets marker
2. FTL asks SL to set a marker on top of his own
3. SL marks on top of FTL marker
4. FTL reads range to the marker

Does it require more teamwork? I guess. Something like quick event for medic and someone he is trying to revive, then need to do it together successfully, then revives is successful. More teamwork as well...

Does it make finding range to target harder? I guess. If SL is aware of issue, it's +2-3 seconds, but same result. Although as a SL I don't really appreciate such minigame.


I'm not sure what exactly is trying to be archived with removing rangefinder from FTLs, but to make it complete, SLs should give up their ability to see range to the marker as well instead of playing minigame "SL, marker my FTL marker". Or another way is removal ftl marker



UPD: For full picture it's interesting to compare more similar features:

1. Squad marker (attack, observe, etc) + FTL marker
2. SL marker rangefinder + FTL marker rangefinder
3. Map contact marker + reinforce, resupply, etc markers

All of them increase effectiveness of operation and lead to decrease in squad communication.
Elimination of them lead the game to be more hardcore and "encourages players with excellent eyeballing/map reading/teamwork/etc skills".

In that sense, Squad marker makes my job as squad leader pretty dull. All I have to do is to press hotkey on my mouse, get squad marker in the middle of my screen and scream "Marker" in the comms. I engage something? Marker. SL, where to go? Marker. SL, where to spawn? Marker. SL, which track to take? Marker. I mark before, during and after engagement, I barely ever have to call direction, everyone from my squad will find the marker on their compass and determine relative direction better than I could ever do with words.
How is it in principle different from FTL rangefinding? Thinking of it, makes me want to play without this feature, but I know how effective it is, so while it's enabled, if you don't do it, you are in disadvantage.

Edited by paragonid

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In V12 the only reason people wanted a FT was to range their targets. AT and snipers got a fire team and then ran off on their own more or less. But that wasnt the intention with the fire teams. As a FTL you are supposed to lead your fire team.

For ranging there are several other ways to do it. Use the map for an estimation, Use the ranging equipment that many scopes and binoculars have for ex. And after a few hundred hours you get quite decent in judging distances. You dont need to be super accurate. +/- 50m is often enough.

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Posted (edited)

For full picture it's interesting to compare more similar features:

1. Squad marker (attack, observe, etc) + FTL marker
2. SL marker rangefinder + FTL marker rangefinder
3. Map contact marker + reinforce, resupply, etc markers

All of them increase effectiveness of operation and lead to decrease in squad communication.
Elimination of them lead the game to be more hardcore and "encourages players with excellent eyeballing/map reading/teamwork/etc skills".

In that sense, Squad marker makes my job as squad leader pretty dull. All I have to do is to press hotkey on my mouse, get squad marker in the middle of my screen and scream "Marker" in the comms. I engage something? Marker. SL, where to go? Marker. SL, where to spawn? Marker. SL, which track to take? Marker. I mark before, during and after engagement, I barely ever have to call direction, everyone from my squad will find the marker on their compass and determine relative direction better than I could ever do with words.
How is it in principle different from FTL rangefinding? Thinking of it, makes me want to play without this feature, but I know how effective it is, so while it's enabled, if you don't do it, you are in disadvantage.

Edited by paragonid

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i will always argue gameplay over reality but a skilled operator either way does not have magical instant ranging ability.

use the tools on the weapon and practise.

  1. it is better to lose to skill than to game features
  2. it is better to win using skill than using game features

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Posted (edited)

Remove the SL marker rangefinder too and only let a mortar operator show a rangefinder to the SL Mark.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Phoenixstorm

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OP definitley has a Point. Its another minigame for the SL.

I would prefer a map distance-tool like drawing a line, where everyone can decently can estimate ranges on the map.

 

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Optic/binoc range finder use could be used as the range finder anyways, not really too much need for a marker-based rangefinder.

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