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Buddy rally YES or NO ?  

57 members have voted

  1. 1. Buddy rally

    • Buddy rally YES?
      5
    • Buddy rally NO?
      45
    • I still need to think about it...
      7


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2 hours ago, SERGEANT ANDREWS said:

running 1500 meters across the map is very tactical... 

IF you end up running that distance is because somebody in your team (or several people) did a very por job.

 

1. Squad lead didn´t set/update rally

2. NO fob was placed or only one was place far from an area of interest.

3. All the vehicles even the transport trucks were wasted or abandoned.

4. No APC squad gives u a ride.

 

I could keep going. I don´t remember the last time I has to run that long. Maybe the servers were u play this kind of experience is common. BEcause it definitely isn´t normal.

 

In any case. Running 1500 mts is the consequence of POOT tactics...still tactics.

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18 hours ago, Nightingale87 said:

So if it didn´t really happen, we are talking about a "problematic" situation on terms of gameplay that wasn´t problematic at all. THat kinda says it all about that.

But it was still a meatgrinder? And my wider point is if the team was a little better coordinated and didn't end up mass spawning elsewhere, then it could have lasted all round. It often does!

 

18 hours ago, Nightingale87 said:

I didn´t suggest driving the vehicle in there. God no!

It´s about firepower. A vehicle can easily sit back (Specially South west in thas specific picture) and suppress the enemy hangar. Now the enemy aint looking out. You have achieved what is called FIRE SUPERIORITY.

 

And then your manouver elements (infantry) move closer to it. Frag , bla bla bla, and slowly swarm both entrances (and rooftop)

 

22 hours ago, Good-Try Greg said:

. The FOB's greatest defense is numbers, by setting up more FOBs the enemy will have an easier time overrunning and destroying them. Same applies to doing really deep flanking tactics with rallies, if it involves pulling 9 infantry out of the battle then it's a risk to the FOB. "What is our team doing!" cries the genius SL as FOB and cap are lost while he takes 1/5th of the team on a nature hike

The key Word is coordination.

Let´s say there are 4 SLs on squad channel. You talk it out. 3 squads are just going to hold the stalemate and fight PROBING ENEMIES DEFENSE, aka Putting pressure on one of the flanks of the enemy fob. While the other squad Not even the whole squad all u need is SL and 2 more men) sets up a fob on the other side of the pressure at around 400 mts from enemy. 

 

And that´s it, you have 2 fobs surrounding one of the enemy.

 

These aren't solutions to the HAB war, these are suggestions on how to fight in them better. No amount of coordination or flanking changes the fact that there is no way to battle the sheer rate of respawns without massive amounts of respawns yourself. The only way out is through. Even if one team is rolling the other in skill level, opposing HABs that maintain equal infantry strength are more likely to turn into just a one-sided slaughter than the the FOB war actually ending conclusively.

18 hours ago, Nightingale87 said:

Final Word. The difference between a First Person shooter and a TACTICAL shooter is exacly tactical challenges like this one. People need to find a way to overcome any situation put there by Clash of forces.

Absolutely not. The defining aspect of tactical shooters is that they don't have respawning at all! PR went a long way to ensure respawning into combat would not be possible under any circumstances. That's where squad needs to be.

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1 hour ago, Good-Try Greg said:

Absolutely not. The defining aspect of tactical shooters is that they don't have respawning at all! PR went a long way to ensure respawning into combat would not be possible under any circumstances. That's where squad needs to be.

I agree with the PR matter.

 

Not with tactical shooters not having respawns.

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After having SL'd a few games in v13, i find the buddy rally cool...

 

And by cool i mean it's basicly a cheat code if you're playing SL.

I've always been quite careful where i put my rallies and always go out of my way to put one down, if it gets taken down or just as a backup rally when we have a HAB, wich now leads to several squads falling back to my rally cuz they forget to put their own down and die.

 

People are now just teleporting to the next cap and it is now a valid tactic to shoot your own SL to put a buddy rally on the next cap.

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1 hour ago, oTec said:

People are now just teleporting to the next cap and it is now a valid tactic to shoot your own SL to put a buddy rally on the next cap.

On Saturday I was SLing (i rarely do) and it cross my mind to tpe respawn so half my squad could spawn in another squad´s rally because it was much more useful. ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE MAP.

 

It´s the opposite of the way squad was going. I´m optimistic they will take it down...in three weeks…:)

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I don't mind the walk speed but the sprint animation sounds way too fast.

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Posted (edited)

Due the buddy rally I observed changes in tactics most prominent the rush meta on normal AAS maps. On start of the round one team pushes with a normal truck forward sets a rally and a second team creates a buddy spawn on it. All without the whole hassle and time loss of setting up a FOB first and also without the risk of losing a radio and HAB.

 

This makes the game definitely faster and adds more action. As a conequence it adds a lot more pressure on the defenders especially with the removal of insta-death. This is very obvious on invasion maps.

 

My biggest dislike is that it removes a part of the co-planning tactics with other teams and it totally circumvents vehicle limitations on big maps.

Edited by Mauti

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I also dislike the buddy RP in its current state. 

The best way to solve this for me would be, to transform the buddy RP into the Commander RP, just as we had it in Project Reality. 

A RP that only the CO can place, where the whole Team could spawn. Requirement could be 2 SL and 2 Grunts.

 

This way it would require coordination between 2 Squads and the Commander. 

It would give the SL's a reason to cooperate with the CO and the CO would have something to do in his UAV down time. 

 

In parallel I would strongly suggest to rework the hole logistic system, witch is the hole reason the buddy RP was introduced. 

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20 minutes ago, Axel said:

I also dislike the buddy RP in its current state. 

The best way to solve this for me would be, to transform the buddy RP into the Commander RP, just as we had it in Project Reality. 

A RP that only the CO can place, where the whole Team could spawn. Requirement could be 2 SL and 2 Grunts.

 

This way it would require coordination between 2 Squads and the Commander. 

It would give the SL's a reason to cooperate with the CO and the CO would have something to do in his UAV down time. 

 

In parallel I would strongly suggest to rework the hole logistic system, witch is the hole reason the buddy RP was introduced. 

That's a pretty neat suggestion, +1.

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On 2019-05-06 at 1:41 AM, Good-Try Greg said:

 

These aren't solutions to the HAB war, these are suggestions on how to fight in them better. No amount of coordination or flanking changes the fact that there is no way to battle the sheer rate of respawns without massive amounts of respawns yourself. The only way out is through. Even if one team is rolling the other in skill level, opposing HABs that maintain equal infantry strength are more likely to turn into just a one-sided slaughter than the the FOB war actually ending conclusively.

 

I'd like them to test ammo-limited HAB respawns, where you use ammo on the FOB to spawn with your basic kit (2 mags, 2 bandages) and you can't spawn if there's not enough ammo. This would better simulate troop movement from main. Then remove rallies altogether and there's no more troop teleportation! Winning the round would require secure supply lines and methodical movement of troops and assets to the front. FOBs would actually act as bases of operations rather than teleport pads hidden in the woods. As it is now, unlimited troops teleport without sound and visual cues or risk of ambush, leading to gamey tactics (ninja FOBs and rallies, mass FOBing) that frankly feel silly in a milsim style game. With ammo-dependent spawning, ninja HABs would require noisy resupply, and mass FOBing would require mass transport operations. The focus of the game would shift from HAB wars to total map dominance. Patrols, ambushes and coordinated AAS would be the norm as opposed to successive meat grinders on or near the objective. Death would be more meaningful and battles more high-stakes. The downside would be requiring constant logi runs, though I expect they would become more interesting as logi ambushing would be encouraged.

 

That said the meatgrinder is still fun, and I have no qualms running tactic after tactic against the opposing FOB and its horde of insta-soldiers (just add slaughter!). I just think it would be cool to try something more realistic while still in beta.

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7 hours ago, pinko said:

 

I'd like them to test ammo-limited HAB respawns, where you use ammo on the FOB to spawn with your basic kit (2 mags, 2 bandages) and you can't spawn if there's not enough ammo. This would better simulate troop movement from main. Then remove rallies altogether and there's no more troop teleportation! Winning the round would require secure supply lines and methodical movement of troops and assets to the front. FOBs would actually act as bases of operations rather than teleport pads hidden in the woods. As it is now, unlimited troops teleport without sound and visual cues or risk of ambush, leading to gamey tactics (ninja FOBs and rallies, mass FOBing) that frankly feel silly in a milsim style game. With ammo-dependent spawning, ninja HABs would require noisy resupply, and mass FOBing would require mass transport operations. The focus of the game would shift from HAB wars to total map dominance. Patrols, ambushes and coordinated AAS would be the norm as opposed to successive meat grinders on or near the objective. Death would be more meaningful and battles more high-stakes. The downside would be requiring constant logi runs, though I expect they would become more interesting as logi ambushing would be encouraged.

 

That said the meatgrinder is still fun, and I have no qualms running tactic after tactic against the opposing FOB and its horde of insta-soldiers (just add slaughter!). I just think it would be cool to try something more realistic while still in beta.

+1

 

Even though you said the words "the meatgrinder is still fun"...Lol

 

Well worded.

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38 minutes ago, SERGEANT ANDREWS said:

the legitimacy of this poll is questionable 

How so? It seems to be representative of the general opinion of folks I've talked with. Buddy rally is gamey, exploitable, and a "solution" to a problem that didn't exist for competent SLs. Rally got wiped? Next time make sure there's a HAB up, and put your rally in a safer spot. Coordinate some transport. Defend the next objective. IMO the fix is to ensure transport options throughout the game on large maps, not to handhold squads who lose their only respawn point.

 

 

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1 hour ago, SERGEANT ANDREWS said:

the legitimacy of this poll is questionable 

why?

 

The one Owi is conducting is secret. This one is public and with public comments at least.

56 minutes ago, pinko said:

How so? It seems to be representative of the general opinion of folks I've talked with. Buddy rally is gamey, exploitable, and a "solution" to a problem that didn't exist for competent SLs. Rally got wiped? Next time make sure there's a HAB up, and put your rally in a safer spot. Coordinate some transport. Defend the next objective. IMO the fix is to ensure transport options throughout the game on large maps, not to handhold squads who lose their only respawn point.

 

 

+1

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