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RipGroove

Are the extremely slow vehicle turrets and weird movement intentional? (v12?)

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I use a low mouse sensitivity as a lot of gamers do to improve accuracy, so my hipfire mouse 360°/cm in Squad is a bout 45cm which means even with "Vehicle Sensitivity Multipliers" set to "2x" the turrets are extremely slow to rotate, to the point where I wouldn't be effective at all in a turret at any fast moving targets or switching between targets quickly. 

 

My mouse DPI is 1000 and my in game sensitivity is 0.15 so I tried setting a DPI of 8200 on my mouse DPI switch buttons for use just in turrets but even then the movement seems faster but there seems to be some sort of mouse acceleration/slowdown feature that just makes it all feel weird, is this intention for realism to stop people just quickly snapping to targets and owning everyone? If so I totally get that as it'll balance out vehicles and pretty much force them to sit back somewhere and take time to aim on targets, just wondering if I'm missing something? I don't want to be the only person sat there with slow turrets.

 

Admittedly I've been on a break from Squad for a while but I'm sure turrets didn't behave like this on v11. 

Edited by RipGroove

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Yeah, I learned that you can actually move the turret faster by slowing down your mouse movements. Seems odd, but it is what it is.

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On 11/18/2018 at 3:42 PM, Lipton (Easy) said:

Yeah, I learned that you can actually move the turret faster by slowing down your mouse movements. Seems odd, but it is what it is.

Something has changed for v12

 

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I believe its a simulation of that most turrets is operated by a human IRL controlling the turret through buttons or joystick which sends electrical inputs to servos/electrical/hydraulic engines that translates that input into movement. These engines may also be limited by a max speed which limits your turrets traverse speed. These engines may also lack the precision that a gamer would normally be used to by using a mouse for input.

Im sure that players with IRL experience of these vehicles IRL may agree with this statement, else feel free to correct me.

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On 22/11/2018 at 3:21 PM, Squad Fox said:

I believe its a simulation of that most turrets is operated by a human IRL controlling the turret through buttons or joystick which sends electrical inputs to servos/electrical/hydraulic engines that translates that input into movement. These engines may also be limited by a max speed which limits your turrets traverse speed. These engines may also lack the precision that a gamer would normally be used to by using a mouse for input.

Im sure that players with IRL experience of these vehicles IRL may agree with this statement, else feel free to correct me.

 

I think Squad Fox is right. It most definitely feels more mechanical now. Something you would expect in real life. I'd go as far and say apart from tank simulators, it's the closest I've seen to real turret movement in an FPS. This is coming from someone who has no experience with tanks though. It just feels right.

 

They've definitely added some kind of mouse deceleration mechanic to stop people twizzling the turret like it's some kind of toy! ha!

 

The only thing that bothers me a little  because of the deceleration mechanic and that is I'm having to lift my mouse of my mouse pad because I've run out of mouse pad! 

 

Could I suggest something that I think would be a nice addition to the mechanic? Why can't the gunner use his A+D keys to traverse the turret left and right? Whilst being used in conjunction with the mouse. It would only take over the mouse when being used. It would eliminate the running out of mouse pad problem whilst adding something quite unique. 

Edited by Quadro

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5 hours ago, Quadro said:

 

I think Squad Fox is right. It most definitely feels more mechanical now. Something you would expect in real life. I'd go as far and say apart from tank simulators, it's the closest I've seen to real turret movement in an FPS. This is coming from someone who has no experience with tanks though. It just feels right.

 

They've definitely added some kind of mouse deceleration mechanic to stop people twizzling the turret like it's some kind of toy! ha!

 

The only thing that bothers me a little  because of the deceleration mechanic and that is I'm having to lift my mouse of my mouse pad because I've run out of mouse pad! 

 

Could I suggest something that I think would be a nice addition to the mechanic? Why can't the gunner use his A+D keys to traverse the turret left and right? Whilst being used in conjunction with the mouse. It would only take over the mouse when being used. It would eliminate the running out of mouse pad problem whilst adding something quite unique. 

I have actually suggested this before. It is a great idea and also because it is more realistic. People don't use mice in combat vehicles obviously.

 

Having experience as a Leopard 2 gunner I can say that what they have now is not all that bad actually. It is actually somewhat easier to aim in real life, and part of the reason why is because when you turn the controller in the tank it keeps going at a very steady and precise speed, exactly as you want it, vs in this game you have to lift the mouse all the time totally killing the precision. A thing not existing IRL is the deceleration thing. It pretty much stops exactly when you let go of the controller. I mean, not as a mouse pointer maybe but definitely faster. The thing is that it is only the sights that are moving most of the time and they don't weigh a lot. Turret only moves when it has to. It weighs a lot! 

 

Then of course, this might not apply to all vehicles in the game but most likely the Abrams, as it is very similar to the Leopard 2.

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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Yes, please allow a combination of wasd+mouse controls for the turrets. Running out of mouse pad is really annoying.

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See these turret movements in this video that start at about 1min 29secs, I literally cannot do that that fast with my mouse DPI at 1000, my in game sensitivity at 0.15 and Vehicle Multiplier at 2x. To replicate the movements there in the video I'd have to lift my mouse a 100 times which is bananas and means I am ineffective in a turret. As a band aid for now I'm having to manually switch the DPI on my mouse to 5000 when I get in a turret and switch it back to 1000 again when I get out, this is not an ideal situation at all. I can only assume Karmakut is doing something similar in the video as watching his general mouse movements when moving as Infantry he also seems to use a somewhat slow mouse sensitivity like myself, unless of course I'm missing something?

 

 

On 11/23/2018 at 10:13 PM, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

I have actually suggested this before. It is a great idea and also because it is more realistic. People don't use mice in combat vehicles obviously.

 

Having experience as a Leopard 2 gunner I can say that what they have now is not all that bad actually. It is actually somewhat easier to aim in real life, and part of the reason why is because when you turn the controller in the tank it keeps going at a very steady and precise speed, exactly as you want it, vs in this game you have to lift the mouse all the time totally killing the precision. A thing not existing IRL is the deceleration thing. It pretty much stops exactly when you let go of the controller. I mean, not as a mouse pointer maybe but definitely faster. The thing is that it is only the sights that are moving most of the time and they don't weigh a lot. Turret only moves when it has to. It weighs a lot! 

 

Then of course, this might not apply to all vehicles in the game but most likely the Abrams, as it is very similar to the Leopard 2.

This could be a good idea for sure.

Edited by RipGroove

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On 11/22/2018 at 3:21 PM, Squad Fox said:

I believe its a simulation of that most turrets is operated by a human IRL controlling the turret through buttons or joystick which sends electrical inputs to servos/electrical/hydraulic engines that translates that input into movement. These engines may also be limited by a max speed which limits your turrets traverse speed. These engines may also lack the precision that a gamer would normally be used to by using a mouse for input.

Im sure that players with IRL experience of these vehicles IRL may agree with this statement, else feel free to correct me.

I believe you are right, strange thing is though, watching videos of v12 turrets, people seem to be able to move them much faster than I can?

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On 11/23/2018 at 10:13 PM, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

Having experience as a Leopard 2 gunner ..

..

The thing is that it is only the sights that are moving most of the time and they don't weigh a lot. Turret only moves when it has to. It weighs a lot! 

 

That

 

On 11/23/2018 at 4:22 PM, Quadro said:

Why can't the gunner use his A+D keys to traverse the turret left and right? Whilst being used in conjunction with the mouse. 

and this combined.

 

Make the turret move with keys but the sight/optics move faster and freely with the mouse. Hold space to swing turret to match optics, don't fire too early!. Clever gunner keeps turret in obvious direction or tracks it around to match the mouse. Hold space and move mouse to lock these together. 

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2 hours ago, suds said:

That

 

and this combined.

 

Make the turret move with keys but the sight/optics move faster and freely with the mouse. Hold space to swing turret to match optics, don't fire too early!. Clever gunner keeps turret in obvious direction or tracks it around to match the mouse. Hold space and move mouse to lock these together. 

 

It's a simple answer to a current simple turret mechanic. Whether the devs go down splitting optics from the gun is something else all together :D

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granted it will be different to Battlefield (!)

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3 hours ago, suds said:

That

 

and this combined.

 

Make the turret move with keys but the sight/optics move faster and freely with the mouse. Hold space to swing turret to match optics, don't fire too early!. Clever gunner keeps turret in obvious direction or tracks it around to match the mouse. Hold space and move mouse to lock these together. 

No it doesn't work that way for the gunner (for the commander periscope though). 

 

Instead sights are indeed facing forward but can tilt quite a bit still, overcoming the problem of initial  inertia. 

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ah ok, no worries. key press rotation does sound good tho. left hand of the gunner is a bit wasted as is.

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If the m1 abrams turret cant rotate at roughly 40 degrees  ( or 9 seconds for  a single 360  degree rotation ) per second it's under performing.

 

Russian tanks traditionally always had slower turret rotation speeds.  And t72b would be around 24 degrees per second if memory serves me right ( I will laterlook up a source  to double check and rectify this if I am in incorrect)

Edited by kev2go

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