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@Tartantyco

But the whole need of at least 2 others with the squadleader is to eliminate all the useless fobs that random one man squads would make to camp a certain location. This will most likely result in more people soloing logi to some obscure location be it on the edge or entirely away from the objectives. Through we might need to consider what is the actual gameplay we want, because you seem to be more for independence of the single player in the overall battle whilst most people here I would wager are more preferred to the forced teamwork setup where you can't really do anything alone.

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19 minutes ago, liamNL said:

Through we might need to consider what is the actual gameplay we want, because you seem to be more for independence of the single player in the overall battle whilst most people here I would wager are more preferred to the forced teamwork setup where you can't really do anything alone.

After arguing with @Tartantyco in another thread about nerfing RP's, I'm pretty sure that he's against overly independent SL's roaming freely doing their own thing. At least that's what he was saying:

 

Quote

They [RP's] completely disrupt the logistical framework of the game, they take away a team's ability to act and react to the decisions of the opposing team and to utilize the assets at their disposal in a pre-emptive manner, and allow squads to operate independently from the rest of the team.

Source: http://forums.joinsquad.com/topic/34096-i-think-nerfing-rally-points-is-a-bad-idea/?do=findComment&comment=337952

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@CptDirty

Yet if you give the squadleader the option to dig his own fob and make one on his own he need only the logistics truck to do the same thing. Sure it's more limited because there aren't 10 logistics trucks in the base but if they got their hands on one they can still do the same thing only more time is needed. Even more so as he doesn't even need other people to help him achieve the spawnpoint (rallypoint needs at least some people in the squad).

 

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@liamNL I know man I know....I was just pointing to some conflicting statements from him. 

 

If I may make a remark - As much as I'm confident in my abilities as SL to take a logi and place FOBS myself should his implementation take place in the game, I'm not blind to the fact that it's simply a bad idea from a game design and single-failure point perspectives.

 

At the end of the day  - you want back up with you in case shit hits the fan. Preferably medic. 

                                       - you want 2 other people that can take the wheel in case you die or disconnect as the driver.

                                       - and my favorite -> you want to be able to place down a RP for the rest of your squad. Which I do and it works beautifully! Sometimes!

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25 minutes ago, liamNL said:

But the whole need of at least 2 others with the squadleader is to eliminate all the useless fobs that random one man squads would make to camp a certain location. This will most likely result in more people soloing logi to some obscure location be it on the edge or entirely away from the objectives.

First of all, no it isn't and no it doesn't. It was put in place way back in ancient times when SLs could quite literally just drop a FOB and it would be spawnable, and it was implemented to stop extreme FOB spam. People are quite capable of building useless FOBs with any squad size, and are generally more prone to do so when they have a large squad.

 

Secondly, some lonewolf SL building pointless FOBs in pointless locations on the map is quite harmless compared to 9-man squads building "fire support" FOBs in exposed locations on the map, locking up precious manpower resources and telegraphing the FOB location. And why would someone be going around setting up a bunch of random FOBs in the middle of nowhere anyways? It's easy to dream up any kind of player behavior, but can you in any way substantiate the probability of that behavior actually happening? What is their aim in doing so?

 

It is currently completely possible for a squad leader to say "squad, we're just going to sit in main shooting at that bucket over there." That does not mean we need to take steps to ensure that possibility no longer exists because the likelihood of someone actually doing that is pretty damn slim. Neither is there anything stopping a solo SL from taking a truck and just driving around on the roads all match. Again, that doesn't happen. Because why would anyone want to do that? If you want to drive around the map, you can do that on the Shooting Range. If you want to build FOBs, you can do so with greater freedom in the Shooting Range. So nobody would actually do what you're suggesting here because it's completely pointless and nobody extracts any gameplay enjoyment from it.

 

What it would actually facilitate is dedicated logistics squads that can build and maintain FOBs and supply lines so that Infantry squad leaders like @CptDirty can focus on fighting the enemy team on the ground and not have to think about all of that stuff.

37 minutes ago, liamNL said:

Through we might need to consider what is the actual gameplay we want, because you seem to be more for independence of the single player in the overall battle whilst most people here I would wager are more preferred to the forced teamwork setup where you can't really do anything alone.

Then you will have missed the mark substantially. I am for higher inter-dependence. If Infantry squads on the ground need maintained FOBs and constant resupply to remain combat effective, then they need to rely on dedicated Logistics squads to provide that for them if they don't want to have to do everything themselves. I am not at all for the independence of the single player. I am for game mechanics that accomplish the objective of teamwork- and coordination-oriented gameplay that also provides dynamic, emergent, and variable gameplay.

1 hour ago, ScruffySwede said:

So you can have an IFV squad of 6 with 2 AT4s and 2 FN MAGs?

And then you end up with people choosing that squad not to use IFVs, but to get access to those kits. And then you have some squad types that aren't used because there are better squad types to chose from instead. And some of those unused squad types will have unique kits in them that are never used simply because the squad type is too weak compared to other alternatives. And then you have OWI who has to spend time and money trying to balance all these squad types. And in the end you just end up with three or so of ten squad types that are ever used, and gameplay just becomes repetitive as teams with the same squad compositions fight each other.

 

You think you want this, @ScruffySwede, but you don't.

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To be honest if what I'm getting out of it is supposedly wrong and not at all what you meant. Then either I am very bad at understanding it, or you explained it in a way that didn't hint at your actual meaning. Given that several people already in this thread are arguing against you and some of your contradicting statements I reckon it's the latter. Second of all you assume too much, you have a high tendency in this thread to assume what somebody would like or assume what somebody knows.

 

Third of all, if the infantry squads can make the fobs (which only needs men) then dedicated logistics squads can just stay in the truck and not even have to touch the fob. The only thing an infantry squad needs to make the fob operational is the supplies that the logistics squad provides, for which the logistics squad doesn't have to leave the truck and quickly resume its mission to get more supplies from the main.

 

And Fourth of all, you use a lot of buzzwords in your latest comment like improving dynamic, emergent, and varriable gameplay. Yet you mention game mechanics as the way to get these and are arguing against dedicated kit squads to improve the teamwork and coordination of heavy assets. And eventually the squad slots will be above 9, after which the numberpad communication keys won't be viable anymore to communicate with the new squad. Thus having a single squad for every asset as is now usually the case would need to be accompanied by a rework of how squad to squad communication works otherwise the all squad channel gets spammed to oblivion.

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I said it would be cool but Im not sure how to make it work in game.

 

So I suggested to keeping such squads to more experienced SLs. Would that work? I dont know.

 

The squad should include the crew as well to be honest. So you would limit the dedicated squad to a number of vehicles perhaps? Something along those lines? Making these squads rare and special... maybe?

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13 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

It was put in place way back in ancient times when SLs could quite literally just drop a FOB and it would be spawnable, and it was implemented to stop extreme FOB spam

Wait a minute I'm actually confused. What was? Your logistic suggestion? 

 

13 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

why would someone be going around setting up a bunch of random FOBs in the middle of nowhere anyways?

TOW FOBs. Think Kohat & Yeho on a hill.

 

edit - for single FOB in the middle of nowhere it's TOW FOBs as an example. For multiple FOBS in the middle of nowhere with no strategic importance to any territory or cap...well then that's stupid and the SL who did that should be fired! 

 

 

Edited by CptDirty

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20 minutes ago, CptDirty said:

Wait a minute I'm actually confused. What was? Your logistic suggestion? 

The three-man requirement to place a FOB.

21 minutes ago, CptDirty said:

TOW FOBs. Think Kohat & Yeho on a hill.

Those aren't useless FOBs.....

24 minutes ago, ScruffySwede said:

The squad should include the crew as well to be honest. So you would limit the dedicated squad to a number of vehicles perhaps? Something along those lines? Making these squads rare and special... maybe?

Limits upon limits upon limits until there's just this one small patch of functional gameplay left. Hello Post Scriptum, how are you doing over in the corner there? You don't look so good.

28 minutes ago, liamNL said:

and some of your contradicting statements

I have made no contradictory statements. 

33 minutes ago, liamNL said:

Third of all, if the infantry squads can make the fobs (which only needs men) then dedicated logistics squads can just stay in the truck and not even have to touch the fob. The only thing an infantry squad needs to make the fob operational is the supplies that the logistics squad provides, for which the logistics squad doesn't have to leave the truck and quickly resume its mission to get more supplies from the main.

Aaaaaaand do you feel that this is working in-game right now? Because I don't think so.

 

Here are the general problems I find:

 

1. Infantry squads are often not in locations where I want to get a FOB up.

2. Infantry squads are often too busy to even peel off two guys to huddle with SL for a FOB.

3. Infantry squads should ideally be able to focus on their primary function.

 

Classic case: Start of the game, either a smaller squad deals with backcaps or a squad drops of a guy on each before heading to the central flag. Both teams just throw everything they have at the central flag, one squad usually dropping a FOB on or near that flag. Most squads are now tied up in this location, and their SLs can't just peel off two guys and head to the rear to set up backup FOBs. Firstly, that manpower and leadership diversion might lose them the central flag. Secondly, the SLs are usually too busy to get around to that. Lastly, of course, the squads have their trusty RPs, so they don't need no stinkin' backup FOBs. And that's how you end up with the 1 FOB playstyle that is epidemic in both public and clan play.

 

Then there's support FOBs like Repair Stations and Supply Dumps, which are practically non-existent because if you can't persuade an SL to go 500m to the rear to drop a backup FOB, you're not going to get them to head over to the edge of the map to drop a Repair FOB.

50 minutes ago, liamNL said:

and are arguing against dedicated kit squads to improve the teamwork and coordination of heavy assets.

Well, I obviously don't believe that they will do that. I think the suggestions in this thread will complicate the game, reduce gameplay variability, and make the learning curve even steeper.

51 minutes ago, liamNL said:

And eventually the squad slots will be above 9, after which the numberpad communication keys won't be viable anymore to communicate with the new squad. Thus having a single squad for every asset as is now usually the case would need to be accompanied by a rework of how squad to squad communication works otherwise the all squad channel gets spammed to oblivion.

I agree. There are, however, many simple solutions to this(Such as using the Shift-key). I do think the communication system needs a rework regardless, though, as I find that everyone, myself included, make far too much use of the SL channel as opposed to direct SL-to-SL communication. I think some visual integration for SL and squad-to-squad comms should be implemented, with only the squad and local comms being simple keybinds. It's just too easy to press 'G' and go "Squad X, blablabla" instead of using the numpad.

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So the basis of your argument is that you like doing logistics and want to make fobs in locations you think are good instead of relying on infantry squads because they don't always cooperate. And you don't want to have a three man squad to make fobs as you see the ride alongs as uselessly sitting there doing nothing to just make a fob every now and then.

 

Also having one fob is a punishment in itself and over time should teach those teams that only having 1 fob which eventually gets overrun with the a12 mechanics will lose you the battle. However I have not seen a lack of people who want to play logistics trucker and thus it should be possible to make a dedicated fob squad of 3 men. And lastly, I see the setting up of a fob as an exercise in teamwork. The squadleader sets up a fob and if his squad follows him they help him set it up by digging the emplacements. Removing the restriction for minimum players needed would first of all make it a lonely job (which negates the multiplayer aspect as it is also a social experience) and open it up for the usual bunch of meta people sneaking fobs next to enemy main base to camp with AT or mines (I mean you already have a fob and possible hab shoveled, what's to stop you from deploying a tow next to their main base routes).

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No more limits than on various kits. I feel. Say you need 30 players before one dedicated unit unlocks. The SL who can unlock it needs experience ( gametime was suggested ). I mean, its not perfect, but not terrible either... right?

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I'm not against locking heavy assets till the server reaches a certain threshold the problem with that being when the server population goes bellow the threshold again. But I do not agree with the whole locking things behind playtime/rank/prestige/etc. Anything in the game just needs to be obtainable from the start and only need time to master it, doesn't need to be a long time but not some arbitrary 2 hours of doing this lock, but just time to master the thing or at least get better at it.

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Well, if the requirement is reached, you could gain access. If the requirement can no longer be reached, for whatever reason, the already deployed unit carries on as normal but can only respawn with standard squad kits.

 

Would that work you think?

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17 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

@Zylfrax791 The confusion stems from you misreading my statements to believe that I am arguing for or against restrictions or freedom of choice. That is a contradiction that does not exist.

 

What I am for is good game mechanics. What I am against is bad game mechanics.

 

Take the first quote from me. I'm not saying "remove all restrictions and everything will be great". I am speaking about very specific restrictions that are having a negative effect on gameplay. I am not advocating the removal of all restrictions, as is quite evident from the quote itself. You still need to be a Squad Leader.

 

It's quite simple: If you need three people next to you to place a FOB, then you need to have two people with you when you're driving around setting up FOBs. That means those two people have to sit around in a truck for 90% of the game, and spend the other 10% shoveling emplacements. That's what we call bad game design, and that's why I'm in favor of removing those specific restrictions. It does not mean I am in favor of removing all restrictions.

 

The second quote does not say that removing kit restrictions would create nothing but squads full of snipers, grenadiers, and machine gunners. Furthermore, it is a general statement about how changes to game mechanics alter player behavior, which is not contradictory to my first quote.

 

As I have already said, everything you guys are asking for in this thread already exists and is practiced in the game. You already see in-game Mortar squads, TOW squads, IFV squads, APC squads, Mech. Inf squads, different kinds of Infantry squads. All of this without any of the stuff you're all talking about wanting to see in the game. So ask yourselves: What is it exactly you're trying to achieve with your suggestions here that isn't already possible in-game?

So applying your same logic that unrestricted role selections would create an entire team of grenadier's, rocketeer's and machine gunner's then my counter argument would be that certainly your system would create an entire team of Uber SL's that could potentially be far more devastating and upset the entire balance of the match.

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40 minutes ago, Zylfrax791 said:

your same logic that unrestricted role selections would create an entire team of grenadier's, rocketeer's and machine gunner's

Read the post that you quoted one more time and try again.

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Wanted to drop in to letcha know we're reading along and appreciate the feedback. I'd also encourage folks to duck back to the original post and think about some of the other questions liamNL has posed, in addition to kit-locking -- I think they're ripe for more brianstorming.

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Well... if crew and squad can talk over the same channel, it becomes a more dynamic unit. Right? And if you want realism, then an IFV/APC should come with a squad; its the whole point of the vehicle after all. They are troop carriers, not mini-tanks. Their success relies on the ability to communicate and coordinate an assault with infantry. So somehow attaching a specialized squad to the IFVs and APCs would not only be realistic, but also pretty cool.

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From what I see in PS, a dedicated logi squad solves a lot of problems with FOBs/logi in Squad. Not saying that they have it perfect, but there are a few results that stand out against what I've seen in Squad over 1,000+ hours. 

 

Expectations - When there is a dedicated logi squad, they are expected to know what they are doing, so while sometimes the commander will make recommendations as to where they want FOBs, it's usually left up to the Logi SL. When you know every match has a dedicated Logi squad, and you want to play logi, you know you can join it, you don't have to create one, or join a halfassed one. Unlike Squad where even if one squad is named LOGI, since only the SL can drop statics, you end up with him and one or two people shoveling and one guy driving the truck, everyone else is off at the cap ramboing. In the PS, there's only 4 guys and they ALL can drop statics and shovel, they have two trucks and no one else can drive/steal them. When you join a logi squad, it's usually all other logi nerds, they all know good places for FOBs, how to place defenses to best optimize them etc. You don't end up with crappy FOBs in the wrong places, if fact, I'd say logi stuff is higher quality there. There are people like me who play logi  the majority of the time, I like to build stuff, but it also has roles other squads don't.

 

Mechanics - You can only drop 2 FOBs in Offensive (Invasion) as an attacker, and certain zones are off limits, we don't know how they will limit them in the upcoming AAS. You can drop supplies or build from the truck anywhere on the map, no need to place a FOB. You can put things where they make sense, not near where you can hide a fob, and emplacements and mortars don't telegraph that a FOB is nearby. While only the Logi SL can place a FOB, any other SL can drop statics and his guys can shovel, so it's completely possible for logi to just drop supplies and go if a Squad wants to build something themselves. 

 

It lets infantry fight, they don't have to worry about FOBs, sandbags and ammo crates. It makes being a SL easier in PS. WIth the new features in V12, like fireteams, being an effective SL is going to be even more complicated, taking logi stuff off of their plate seems like a good idea to me. 

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24 minutes ago, LugNut said:

From what I see in PS, a dedicated logi squad solves a lot of problems with FOBs/logi in Squad. Not saying that they have it perfect, but there are a few results that stand out against what I've seen in Squad over 1,000+ hours. 

The thing here is that it isn't the dedicated squad that makes it "work". It's the fact that they've just lumped all the logistics game mechanics onto that squad. It's the game mechanics, not the "This is the Logistics squad. It does logistics things".

 

I once again reiterate that dedicated squads are already a possibility in Squad. It's just that the game mechanics do not necessitate a dedicated Logistics squad. Here's the current situation in Squad v11(AAS):

 

Start of the game, people make squads, rush for the central flag(s), usually drop one FOB there, maybe drop a backup FOB, drop some more FOBs as they advance or get pushed back. Beyond that there's virtually no need for logistics. You don't need them to spawn, you spawn with a full kit on both FOBs and RPs, the game gives players more than enough ammunition to not run out during the average player lifespan, and pretty much everything else that consumes resources is basically useless. That's why there's no logistics squads. Not because there's no cookie-cutter squad type called "Logistics squad".

 

If the game simply makes logistics a necessity, you will see dedicated logistics squads pop up all over the place without needing to make fixed squad types that reduce gameplay and meta-game variability.

 

The biggest issue is the FOB itself. It's a ticket-asset, meaning that if you lose it, your team loses tickets. That instantly makes the deployment of almost anything that requires a FOB a bad investment. Many times, you may want to throw down some fortifications or an MG nest on a temporary position, but to do that you need to drop a FOB, as well. The presence of those emplacements also notify the enemy team that there is a FOB nearby. This means that if you leave that area, they are going to come by and take out that FOB if you don't tear it down. And if you get wiped off the position, which is more likely, you also lose that FOB and the associated tickets.

 

Next is the three man requirement to place a FOB. If you try to make a dedicated logistics squad in v11, you'll need two more people with you. The gameplay experience of those two people will be 90% sitting around in a truck, 10% shoveling. Nobody wants to do that. They don't have any agency, and they experience little to no actual gameplay. And they represent 5% of your team's manpower. If you try doing a solo Logistics squad, you are completely ineffective. You can try to get other squads to place FOBs or peel off two guys to go place a FOB with you, but it rarely ever happens. Other SLs are too busy doing their jobs, they almost always operate in active combat areas that are neither safe for FOBs or trucks, and usually too close to other FOBs for you to be able to place them. And every other SL is in just the same location fighting over the same flag, so they can't do anything either.

 

There's a host of other issues, such as RPs being too convenient, there not being any substantial resource sinks in the game, and so on, although some of this is addressed in the v12 update. And it's all of this stuff that makes dedicated logistics squads in Squad non-functional, not whether or not there is a fixed "Logistics" type squad.

 

The solution is very simple and spelled out in my Universal Logistical System thread:

 

1. Remove ticket cost for the FOB, turning the current radio into a logi truck-droppable Supply Dump instead.

2. Remove the 3-man requirement to place FOBs/Supply Dumps.

3. Introduce more resource sinks in the game(Somewhat addressed in v12).

4. Give the SL a shovel(Or introduce an Engineer/Engineer SL kit. Whatever).

 

Just with these small changes, that are implementable right now with almost no work(Ignoring the truck-droppable SD, just keep the radio and remove ticket cost and 3-player requirement), you will see dedicated Logistics squads in Squad straight away. If you absolutely need something to have a ticket cost, put it on the HAB.

 

These changes will allow a dedicated logistics squad to keep itself occupied building spawn FOBs around objectives, Repair FOBs near the front line, and provide supplies to squads at the front line. It will allow other squads to fortify temporary positions and make use of offensive emplacements without fear of losing tickets, further requiring logistical support. Build it and they will come.

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1 hour ago, Tartantyco said:

The thing here is that it isn't the dedicated squad that makes it "work". It's the fact that they've just lumped all the logistics game mechanics onto that squad. It's the game mechanics, not the "This is the Logistics squad. It does logistics things".

 

Both games have game mechanics that dictate how logi squads operate, one is more structured than the other. I play both, I see how the mechanics enable players to play, and how they choose to play. They're not identical games, but they share similar environments, similar player base, mechanics and game modes. Based on what I've seen in PS, I'd venture that a dedicated logi squad would be an improvement, it'd have to be bigger and tweaked a little, but I think it would be better than what is there now. 

 

Sure, dedicated logistics squads are a possibility in Squad, and you occasionally see them, they don't work very well for the most part IME outside of running mortars. Usually, it's bc the SL is fixated on building a stupidfob on a single point, not in doing what is best for the team. Or some dipshit grabs the logis, gets them wrecked or takes them for his pet project. The current mechanics in Squad make that more likely than in PS. If you are in that stupidfob guys squad, you either leave, or sigh and shovel whatever he's building, then watch it get overrun. In PS, you can leave him to it, and go do what needs doing since you too can build and supply and the logis are yours alone. The current Squad mechanics make it harder for good logi people to find and work together, the mechanics in PS make it easier, so I think there you get better logi support. While an open format like in squad where you have the freedom to turn any squad into a specialized squad is great in a clan type situation, it's not so great in a public one. A little structure like dedicated squads works better in a match with pubs. 

 

I like your overall system where fobs and such need supplying, and I agree, that if supply runs were necessary in Squad for spawns across the map, you'd see more people creating squads focused on logi runs, but they aren't that necessary, and outside of mortar fobs, and superfobs, logi and fob building is treated as just one more necessary task for SLs. Which doesn't make sense to me. 

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On 10/29/2018 at 7:16 AM, Tartantyco said:

Read the post that you quoted one more time and try again.

Simple question: Did you or did you not say that a SL should be equipped with a shovel and be able to drop FOB's without anyone else in proximity? Don't post none of your links to your previous War & Peace sized posts or make some answer laced with circular logic riddles just simply quote my post and answer yes or no. Got it? It's very simple.

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13 hours ago, LugNut said:

Based on what I've seen in PS, I'd venture that a dedicated logi squad would be an improvement, it'd have to be bigger and tweaked a little, but I think it would be better than what is there now. 

I think everything it would do is restrict the options available to players, make the gameplay more shallow, and reduce the lifespan of the game for absolutely no gain. 

13 hours ago, LugNut said:

Sure, dedicated logistics squads are a possibility in Squad, and you occasionally see them, they don't work very well for the most part IME outside of running mortars. Usually, it's bc the SL is fixated on building a stupidfob on a single point, not in doing what is best for the team. Or some dipshit grabs the logis, gets them wrecked or takes them for his pet project.

The reason that you don't see them used much outside of Mortar/TOW FOBs is precisely because of the reasons I previously stated. There's no need for supplies, a logistics squad requires more manpower to function than there is workload to go around, and the FOBs are too valuable ticket-wise for you to deploy them in any other fashion than for necessary spawn FOBs and backfield Mortar/TOW FOBs. There are plenty of other FOBs that I would like to deploy during a match, but I don't because it's either too difficult to get done due to current restrictions, and because the FOB is too costly in terms of tickets.

13 hours ago, LugNut said:

If you are in that stupidfob guys squad, you either leave, or sigh and shovel whatever he's building, then watch it get overrun. In PS, you can leave him to it, and go do what needs doing since you too can build and supply and the logis are yours alone.

Except you can do that in Squad, as well. If somebody's doing shit logistics, you can just set up your own Logistics squad and do Logistics yourself. It's not like people are hogging those assets as it is. There's nothing about the squad system that prohibits good logistics, it's all the other factors. And there's nothing prohibiting shit logistics players from taking the logistics squad slots in PS, either. As you say yourself here, the individual players can do logistics themselves, and that is all you need to introduce in Squad. Not restrictive squad types.

13 hours ago, LugNut said:

The current Squad mechanics make it harder for good logi people to find and work together

As a logistics-focused player, I would severely disagree with this. The problem is simply that FOBs require 3 players to place, but logistics does not, so to be an effective logistics squad you need two other players who are willing to be dead weight for most of the match. Players are standing by to start doing good logistics, but the game won't let them because of arbitrary restrictions that were outdated in v9. All the good logistics players don't do logistics precisely because it's not viable with the current game mechanics.

13 hours ago, LugNut said:

While an open format like in squad where you have the freedom to turn any squad into a specialized squad is great in a clan type situation, it's not so great in a public one.

I think you get the players you design the game for. If you design for the lowest common denominator, you'll get the lowest common denominator player and the lowest common denominator gameplay. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Both in PR and Squad I've had high-coordination teamwork in matches, so I don't believe this "public players can't do it" rhetoric for one second.

13 hours ago, LugNut said:

I like your overall system where fobs and such need supplying, and I agree, that if supply runs were necessary in Squad for spawns across the map, you'd see more people creating squads focused on logi runs, but they aren't that necessary, and outside of mortar fobs, and superfobs, logi and fob building is treated as just one more necessary task for SLs. Which doesn't make sense to me. 

Well, that is kind of what I've been talking about here... You need to make them more necessary so that there is constant need for logistical service, which means that a dedicated logistics squad has something to do, which means that you shift that responsibility away from squads that are focused on other things.

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38 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

Well, that is kind of what I've been talking about here... 

 

At least you're consistent, in all of the years I've seen you on the forums, I've never seen you like anyone's ideas except your own. ;)

 

I'm just contrasting what I see in Squad against what I see elsewhere, I don't expect it to make the slightest difference in the overall scheme of things.

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