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Ceceli

SQUAD - The more, the worse

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, v76 said:

Its the stupid cock block rush that fukcs this game and the devs are oblivious to it... they just add more shit without understanding the effect it has.

I thought the "cock block rush" had lost most of its effectiveness after they took bleeding out of the game and since you can cap the first flag with only one guy. Correct me if i´m wrong but rushing enemies first flag is much less effective than beofre and I see it less frequently than before.

 

3 hours ago, v76 said:

This game before vehicles and fobs was god damn amazing, everything mattered... now its just a 50/50 dice roll on the cock block tactic and if it fails for your team then you're fukced hence the steamroll.

Steamrolling has 2 aspects. Thea early steam roll, and the late steam roll.

 

The early steam roll happens because one team is obviously better coordinated and probably better at fighting (and knows the maps deeply) than the other team and the first ten minutes of the game is just a wipe-out. After that the domino keeps falling down. Because very immature players who dont like losing just quit the game or change sides. That hurts the losing team even more and prevents them from recovering. 

If people think the game is 50/50 in the first 10 minutes and all it matters is the middle flag and once you lose it or u win it then it´s done....gg. The thing is that since bleeding is out, that´s not the case. You lost the middle flag, no problem,...you can take it back...that´s the game. Your team still has time and tickets to come back. it´s a bit uphill...it´s a challenge...no problem...it´s a game.

 

The late steamroll happens when one team is winning, and SLs are over confident, poorly coordinated, and no one wants to defend, and even before completely securing a flag, you have 2/3 squads with an attack fob ready to take the next one, and sometimes it happens, but when u overestimate the other team, and assume they were dead, they suddenly counter attack the first flag, take it before it gets double-neutral, and get ready to attack the next one. Upon this situation, only more mature sls realize that they are about to get steam rolled and that it´s time to build a defensive fob and fall back even further. But...as we said before….we are talking about a poorly coordinated team with "only attack" sls, no responsible team leaders, and they fall back only to realice they are too late and now they are 2 flags away from the capable flag.

 

In conclusion, the way I see it, steamrolling has different causes, but i don´t think "cock block rush" is one of them, at least not the main cause.

Edited by Nightingale87

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10 hours ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:

Romby: I have 2 accounts, because I ever lost my password and email.
After it has been found, I sometimes mix it up.


But I stay with it, it's a game and it has to stay nice.
Kick does not belong there, without reason and completely crazy, that's when you're kicked,
 an ADMIN says, join a group or you will be kicked..
How crazy can it be :S

 

 

The most popular servers are popular because they try to enforce teamwork. If you are not in a Squad you either didn't join one because you didn't want to work with other people or you got kicked because SL didn't think you worked with him. So find different servers if you dont want to be kicked. Server admins and SLs can pretty much kick whoever they like.

 

So you are ok with me making a Squad and 6 people join who just wants kits and dont have mics and i can do nothing??? Because if you want this you will see no SLs in a week.

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Nonsense.

You do not listen to what I say.

You make a reason for it again.
I also see far too many angry players who have kicked for NO reason or after 5 seconds if they have joined a group.

In this case it does not make sense to contradict, because these are important facts.
You pretend that all SL are normal.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, v76 said:

Its the stupid cock block rush that fukcs this game and the devs are oblivious to it... they just add more shit without understanding the effect it has.

 

This game before vehicles and fobs was god damn amazing, everything mattered... now its just a 50/50 dice roll on the cock block tactic and if it fails for your team then you're fukced hence the steamroll.

 

But OWI will just add more shit without understanding or caring how it effects gameplay... why!? cause the kids demand clutter in the form of content.... graphics and content seems to be the only concern, gameplay and mechanics be damned.

Its simple,if you are blocked that means you want to cock block the other team as well and your forces are spread too thin.

There is a simple solution for that if the whole teams goes back or starts to cap flag by flag if you are any good there is nothing to block you if your team sucks then you would be blocked in your main base.

Cock blocking as you call it has nothing bad doing to the gamplay.Even the older system where you could easily block the enemy was good for me i did not mind or wanted the change.

Edited by Bahrein

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Its bad enough now when a SL leaves, the role is bounced around until the squad drifts away as no one wants to take over a squad performing badly enough to make the original SL rage quit. 

If voting a SL off was ever brought in who would take over the role? the one you started the vote? I think not, as he/she will be the moaning bast4rd who can always find things wrong with others but has no idea of how to do anything themselves.

 

I will SL if no one else will do it, but its not my favorite role (too stressful dealing with idiots who don't listen) give it a try, you will then be more willing to accept the failings of other who try.

14 hours ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:

an ADMIN says, join a group or you will be kicked..
How crazy can it be

simple.....Its their server, paid for with their OWN money, follow the rules or leave. What's the point of taking a spot on a server someone else could who would be in game could have.

 

Think of kicking as being told off by teacher, you probably couldn't cope with that as a kid either

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5 minutes ago, scoobi said:

.Its their server, paid for with their OWN money, follow the rules or leave.

They also have rules to follow...

 

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On 10/1/2018 at 3:40 AM, MultiSquid said:

...the SL made the squad and it's his to do with as he pleases, that is a prerogative he gained by becoming one of the very few people willing to step up and lead others. By giving regular grunts any power over him you completely reverse the power balance in squad and strip SLs of their authority. "Lead us how we want or we'll kick you out of your own squad" - doesn't that sound just wrong? Again, nobody is making you stay in a bad squad, if you are choosing to stay solely because you want to retain your kit or you don't want to lead then be prepared to listen to commands, because as a grunt that's what you're there for after all. Setting kits aside for a moment we have three roles you can play in Squad: either you're a leader, a follower or you're soon to be kicked.

 

On 10/1/2018 at 5:30 AM, MultiSquid said:

That's a completely unrelated issue. Kits are limited in order to retain at least a semblance of realistic squad composition. If you give players free reign over the kit selection you'll end up with entire squads composed of LATs, grenadiers or marksmen, completely destroying the balance and turning it into just another FPS game. For instance I can still remember times when we used to have 2 (two) grenadiers allowed per squad and the game was already close to unplayable with the amount of grenades flying around, I can't even begin to imagine how it would look like if you had squads full of grenadiers. Sure, it might be fun for a time, but it's not what you'd call a tactical shooter.

 

Kits are limited because they are powerful. Players rather screwing their team than losing their kits is a player problem. Two different things.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

If anyone's got half an hour to spare, this guy made a video covering a much wider problem with player mentality in the recent years, not only concerning BF5. I can't say I completely agree with him, but he makes some interesting points. I especially like how he refers to the "cult of the loadout" in modern FPS games.

 

 

 

 

So on one hand you establish that the SL made the squad and its to do with as he pleases and yet on the other hand in your second statement you marginalize that same SL and say that he/she isn't capable of choosing the roles for his/her squad...

 

Which paradigm is it? We treat everyone like children and nanny them along and continue to kill off the community even more or we treat players like adults and let them make smart choices on their own and actually grow the community?

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19 minutes ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:
You still miss a piece of text.
I notice that people do not read: Scoobi
 
When you're kick bij SL, an ADMIN says, join a group or you will be kicked..
So 2x kick.
Fun fun fun

In most of the servers I play on (UK/EU) it takes some time for an admin to request that you join a server at the beginning of a game, this gives sufficient time to join a squad unless you are particularly fussy (IE want that one [marksman] kit) and I have never been in the situation where that they have needed to ask me to join a squad mid game. If I have been kicked from a  squad mid game, its either for a friend of SL to join, this can piss me off a bit if its going well but its his squad and he will be worse off because i'm not in it, his mate is probably a w4anker anyway :) I'll find another squad or create one. If SL is kicking for mates its 'that' kind of match so my squad will quickly fill up.

Or I'll get kicked for not doing as requested by SL,  I only do this when there is no co ordination in the squad and whilst the SL is giving incomprehensible orders and everyone is farting around. If there are no other squads I'll go make a brew and shop for some MTB kit.

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@Super Sniper If you think, that SL should be punished for kicking someone who does not fit in their sqd, and with statements like " An SL often has no view of the situation " and "loosing rifle" I dont think this game is for you.

 

I might be out of line, but with a name like Super sniper and you getting mad because you lost your rifle(read marksman), then you really havent gotten the point of squad.

 

Solutions:

 

1. You join a sqd, and dont like the SL...LEAVE.

2. If the SL doesn does not have the correct view of the situation, it means you havent communicated well enough

3. There are no other sqds to join, make one and run it like you think it should be done although, if no one stays, you're probably doing it wrong.

4. In real life, Rambo usualy dies.

5. If no one wants to take over SL seat, disband it when you get it, a dysfunctional sqd is useless.

6. If you cant find a working sqd, If you dont want to lead, If you dont like "whatever" Leave server. eventual...the game. You dont need to play Squad to      

    be able to live

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I think that's a little harsh and extreme. They have already said they will be looking at the randomisation and other modes to counter this issue, as well as other mechanisms.

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12 minutes ago, Jevski said:

 

Jevski does not take the game seriously and the answers do not make sense.
I have 2000 hours of playing time and mention facts here, which many players have problems with.
Contradicting does not make any sense.

That is also the reason for the many verbal abuse
I see enough verbal abuse in the chat because people are angry.
I think about the game and the future.
I do my thing, do not worry, because I usually get the most points.

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1 minute ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:

because I usually get the most points.

Hmm.

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And i have 411720 hours of experience of real life. Your point?

 

If the 6 points I made does not make sense to you, which are pretty simple, then a discussion here is pointless

28 minutes ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:

I usually get the most points

 

I think i will stand by my statement, that Squad isnt the game for you

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8 minutes ago, Jevski said:

And i have 411720 hours of experience of real life.

Noob. Git gud.

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Yet you are kicked from squads, and the problem is everyone else from your point of view.

 

Im gonna leave this discussion now, its pointless, since you don't understand my answers

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Worth pointing out that the vast majority oif players, I believe, understand that points can be an idnicator of good play, but are far from a perfect reflection of this. It is possible to have a good score without doing anything particularly good or decisive, and it is also possible to have an incredibly important role to the team whilst having very low scores.

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30 minutes ago, Erdogan GoatDictator said:

If you have many points, you understand the game ..
Very simple :-)

Not true at all.

 

You can be a squad member sitting on a defense cap (orchard) and walk away from your computer letting your character collect defense points for doing absolutely nothing. 

 

You can be conducting logi runs to a FOB closest to main that isn't relevant anymore to your team (therefor safe to drive to/back) just to artificially boost your end of game score. Meanwhile the rest of the players on the servers are fighting on the opposite side of the map. 

 

And finally, you can be the SL of the squad that sets up FOBs/HABs in advance of the team and ensure the continuity of momentum OF your team and end up with 0 kills, 0 deaths, low score. Those are the people that deserve recognition on a scoreboard to show true contribution. 

 

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Posted (edited)
Quote

Most squad leaders will throw you out.
But many leaders are assholes and stupid ones.
I often do my own thing because I have a good insight. I
am 44 years old and a lot of experience.
There are many players who are the same and score a lot of points.
If leaders are kicken then they are usually shot dead by the kicked person.
That's often funny and the SL goes offline. He is punished himself by his stupid behavior.
It should be forbidden that SL can kick someone!

 

Quote

""Most of the time if a SL is TK'd by a guy he kicked the rest of the squad will TK the douchebag and report him to an admin.""

 

I already shot a lot of SL and never got a ban.
You have to do it smartly :-)

Not so nice to walk 10 miles and kick
Kick without reason is dead, many players do that and me too.
That's also the only way to teach them a lesson in the future.

Quote

Your opinion is not important.

 

Above quotes by Super Sniper/Dictator from this thread.



I think what ever argument, no matter how well formulated are useless in regards to this player. But then again, most of us see what kind of player he is, by reading the above quotes and are wise enough not to go down that rabbit hole.

Edited by Jevski

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On 02/10/2018 at 2:49 PM, Erdogan GoatDictator said:
You still miss a piece of text.
I notice that people do not read: Scoobi
 
When you're kick bij SL, an ADMIN says, join a group or you will be kicked..
So 2x kick.
Fun fun fun

so create a squad its simple.. you seem to moan about things that can be resolved quite easily, it must happen a lot for you to want to post about it in the forums, and with an attitude that basically says that your all wrong and Im right and no point answering me I can take a rough guess at why you get kicked from squads ... and if your getting kicked by clan squads then dont join clan squads... most of the time they want to play together quite rightly and will usually kick the last person that joined or the most annoying... Im guessing you join squads quite quickly.

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Well, it seems that my post was brought up back to life. Thanks for participating, guys. I had 2 and a half pages of good content and good communication to read. Except for the last page where some of you kept fighting amonst yourselves about petty things that has nothing to do with the post itself.

I'd reply to the many good comments, but I would end up wrinting a whole page to do that :P

Nonetheless, it is good to be understood, even though some might have different views, at least we know we are in the same page. There is indeed something going on with the dynamic related to how players are behaving on the battlefield.

 

But I gotta say... Way back in this post someone posted that in the Kickstarter page it was written that this game was all about intelligent and satisfying gameplay. OMG! I laughed so hard when I read it. That is so contrary to what we've been experiencing. And a lot of companies these days are doing everything they can to stay relevant and make ends meet because it seems that today's games take more effot to develop and mantain then the games of the past. Of course - and sadly - OWI is no different. They're gonna dumb down the game a little bit so more people can join and increase revenue. But... I still remain hopeful because of what I see on V12 (amazing!) and the suggestions that clan reps send on the feedback Discord channel. We have some pretty good people sending good and useful suggestions to the devs, which, by the way, the devs themselves created that feedback channel - a thing I have never seen before. Kudos for that! We appreciate it.

 

And, sure, I've gotta take into consideration that I might - am - biased. I like hardcore. Anything hardcore, I'm in. And if it were up to me, this game woud have things like Softcore Shaming and it would constitute of showing in the end game screen how many soldiers gave up instantly without waiting for medics and other statistics. This would bring upon those people the wrath and shaming of the whole community. There would way less pointing fingers coming from people that are the ones to blame because names would be named. Tickets matter and not only random players but SLs themselves should give orders while being mindfull of tickets and how to best perfom given the current situation of the battle, instead of just say "hey, let's go there and shoot people" and then get slaughtered by organized fire teams with combined arms, suppressive and flanking maneuvers.

Edited by Ceceli

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I kinda feel like I need to join a clan, like a good clan. The one I was in years ago didn't take into account my work and family life takes priority. So many clans seem to want a commitment to at least one night a week (and most of the week at that) but like, I'm a cop. I don't got that time all the time. Most of it is working, then family, the house, and if I have more time, video games are nice avenue of escape. 

 

But I say I think I should join a clan because, most of the time I'm getting kicked in a lot of the better servers that the clans are organizing and forcing teamwork. whether it's because the squad leader is deeming me not filling my position adequately enough, he needs a spot for his buddy, or the squad leader is giving me crappy orders to go die with a few of my squad mates I have generally ended up being kicked from a squad, then the admin gets on me and warns me I am gonna get kicked from the server. 

 

It's a lot of unnecessary stuff that makes me rethink trying to join another serve, am I going to receive that same experience? 

 

I think it was better in highschool when I had a ton of time on my hands playing project reality since gameplay and objectives are pretty similar, but I find the more I play with experienced players the less I enjoy it because of shaming and being rude to people. 

 

My best experiences have been with an experienced guy who was just fine that pretty much everybody was new or "casual" and we just had some fun going around as a squad. We won some and lost some. Kinda like playing with Lugnut if anybody has ever done that, I used to quite a while ago. 

 

I think it's fine to have a lot of newer players. I rather prefer to play with a bunch of people that are just there to play, tactics being secondary, than those who will not move from their iron hand of doing it their way in their time. 

 

There is a lot of toxic behavior from "veteran" squad players who've been around or at least played for a while. I really try to avoid them. I mostly avoid squad now because of that but I will get on every once in a while when a new update drops. 

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@Pmikey I totally get that some 'SQUAD vets' can ben toxic. But despite that, I have never been kicked out of the squad because I always do something called following orders. If you follow orders or communicate to the SL why that order can't be followed under the circumstances, everything will be fine. And in the eventuality of being kicked, you can just join other squads or even create your own. That is a non-issue and your problem is unrelated to the topic.

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