Jump to content
embecmom

New Revive ability

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, Gnarleus said:

Do those that find medic boring because lack of optic feel the same way when playing irregular militia or insurgent and using the iron sight? I would assume your answer might be yes. If that is the case one could argue that these factions are't usually seen with optics (in real life), but I think that could be up for debate. What about medics on irregular and insurgent do they get optics as well?

 

To me where I see this discussion sort of heading to is, there are a lot of players who find not having some sort of optic boring. So is the problem really about just the medic? Or is it about all classes that have iron sights?  

I personally find playing the medic boring as hell as the class has no special abilities that make it interesting. On the other hand, if you just mostly ignore downed players and focus on being a shooter then you end up being kind of an Uber Rifleman because you can fully heal yourself up.

 

That said, this is yet another problem with a game that randomly picks and chooses realistic and complete science fiction elements and trys to blend them into a hybrid.

 

If Squad was a realistic MilSim game medics would become imperatively important as there wouldn't be these arcade style magic "rally points & Habs" and instead you'd be driving back to the front as a replacement in a transport truck if you died.

 

Logically, within the paradigm of the arcade style rally point/hab then the medic should have some equally arcadey skill that dovetails with it or otherwise it's just a Rifleman that can heal himself because people are giving up left and right as their only percieved downside is a tiny cool down.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
49 minutes ago, Zylfrax791 said:

I personally find playing the medic boring as hell as the class has no special abilities that make it interesting. On the other hand, if you just mostly ignore downed players and focus on being a shooter then you end up being kind of an Uber Rifleman because you can fully heal yourself up.

 

That said, this is yet another problem with a game that randomly picks and chooses realistic and complete science fiction elements and trys to blend them into a hybrid.

 

If Squad was a realistic MilSim game medics would become imperatively important as there wouldn't be these arcade style magic "rally points & Habs" and instead you'd be driving back to the front as a replacement in a transport truck if you died.

 

Logically, within the paradigm of the arcade style rally point/hab then the medic should have some equally arcadey skill that dovetails with it or otherwise it's just a Rifleman that can heal himself because people are giving up left and right as their only percieved downside is a tiny cool down.

 

 

Would you say that being able to fully heal yourself up is not a special ability? I feel like it is, I also happen to think that that element makes the medic one of the strongest classes in the game. 

 

Do you also feel bored when playing insurgent and irregular militia with iron sights? 

 

The other downside you didn't mention for giving up is loosing a ticket and revive insures that the ticket is not lost which is also a very unique and strong aspect of the medic.

Edited by Gnarleus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Gnarleus said:

Would you say that being able to fully heal yourself up is not a special ability? I feel like it is, I also happen to think that that element makes the medic one of the strongest classes in the game. 

Within the context of my previous comments in this and other threads where I've observed that the current meta of entire clan teams playing without any medics to maximize their offensive capability yes I do feel like the medic doesn't really add to force projection with special abilities.

Quote

 

Do you also feel bored when playing insurgent and irregular militia with iron sights? 

Not at all. The AK and SKS are very good for short to medium shots and transition to ADS quicker, smoother and with more peripheral vision than the weapons with optics.

Quote

 

The other downside you didn't mention for giving up is loosing a ticket and revive insures that the ticket is not lost which is also a very unique and strong aspect of the medic.

At this point competitive folks don't care about dying and losing tickets when they offset it by blitzing flags and steamrolling people that are out of position and fiddling around healing each other...

 

For what it's worth these aren't my strategies and tactics, I'm just telling you what I've observed.

Edited by Zylfrax791

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
13 minutes ago, Zylfrax791 said:

Within the context of my previous comments in this and other threads where I've observed that the current meta of entire clan teams playing without any medics to maximize their offensive capability

kits are limited in such a way that this literally isn't possible as a strategy

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Good-Try Greg said:

kits are limited in such a way that this literally isn't possible as a strategy

 

yes it is happens all the time, the kits are based ont he no. of people in the squad not the class they take, what happens is that one person will take a medic role and then immediately switch out when there are enough people in the squad to take the role they want because they dont believe the medic an important role or dont want to babysit and run after bandaging people..  

 

Adding an optic to the medic role helps in firefights but doesnt make the medic'ing (is that a word?) part of it important.  Like the nades being added its more to make it attractive to offensive style gameplay rather than what the role is supposed to be doing.  So my argument as alwys is to make the Medical part of the role important that people need to have that medic in the squad because xyz doesnt happen or spawn times longer or blah blah... 

 

Id change the rally to a field hospital where you have a choice to make your way back to it to heal  (or dragged back by a medic) and get bandages or you now wait to spawn in on the new spawn mechanic.  So the field hospital can only be placed by the SL and built by medic or you have to spawn at a fob or back at main... Give the medic supplies to drop more bandages for players, these sorts of things ... giving up is to easy in squad and its TDM mentality... give medic some loooooove!

 

I would even go as far to say, (please forgive me).. that instead of rallies an MSP (like Post scriptum but only useful) that is actually a hospital and ammo supply truck so you can get limited ammo/limited medical supplies and can heal at it when wounded however it requires a medic to build the hospital and grunts to build the ammo supply it just doesnt happen off the back of the truck plus it acts a s the spawn but needs to go back to supply area to re supply if you want more bandages or ammo but can still act as a field hospital and squad specific so no one else can drive off with it.

Edited by embecmom

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A full squad can fill all limited kits with 2 medics, and that includes the scoped riflemen limited kits. You'd have to trade a medic for a basic rifleman to end up with a medic deficit. That's not an upgrade over the medic kit, so the strategy makes no sense.

 

Even with two crewmen in the squad it's not hard to shuffle the roles to get at least one medic without losing all your force multiplier roles. The medic is a force multiplier too because they can heal, revive, etc in addition to being a decent combat role.

Edited by Good-Try Greg

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Locke said:

I think, give the medic a binocular and make them to your fireteam leader. 

They used to have binos, and would often act like that. Binos for the medic were great, since it made the medic valuable as a spotter and increased their usefulness if they hung back, where they should be anyway. 

 

I often see experienced players, and experienced squads ignoring the medic role these days unless absolutely needed. To get the SL up for example. Otherwise, they're just another rifleman and aggressively pushing caps. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, LugNut said:

They used to have binos, and would often act like that. Binos for the medic were great, since it made the medic valuable as a spotter and increased their usefulness if they hung back, where they should be anyway.

I, too, would like to see Medic become useful in other ways rather than blur medic-features among the squad.

 

Binoculars for medic would be great.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, Good-Try Greg said:

You'd have to trade a medic for a basic rifleman to end up with a medic deficit. That's not an upgrade over the medic kit, so the strategy makes no sense.

Its not about the comparison between a Rifleman and Medic from the aspect of their attributes. I guess the part of the no medic clan meta you're not fully understanding is the fact that on average from an offensive perspective you have what amounts to an entire nother squad of shooter's working off of rallies, quickly pushing the flag, killing instead of healing and then overwhelming the flag with numbers.

 

It's a gamble that can backfire however, more often than not it results in a quick steamroll. People with lots of time on their hands figure this stuff out in their training servers so maybe if I'm still deficient in explaining how it works you could enquire with them. I just know it works.

 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Still somewhat skeptical if this is a change for the better, or why they felt the need to make it possible for none-medics to bring back someone up in a state where they can shoot back. Sure they might have low stamina, but in any situation that isn't 300m out, that is completely irrelevant and you will be just as effective as if you did have stamina due to how accurate weapons and aiming is in squad. This is even more so for those with the ability to stabilize their weapon.

 

Will have to play with it to really see how it plays out, but as someone mentioned before, I can see this making attacks pretty annoying and almost nullifying the HAB overrun as now any smuck can get someone up in a effective shooting state for CQC and also having an almost continuous state of bodies on a cap when they shouldn't.

 

Anyone could already stabilize another player with their bandage to a point that they don't bleed out or they would give up themselves, only then needing the medic to come and get them up. I really don't see the need to change this.

Edited by Chompster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 7/13/2018 at 11:39 PM, Zylfrax791 said:

Within the context of my previous comments in this and other threads where I've observed that the current meta of entire clan teams playing without any medics to maximize their offensive capability yes I do feel like the medic doesn't really add to force projection with special abilities.

 

On 7/13/2018 at 11:39 PM, Zylfrax791 said:

At this point competitive folks don't care about dying and losing tickets when they offset it by blitzing flags and steamrolling people that are out of position and fiddling around healing each other...

 

For what it's worth these aren't my strategies and tactics, I'm just telling you what I've observed.

 

14 hours ago, Zylfrax791 said:

Its not about the comparison between a Rifleman and Medic from the aspect of their attributes. I guess the part of the no medic clan meta you're not fully understanding is the fact that on average from an offensive perspective you have what amounts to an entire nother squad of shooter's working off of rallies, quickly pushing the flag, killing instead of healing and then overwhelming the flag with numbers.

 

It's a gamble that can backfire however, more often than not it results in a quick steamroll. People with lots of time on their hands figure this stuff out in their training servers so maybe if I'm still deficient in explaining how it works you could enquire with them. I just know it works.

Sure that is one opinion as the meta is concerned and is 1 strategy used at only specific times during a match. But you could approach that same tactic with medics that focus on rushing and shooting with the ability to heal themselves and one could argue that you could be just as effective if not more effective at accomplishing the same thing. I have used a medic in this way and killed many players because all you do is trade a few shots, bandage up and heal to full life and you have a higher potential to kill the next guy. Fighting enemy players who are potentially wounded ESPECIALLY if they are using the same strat as you are talking about.. would give the medic a significant advantage (purely speaking in the context of the "meta" you presented). There are many ways to skin a cat.

 

Over the course of an entire match being able to save tickets surly would have an impact as I've seen matches where teams use the strategy you speak about, they control all the flags but one of them and still loose because the other team turtles and used their medics effectively to survive on the last flag. I don't think your example is evidence that a basic rifleman is more effective than a medic, or that the medic isn't impactful in its current stat, I think your example just proves that there are multiple strategies to playing the game which is a good thing. 

Edited by Gnarleus

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, Gnarleus said:

 

 

Sure that is one opinion as the meta is concerned and is 1 strategy used at only specific times during a match. But you could approach that same tactic with medics that focus on rushing and shooting with the ability to heal themselves and one could argue that you could be just as effective if not more effective at accomplishing the same thing. I have used a medic in this way and killed many players because all you do is trade a few shots, bandage up and heal to full life and you have a higher potential to kill the next guy. Fighting enemy players who are potentially wounded ESPECIALLY if they are using the same strat as you are talking about.. would give the medic a significant advantage (purely speaking in the context of the "meta" you presented). There are many ways to skin a cat.

 

Over the course of an entire match being able to save tickets surly would have an impact as I've seen matches where teams use the strategy you speak about, they control all the flags but one of them and still loose because the other team turtles and used their medics effectively to survive on the last flag. I don't think your example is evidence that a basic rifleman is more effective than a medic, or that the medic isn't impactful in its current stat, I think your example just proves that there are multiple strategies to playing the game which is a good thing. 

We couldn't agree more actually. I always like Medics in my squads. I'm just pointing out the cheesing I'm observing is all. Personally I think Medics should be an integral part of any objective based FPS.

 

That said, based on the upcoming change I think the Medic now needs some special abilities to keep them relevant. Taking away the exclusivity of the revive capacity of a Medic seems like a big deal to me.

 

I'm sorry to keep going back to John Carmack but in ET:QW if you had the full complement of Medics on your team the entire team was tougher and took less damage. Plus the Medic could also drop medical kits that you could pick up and use to bring yourself back to full health and could also have the same supply crate as Squad with ammo and medical supplies air dropped in with a green smoke grenade.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 14.7.2018 at 11:02 PM, wingman9 said:

I, too, would like to see Medic become useful in other ways rather than blur medic-features among the squad.

 

Binoculars for medic would be great.

They had binos some version before (somewhere aroud v3 or v4)  and they got rid of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I still think it's a good idea. can you tell how many times have medics ignored your body before because they were new or they were too busy with other things? This is a good thing, the player next to you will sacrifice one of his bandages for you, so you can get up and fight with him, so I still think some players won't revive you because they want those bandages for themselves. Also, it still takes a long time for regular units to revive teammates, and those teammates can't be effective unless a medic patches them up. The medic still has the same role, he still is the guy that revives people and give them health, they are still doing the same thing for the team and are a great asset, they just can't be replaced by this, the game isn't ruined, guys.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I also think it can be good actually. But only given that the revived soldier is in such a bad shape that he will just barely be able to go back to the medic for healing. He should not be able to participate effectively in the fight almost at all until medic has done his job. Maybe screen can be as dimmed as it already is, only he can walk/crawl? 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×