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Why have we not had anti-personnel mines in game? 

 

it's quite easy to create this asset, but that would change the gameplay for the better. For example, letting for a raider class have 2 such mines, this would not lead to a meat grinder, but would help protect the FOBs.

 

Is there ethical reason as with VBIED trucks or what?

Edited by OXOTHNK

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For realistic reasons due to the laws of war NATO and Russia for example rarely if ever uses mines and if they do almost in all cases defensively such as around FOBs and not randomly planting on the roads and other places. Insurgents and rebels should have no such qualms though, but the problem with them is probably developers don't know how to balance AI mines yet. Not realistic but introducing AI mines might make insurgents and rebels a bit op since how useful AI mines especially in modes like invasion 

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Anti personnel mines were banned back in 1997 by the Geneva convention, after 150 countries agreed to never use, stockpile or sell them. Anti personnel mines are a threat that lingers around after the war has ended, even to this day - anti personnel mines from 40+ years ago litter old conflict zones and inflict casualties amonsgt civilians to this day, as well as being recovered by Insurgent forces to either use in their original form, or to be converted into an IED.

My nation spent 14 years in Afghanistan, not only providing security and trying to rebuilt the province we were in, but were destroying ordinance left behind by the Soviets, from the 1979 - 1989 war, that littered the landscapes in pockets. During my deployment, we saw over 1000 mines destroyed - either in the fields/valley's where they were left, or in old stockpiles or insurgent stockpiles.

There's possibly 100 million mines littering the world, that have never been recovered from all the wars since WW2 - Which is quite scary.

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Anti Personal Mines, Satchels, Trip Wires, Soviet Union Anti Personal F1 Land Mines, Vietnam Arrow Trap and even the Egyptians and Aztec Civilization use it protect Grave Sites of the Greats and most Wikid People, if not Physical then Mentally Exhaust the Spell Caster till they Surrender or Die from the Books looks at Aleister Crowley.

On 6/29/2018 at 3:18 PM, OXOTHNK said:

Why have we not had anti-personnel mines in game? 

 

it's quite easy to create this asset, but that would change the gameplay for the better. For example, letting for a raider class have 2 such mines, this would not lead to a meat grinder, but would help protect the FOBs.

 

Is there ethical reason as with VBIED trucks or what?

The Issue that I been presented is pubs and Pros end up setting up a  Tripwire for example and place it where  the most Traffic from tBluefor is running thinking that OPFOR is on its way to Spot out the Hide out

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23 hours ago, Dubs said:

Anti personnel mines were banned back in 1997 by the Geneva convention, after 150 countries agreed to never use, stockpile or sell them. Anti personnel mines are a threat that lingers around after the war has ended, even to this day - anti personnel mines from 40+ years ago litter old conflict zones and inflict casualties amonsgt civilians to this day, as well as being recovered by Insurgent forces to either use in their original form, or to be converted into an IED.

My nation spent 14 years in Afghanistan, not only providing security and trying to rebuilt the province we were in, but were destroying ordinance left behind by the Soviets, from the 1979 - 1989 war, that littered the landscapes in pockets. During my deployment, we saw over 1000 mines destroyed - either in the fields/valley's where they were left, or in old stockpiles or insurgent stockpiles.

There's possibly 100 million mines littering the world, that have never been recovered from all the wars since WW2 - Which is quite scary.

AFAIK neither the United States nor Russia signed that. The US currently has anti-personnel mines in Korea.

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38 minutes ago, Sparcany said:

AFAIK neither the United States nor Russia signed that. The US currently has anti-personnel mines in Korea.

The U.S Agreed 3 or so years ago, to not use any anti personnel mines in any conflict - apart from Korea, as S.Korea see's the mines as one of it's main lines of defense. Aside from that, The U.S will not use anti personnel mines.

Russia uses them, but in such small number that it's irrelevant. This era's wars, against insurgencies make anti personnel mines nearly useless if you fight in a conventional manner, as your forces are constantly moving trying to establish a main front line against a forever moving enemy - which generally like to hide amongst civilians. Making maneuvering difficult(as recovering a mine field is a huge pain in the ass) as well as making collateral damage a much higher risk.

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5 hours ago, Sparcany said:

AFAIK neither the United States nor Russia signed that. The US currently has anti-personnel mines in Korea.

 

4 hours ago, Dubs said:

The U.S Agreed 3 or so years ago, to not use any anti personnel mines in any conflict - apart from Korea, as S.Korea see's the mines as one of it's main lines of defense. Aside from that, The U.S will not use anti personnel mines.

Russia uses them, but in such small number that it's irrelevant. This era's wars, against insurgencies make anti personnel mines nearly useless if you fight in a conventional manner, as your forces are constantly moving trying to establish a main front line against a forever moving enemy - which generally like to hide amongst civilians. Making maneuvering difficult(as recovering a mine field is a huge pain in the ass) as well as making collateral damage a much higher risk.

^ that and the fact is the only mines in Korea that are deployed are along Demilitarized zone between North and South Korea. 

 

However I am for mines to be in the game. Not on US or Russian teams though. Insurgents and Rebels/Militia should neither have such petty qualms in using them and adding AP mines will add more of the unique weapons into their arsenal. If adding AP mines, perhaps, such as US claymores or Russian style trip mines, have them only be able to be placed around FOB/Radio area to defend FOB compound. That way it will be a bit more realistic of defensive deployment.

Edited by Caliell

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no thanks

player detonated only please.

 

happy to die to skill, luck is for noobs

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On 2.7.2018 at 10:16 AM, Dubs said:

Anti personnel mines were banned back in 1997 by the Geneva convention, after 150 countries agreed to never use, stockpile or sell them.

Did some random Rebells agreed to that too?

Gameplaywise it works well in the past, so i don't mind mines :3

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9 hours ago, suds said:

no thanks

player detonated only please.

 

happy to die to skill, luck is for noobs

This is not Call of Duty or even Battlefield. Squad never meant to be "all fair teams, with equally powerful weapons". This is hybrid Milsim. In either case placing down mine does take skill since they work both against enemies and friends. Placing a mine at the wrong place at the wrong time could either mean death of a lot of friendlies or being useless by sitting somewhere in the middle of nowhere of the huge Squad maps. Also Spamming 203s and GL23s is by far worse since you can literally saturate entire areas with them, yet they are in game. I usually hate to compare apples to oranges, but the use of an AP mine is basically as equivalent of using Grenade launcher in game. 


There will always be weapons that are easier to use and exploit than others. However there is always setbacks to each weapons and AP\mins in the huge Squad maps could be either useless, easily seen to be completely overpowered, or placed incorrectly and cause friendly casualties.

Edited by Caliell

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i agree this is not COD etc, death is far more disruptive to an evening of gaming.

death by teammate may be the fault of the dead guy in this case but no less fruistrating.

Death by enemy explosive which they left randomly or even cleverly placed after a long spell of movement OR immediately on spawning. Frustrating.

Bad for gaming. Good for noobs and "snipers" lol.

 

 

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In my opinion only militia and insurgents should have AI Mines (obviously), it should be one per kit (a specific role, such as a scout or the raider, or a new role maybe), and you can have up to 2 mines set up at the same time, if you put down a third, the first one disappears, and so forth (so if you die you can put down a second one, or if  you get ammo from an ammo crate). Maybe troops can disable those mines by using their knives on it, so there's a quick basic animation, or maybe it takes like 5 seconds or something to defuse it. There could be trip wires or actual mines. I don't know how many of you played Rising Storm 2 or even the first one, but it seemed to work fine in those games. In the first game, basically every goddamn jap had a mine in their pocket, but you only would die to it a couple of times in the whole match, it wasn't such a big deal you know? The explosion doesn't need to be huge, it could be just as big as a frag explosion.

Edited by Skully172
what role needs the mine

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On 7/2/2018 at 9:16 AM, Dubs said:

Anti personnel mines were banned back in 1997 by the Geneva convention, after 150 countries agreed to never use, stockpile or sell them. Anti personnel mines are a threat that lingers around after the war has ended, even to this day - anti personnel mines from 40+ years ago litter old conflict zones and inflict casualties amonsgt civilians to this day, as well as being recovered by Insurgent forces to either use in their original form, or to be converted into an IED.

My nation spent 14 years in Afghanistan, not only providing security and trying to rebuilt the province we were in, but were destroying ordinance left behind by the Soviets, from the 1979 - 1989 war, that littered the landscapes in pockets. During my deployment, we saw over 1000 mines destroyed - either in the fields/valley's where they were left, or in old stockpiles or insurgent stockpiles.

There's possibly 100 million mines littering the world, that have never been recovered from all the wars since WW2 - Which is quite scary.

1. The US and Russia have not signed that convention as well as Insurgents/Militia, so we have only one faction that signed it - Britain. Thus it is not a reason. 

2. Friendly Players will kill each other by these mines. - I will now advise a genius idea. Just switch off triggering friendly AP mines for Public servers and switch on for event servers kinda one-life on SquadOps events. 

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7 minutes ago, OXOTHNK said:

1. The US and Russia have not signed that convention as well as Insurgents/Militia, so we have only one faction that signed it - Britain. Thus it is not a reason. 

2. Friendly Players will kill each other by these mines. - I will now advise a genius idea. Just switch off triggering friendly AP mines for Public servers and switch on for event servers kinda one-life on SquadOps events. 

I've replied to a similar post

 

On 7/3/2018 at 8:32 PM, Dubs said:

The U.S Agreed 3 or so years ago, to not use any anti personnel mines in any conflict - apart from Korea, as S.Korea see's the mines as one of it's main lines of defense. Aside from that, The U.S will not use anti personnel mines.

Russia uses them, but in such small number that it's irrelevant. This era's wars, against insurgencies make anti personnel mines nearly useless if you fight in a conventional manner, as your forces are constantly moving trying to establish a main front line against a forever moving enemy - which generally like to hide amongst civilians. Making maneuvering difficult(as recovering a mine field is a huge pain in the ass) as well as making collateral damage a much higher risk.

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On 6/29/2018 at 3:18 PM, OXOTHNK said:

Why have we not had anti-personnel mines in game? 

 

it's quite easy to create this asset, but that would change the gameplay for the better. For example, letting for a raider class have 2 such mines, this would not lead to a meat grinder, but would help protect the FOBs.

 

Is there ethical reason as with VBIED trucks or what?

The Insurgents should be able to conduct asymmetrical dirty warfare just like they do IRL. Especially seeing the fact that once the conventional forces get choppers, arty and airstrikes they'll need a balancing factor to compensate.

 

Insurgents should most definitely get toe poppers and this Mean Gary.

 

 

 

 

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18 hours ago, Zylfrax791 said:

Gary.

 

 

 

 

I will never give up the idea of VBIEDs for insurgents but some members of the development team are absolutely opposed to it for unknown reasons. It's the itch that will never be scratched. There was nothing more concerning as Blufor in PR when fighting insurgents than Big Red or Gary and they will always feel like they're missing something.

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1 hour ago, Rybec said:

...some members of the development team are absolutely opposed to it for unknown reasons.

huh... I wasn't aware of that. I just thought it was something that would be implemented eventually as kind of a balance factor. Like an ace in the hole type thing. Certainly there has to be something to balance out devastating airstrikes and arty. Can you cite a source for this please?

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1 hour ago, Zylfrax791 said:

huh... I wasn't aware of that. I just thought it was something that would be implemented eventually as kind of a balance factor. Like an ace in the hole type thing. Certainly there has to be something to balance out devastating airstrikes and arty. Can you cite a source for this please?

Some ancient discussions back in -15... I can understand the IIRC non said reasoning on it. 

Edited by WARti0k0ne -BG-

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On 7/4/2018 at 7:16 AM, suds said:

i agree this is not COD etc, death is far more disruptive to an evening of gaming.

death by teammate may be the fault of the dead guy in this case but no less fruistrating.

Death by enemy explosive which they left randomly or even cleverly placed after a long spell of movement OR immediately on spawning. Frustrating.

Bad for gaming. Good for noobs and "snipers" lol.

 

 

Maybe they could be like vehicle mines with a part sticking out above the ground, make spotting them skill based. Also how is dying to a mine good for “noobs” or “snipers”?

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On 28/01/2019 at 7:26 AM, Rybec said:

I will never give up the idea of VBIEDs for insurgents but some members of the development team are absolutely opposed to it for unknown reasons. It's the itch that will never be scratched. There was nothing more concerning as Blufor in PR when fighting insurgents than Big Red or Gary and they will always feel like they're missing something.

the devs are incompetent and cowardly tbh, 90% of the design changes from PR have been negative

they've done well from a technical perspective but at this point I don't think this game (3 years early access btw) will ever come close to PR, hopefully modders will surprise us

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13 hours ago, Hotpokkaminny said:

hopefully modders will surprise us

I'm still skeptical about reliance on mods.

I can't wait to run into Arma issues where I join a server that has Gary and Big Red but I get a failure to connect because I don't have some dumb cosmetic mod like a shemagh recolour that the server is running.

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42 minutes ago, Rybec said:

I'm still skeptical about reliance on mods.

I can't wait to run into Arma issues where I join a server that has Gary and Big Red but I get a failure to connect because I don't have some dumb cosmetic mod like a shemagh recolour that the server is running.

ArmA is its own beast with very insular, atomised communities, I'm hoping we see a total overhaul mod for Squad that will add in everything the devs refuse to to make it closer to PR (which itself is a mod)

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2 hours ago, Rybec said:

I'm still skeptical about reliance on mods.

I can't wait to run into Arma issues where I join a server that has Gary and Big Red but I get a failure to connect because I don't have some dumb cosmetic mod like a shemagh recolour that the server is running.

The plan is, if you don't have a required mod on map change or joining a server - You'll automatically download them, instead of having to exit out of the game, to manually find them on the workshop and download them out of game.

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