Jump to content
TheHappyPeanut

Swimming Under Water

Recommended Posts

41 minutes ago, Karm said:

I was wondering about that. Just yesterday, I came across this video (which, by the way, is VERY cool):

 

Which left me wondering... To which extent do weapons work underwater (or not)? Which weapons work, which don't? Which modes of fire work (does automatic reloading work? Semi, auto?)

Single shot seems to work just fine for the AK, at least...

They might fire the chambered round but you ain't getting a kill with it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Major Trouble said:

They might fire the chambered round but you ain't getting a kill with it. 

Yeah. That's why they can fire it in a pool without worrying about it hitting the other end.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, Major Trouble said:

They might fire the chambered round but you ain't getting a kill with it. 

Yes, I can see that. But does it manage to load the next round? Is there a delay (compared to above water shooting), or does it not work at all?

Could you fire in full auto?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 minutes ago, Karm said:

Yes, I can see that. But does it manage to load the next round? Is there a delay (compared to above water shooting), or does it not work at all?

Could you fire in full auto?

In the interest in the subject it would be nice to know if it would fire in auto and what effect the gas bubble has with the next round fired. For the game though it's probably better to just assume your safety is on as the gun is not effective when immersed in water. Your gun should then be fully functional again once out of water without any time delay as water doesn't appear to stop your weapon functioning. Watching the video i was surprised the empty casing didn't cause a jam. If you were in chest deep water with your gun immersed you shouldn't be able to hip fire but if you ads you can.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/28/2014 at 3:17 PM, Z-trooper said:

For a conventional soldier with a massive amount of weight and clothes, vests, bags and heavy boots ect that will soak up water. I doubt you will make much progress actually swimming other than draining your energy.

 

More likely with unconventional combatants, but will they risk being exposed like that without ANY way of defending themselves on an active battlefield?

 

Not to mention that you will compromise the readiness and reliability of your firearm and equipment by doing so.

 

Crossing in waist height or so, would be plausible for sure.

Yes, soldiers can swim with their kit on,.....if they can't, then I'm afraid to say, they don't get to pass off. (First hand knowledge, Ex-army, British)

As for being exposed, maybe 2 or 3 guys crossing at once, the rest of the section are covering you crossing, then you do likewise for them, that's just what happens IRL.

Naturally your weapon is out of commission for the duration of the swim, but once your feet can touch the bottom again, it's redeployed and just as effective as it was before you got wet, as for the rest of your kit not being reliable, let me know what kit you're on about.

I've also read some silliness about not being able to get your coms wet, really? Ok, anything that is used in the army has been through the grinder, ie. field tested by soldiers! 

Yes, I'm sorry to inform you, but getting wet in the military, it happens, it is an occupational hazard.

On 3/8/2016 at 8:31 AM, Major Trouble said:

If you were in chest deep water with your gun immersed you shouldn't be able to hip fire but if you ads you can.

Why is your weapon in the water? It's only chest high, your weapon shouldn't be in the water at all.

 

On 3/6/2016 at 9:46 PM, trotskygrad said:

infantry can't swim in most serious tactical level wargames. You're either reliant on engineer elements or amphib vehicles to cross. It's not very realistic to ditch combat gear simply to swim across a river

I thought we were going for realism, who cares what other war games are doing, we want SQUAD to stand out above the rest, or am I missing something here?

As for this:- " It's not very realistic to ditch combat gear simply to swim across a river" You clearly have no idea what will be done by service personnel, to get the job done.

I'm sorry if anyone feels put out by anything I've said here, it's not my intention, the only thing I've tried to do is let you know how it really is, and it's not how you might think it should be.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
11 minutes ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

Why is your weapon in the water? It's only chest high, your weapon shouldn't be in the water at all.

 

Because it's a game. The devs are unlikely to make a pose for water crossing and assign a specific key to do it for the rare occasions it's required. They're not trying to make Arma and its gazillion stances.

 

The simple solution is just to restrict the ability to fire although that is possible in RL.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, Major Trouble said:

 

Because it's a game. The devs are unlikely to make a pose for water crossing and assign a specific key to do it for the rare occasions it's required. They're not trying to make Arma and its gazillion stances.

 

The simple solution is just to restrict the ability to fire although that is possible in RL.

 

It could be done through collision, I guess.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Major Trouble said:

 

Because it's a game. The devs are unlikely to make a pose for water crossing and assign a specific key to do it for the rare occasions it's required. They're not trying to make Arma and its gazillion stances.

 

The simple solution is just to restrict the ability to fire although that is possible in RL.

 

True, it will always be a game, nothing can change that fact, but I, like many others, thought that SQUAD was striving to be the best, most realistic, immersive experience on the market, or as I said earlier, am I missing something?

To traverse chest high water, your weapon should be in the aim, so no special button needs to be assigned, and no restriction should be implemented, other than the players ability to cover the width of the river.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

I thought we were going for realism

Well you thought wrong. 

 

Squad isn't going for full realism, they're going for authenticity. Using realistic elements where they can/want. And using less realistic elements where they can/want.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
56 minutes ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

To traverse chest high water, your weapon should be in the aim, so no special button needs to be assigned, and no restriction should be implemented, other than the players ability to cover the width of the river.  

 

There you go you have come to the same conclusion as myself. Raise the weapon to be able to fire. If you're foolish enough to maintain a hip fire stance on chest deep water then you shouldn't be able to fire. Or maybe for the extra realism you're seeking you can fire just the one round in the chamber.

Edited by Major Trouble
Spelling

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
6 minutes ago, Major Trouble said:

 

There you go you have come to the same conclusion as myself. Raise the weapon to be able to fire. If you're foolish enough to maintain a hip fire stance on chest deep water then you shouldn't be able to fire. Our maybe for the extra realism you're seeking you can fire just the one round in the chamber.

Let me clarify it a little more, you would be up in the aim scanning for targets before you even enter the river, once the rest of your section are in defensive\covering positions, that's when you would cautiously break cover, still in the aim, and slowly enter the water, to borrow one from our American brothers, with your head on a swivel. So, having your weapon at hip level, shouldn't actually be happening, just because you're crossing a river, doesn't take you out of the section, your weapon is still part of your sections strength if\when the nastiness hits the fan.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@Shaolin PitBoo And that's were the game element kicks in. We're not all trained soldiers and have to learn good practices on the virtual battlefield. Putting restrictions on bad practices (not hip firing in chest deep water) only helps to differentiate those. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Chompster said:

Well you thought wrong. 

 

Squad isn't going for full realism, they're going for authenticity. Using realistic elements where they can/want. And using less realistic elements where they can/want.

So, by your definition, SQUAD is neither going for authenticity or realism. For something to be authentic, it needs to be as realistic as possible, and for something to be realistic, it needs to be as authentic as possible. You can't have one without the other.  ; ) 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

So, by your definition, SQUAD is neither going for authenticity or realism. For something to be authentic, it needs to be as realistic as possible, and for something to be realistic, it needs to be as authentic as possible. You can't have one without the other.  ; ) 

Completely false. You can most definitely have one without the other, because they don't have the same meaning.

 

Being authentic doesn't mean 100% realistic, it's being believable and being close to realistic(or the original of something). Which is what Squad is going for. They want it to feel realistic in most aspects, without actually making it realistic in those aspects. They will pick and choose where they want things to be more realistic compared to other parts of the game, for the sake of good gameplay.

 

If you still disagree, then fine. Let's not call it Authentic then, but what do you propose? because it's definitely not realistic. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
14 hours ago, Chompster said:

Completely false. You can most definitely have one without the other, because they don't have the same meaning.

 

Being authentic doesn't mean 100% realistic, it's being believable and being close to realistic

 

 "For something to be authentic, it needs to be as realistic as possible, and for something to be realistic, it needs to be as authentic as possible."

I've only been using English as my mother tongue all my life, so I guess I'm no expert, but your first 2 sentences seem to be blown out the water by your new definition of authenticity, your third sentence, which is exactly what I've been saying about authenticity and realism,.....

This nonsensical discussion need go no further, if you want to discuss something else in my original post, that's fine by me, otherwise, don't bother.

Happy gaming Chompster

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Authentic/realistic, it doesn't matter, as the devs have said gameplay > realism. That's not to say they're not trying to make Squad authentic/realistic but it's just not going to get in the way of making the game fun. Different people have different ideas on what is fun but so far Squad is going in the direction I'd like. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

I've only been using English as my mother tongue all my life, so I guess I'm no expert

You're right you aren't. Just because it's your mother tongue, doesn't automatically make you an expert(unless you are through your profession or something..)

 

3 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

but your first 2 sentences seem to be blown out the water by your new definition of authenticity

 

" made or done in the traditional or original way, or in a way that faithfully resembles an original. " My new definition huh?

3 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

your third sentence, which is exactly what I've been saying about authenticity and realism,.....

Except that it isn't. You clearly stated that you cannot have one without the other, when we clearly already do. Just look at any weapon, are they authentic? sure. They look just like the real thing. Do they sound like the real thing? depends who you ask.. Do they handle like the real thing? No. No they don't. and there goes you realism.

 

3 hours ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

This nonsensical discussion need go no further, if you want to discuss something else in my original post, that's fine by me, otherwise, don't bother.

Happy gaming Chompster

Or how about you answer that question i posted in my comment that you somehow avoided? And I will bother, you don't start something and then expect the other person to back off after a mere one response. If you want it to end then by all means don't reply to this and it'll die off.

 

Good gaming you too as well Shaolin PitBoo.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Chompster said:

You're right you aren't. Just because it's your mother tongue, doesn't automatically make you an expert(unless you are through your profession or something..)

 

 

" made or done in the traditional or original way, or in a way that faithfully resembles an original. " My new definition huh?

Except that it isn't. You clearly stated that you cannot have one without the other, when we clearly already do. Just look at any weapon, are they authentic? sure. They look just like the real thing. Do they sound like the real thing? depends who you ask.. Do they handle like the real thing? No. No they don't. and there goes you realism.

 

Or how about you answer that question i posted in my comment that you somehow avoided? And I will bother, you don't start something and then expect the other person to back off after a mere one response. If you want it to end then by all means don't reply to this and it'll die off.

 

Good gaming you too as well Shaolin PitBoo.

lol, sorry, but my 9 year old daughter has a much greater command of the English language than you will ever have, should I put her on so you can slog it out with someone a little closer to your level of ability?.....

Looks like you're out of luck, she says you should look up the word authenticity in a Cambridge dictionary....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

authenticitynoun 

 UK   /ˌɔː.θenˈtɪs.ə.ti/ US   /ˌɑː.θenˈtɪs.ə.t̬i/

› the quality of being real or true:The poems are supposed to be by Sappho, but they areactually of doubtful authenticity.The authenticity of her story is beyond doubt.

Thesaurus

Reality and truth

synonyms and related words:

a slice of life

 

actuality

 

fact

 

genuine

 

God's truth

 

immediacy

McCoy

 

non-fiction

 

practice

 

real life

 

realia

 

slice

the real McCoy

 

the real thing 1

the real world 2

 

truism

 

truth

 

veracity

verisimilitude

 

verity

In other words, authenticity and realism are synonymous with each other....

synonymousadjective

 UK   /sɪˈnɒn.ɪ.məs/ US   /sɪˈnɑː.nə.məs/

C2 having the same meaning:The words "annoyed" and "irritated" are more or less synonymous.

C2 If you say that one thing is synonymous with another, you mean that the two things are so closely connectedin most people's minds that one suggests the other:Oscar Wilde's name is synonymous with wit.

Thesaurus

Similar and the same

synonyms and related words:

a level playing field

 

affinity

 

akin

 

alike

 

allied

 

approach

 

clock

constant

 

equal

 

every inch

 

firm

 

homogeneous

homogenous

 

identical

 

inch

 

repetition

resemblance

 

same

 

same difference

same old same old

Hope this helps you, daddy said I should use the dictionary for you, so you can get on with something else in life, BYE! <3 Keisha £>

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

*snip*

Now you're just being sad.. you don't even seem to care about the topic anymore. Your sole aim seems to be proving me wrong and using petty insult to do so. even dragging your own child into it..

 

All of this could have been avoided had you just answered the question near the end of my first reply, yet you dragged it all down to this toxic level(with multiple posts even, there's an edit button you know?)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Many native english talking people can be hostile to how I speak. I'm not good at english but... Me -Fuck off and learn some swedish instead... :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Sorry, I understand your fear of being ripped a new one by a nine year old, but you're quite safe now, she's in bed sleeping. lol

Seriously though, if you had just read and understood what was said, several times, and even by yourself at one point, then you tried to deflect away from the BS you'd started, none of this would have happened, but you seemed to have a stick up your ***, and weren't able to accept what I was telling you as the "TRUTH", that's when I realised how much of a troll you were trying to be, so I thought, why not let my little girl show you where its at. As for multiple posts, I'm sorry for posting 2 replies in succession, my bad. :P 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 minutes ago, Shaolin PitBoo said:

Sorry, I understand your fear of being ripped a new one by a nine year old, but you're quite safe now, she's in bed sleeping. lol

Seriously though, if you had just read and understood what was said, several times, and even by yourself at one point, then you tried to deflect away from the BS you'd started, none of this would have happened, but you seemed to have a stick up your ***, and weren't able to accept what I was telling you as the "TRUTH", that's when I realised how much of a troll you were trying to be, so I thought, why not let my little girl show you where its at. As for multiple posts, I'm sorry for posting 2 replies in succession, my bad. :P 

3 replies actually.

 

And you mean like how you've deflected so many things in my posts so far? Again you seem to have no intentions of actually getting back on topic. And now you're playing the "I'll make him look bad by making it seem like he's scared and using make up facts to prove that I'm right" card.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×