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Friesen

Squad needs to have lockdown of objectives just like in Post Scriptum and HLL

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With having 2 objectives open at once, it needs the lockdown feature of objectives even more so. Please devs add lockdown for objectives (so that you can't capture it until 2 minutes elapses.

 

Even better the next objective that opens up should be unlocked 1 minute earlier than the one your team just captured. So the new defending objective has a bigger lockdown time (like 3 minutes) and the next objectives for example 2 minutes. This encourages the losing team to actually fall back and go back to the defensive objective rather than instantly trying to counterattack the lost objective which almost always ends up in a stalemate.

Edited by Friesen

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This kind of sounds like Grand Operations, ...or how it could be integrated as an expanded mode of play.

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It would not work for most game-modes. AAS has both teams attacking and defending at the same time.

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On 29/05/2018 at 9:05 AM, MeFirst said:

It would not work for most game-modes. AAS has both teams attacking and defending at the same time.

 

Completely false.

 

Darkest Hour mod has got maps where teams are attacking and defending at the same time and it's got exactly this lockdown feature. The team then that captures the objective, it gets locked for 4 minutes, whereas the next objective that opens up gets locked only for 2 minutes.

 

That means that the team that captured the point has 2 minutes to spare for to attack the next objective before their defensive unlocks for the losing team to counterattack it (which gets unlocked after 4 minutes).

 

Both HLL and PS also have the lockdown feature. (and even though PS is only pure offensive, HLL capzones go back and forth similar to DH).

 

And what it does is that it reduces the stalemates where the battle is stuck at 2 middle capzones, and when captured it gives a sufficient time for the attackers to push to the next capzone without being instantly counterattacked like it's now where often it seems impossible to push out from the objective you've just captured to the next one.

 

It also encourages the team that lost that objective to fall back to the next defensive objective. Too often teams that lost an objective just try to instantly take it back rather than fall back. No one almost wants to fall back and with this feature not only it forces the team to fall back but also it makes them regroup and reorganize in case they want to take back the previously lost objective.

 

Also if you think that with this feature the team that gets pushed back almost never would turn the battle around is not true. On the maps in DH with this attack and defence style I've seen the battle turn around almost 3 times, like 1 team pushes the other team to the last capzone and then they pushed them back all the way to the other team last capzone and so on. So even with the lockdown feature, the come backs happen all the time in fact, however the main thing is that it vastly reduces the stalemates and instant counterattacking as well as pre-early backcapping.

Edited by Friesen

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Maybe only have the next objective locked down for like 5 minutes? Just capping an objective doesn't mean you stop fighting over it, it would be neat to see enemies having a better chance to cap it back before the next one opens up, and have another squad use that time to prepare the defences on the next cap using this lockdown time. This would prevent steamrolling and make the game play out a bit more thought-out.

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Look, if you don't lock the objective you've just capped as well, then the stalemates are just going to continue.

 

The lockdown for the obj you've just capped actually makes the team to reorganize and regroup in order to take it back.

 

Both in DH as well as in HLL if you capture an objective, there's a lockdown which prompts the team that lost it to fall back and defend the next one. It would be virtually impossible to push to the next capzone while you're constantly being counterattacked at the objective you've just captured. The only few times it does happens it's extremely rare, and this is why in Squad it's a stalemate most of the time.

 

Look, both steamrolling and stalemates are a big problem. And I guarantee you in games like DH, the lockdown for both (the next attacking objective and the one you've just captured), works very well. It prevents you from steamrolling the next empty objective too quickly but at the same time it prevents from stalemates which derives from the other team instantly counterattacking the objective you've just captured.

Edited by Friesen

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What exactly do you mean by a stalemate? A double-neutral or both teams putting up a defense on their respective points so that one cannot cap the other's? The former happens when the defenders get wiped on both teams roughly around the same time, most of the time - and they could have been defending for 15-20 minutes - so there's absolutely no effect on that with lockdowns. 
Imho, just increasing the time it takes for a flag to go from Neutral to Capped would have the same effect - without any solid lockdown restrictions. 

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By stalemate I mean is that 90% of my almost 1000 hours in Squad the objectives don't go further than the 2 center objectives. Very rarely see actually go to the last capzone unless the other teams are comprised of very beginner like players.

 

Well if you never even tried the lockdown feature for example how in DH works then you'll never know what you're talking about, that is the problem about all the people bringing cynicism to the suggestion of implementing the same feature that already DH, HLL and PS have it.

Edited by Friesen

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Here's the thing:

 

If there's a lockdown feature, then there's a huge incentive to rush the opposite team before they cap their point. It'll bring the rush mechanic back knowing you won't have to leave a squad defending. 2 minute lockdown is a 2 minute window you have to rush at the beginning is huge!

 

I like rushing, so bring it! 

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Basically regular AAS is not a good gamemode, it needs to have multiple objectives at once rather than just one.

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I think yiou are very good at talking down to people, but im not sure thats your goal.

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@Friesen: For witch game mode are you suggesting this? Because in PS we basically played Invasion (Offensive). For all?

In defence of AAS. Coming from PR i know that AAS is a great gamemode, Devs just need to work on it. Make it dynamic AAS, bigger flag radius and bigger maps and it will work just fine.
Also INS need a big rework too.

Edited by Axel

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I am not sure if lockdowns will prevent stalemates. In my experience stalemates in squad AAS doesn't happend because the team who lost a flag makes a counter attack.

 

Stalemates happen because it is so hard to take down enemy spawns, meaning you never really clear out a flag.

 

I also find it happens when one team superfobs a flag and has no other spawn. So attackers are fighting whole enemy since noone is spawning anywere else.

 

Edit: But i think devs should test it. Game is in early access, so why not try. 

Edited by Romby

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17 hours ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Basically regular AAS is not a good gamemode, it needs to have multiple objectives at once rather than just one.

Exactly. RIP Gorodok Lumberyard layer.

18 hours ago, Friesen said:

By stalemate I mean is that 90% of my almost 1000 hours in Squad the objectives don't go further than the 2 center objectives. Very rarely see actually go to the last capzone unless the other teams are comprised of very beginner like players.

 

Well if you never even tried the lockdown feature for example how in DH works then you'll never know what you're talking about, that is the problem about all the people bringing cynicism to the suggestion of implementing the same feature that already DH, HLL and PS have it.


I don't know about DH, but in PS the lockdown is clearly there to let the defenders set up a defense after losing a point. It's pretty much the opposite of the effect you want. Somehow I think that reverse engineering it to promote steamrolling will not have a positive effect.

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Well you see, you make your judgement, most of people here even though they never tried and see how it works. Then why would you make your assumption such as "ehhhhhhm not sure" when you don't know what you're talking about and the fact that in DH the maps with advance objectives work exactly the same way as in Squad (attacking one and defensive), and once the lockdown was implemented, it made the stalemates reduced by about 80% (as well as pre-early precapping and steamrolling).

Edited by Friesen

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