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L0cation

VERY Concernd about the TOW missle

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I always say be careful what you wish for.A lot of people asked for tow system withought reading about it and all.

Its an owerpowering easy to use system with huge ranges.

A Serbian upgraded rocket for Malyutka system can penetrate 1,000 mm armor even ERA type of armour and it effective range is up to 5 km so all you need is a steady hand and just keep it pointed on the enemy and its hit rate is 90%.

 

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Honestly i agree. The TOW had made maps like kohat VERY unstatisfying. In this map vehicles dominate. Such a little part of combat is infantry. M2 bradleys and TOW fobs just chew up enemy 30s. In maps like narva, its ok to have m2 bradleys, while kohat should stick to what it was before. Thats because like OP said narva is basically a city, its oke having wire guided guns if they can be countered (btw i think that fob should only have 1 TOW and every full reload ie (3 slots) should take up about 500 ammo its a very powerful weapon with little drawback this forces a logi line like with mortars) in the city the m2 could be looking down the road firing TOWs at BTRs then all the sudden a 30 could appear in the back or a squad could shoot some LATs and HATs to kill it. In conclusion maps that have wide open areas should not get TOWs while compact maps should

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We're going to watch how the TOW integrates into the game and continue to adjust it. There are a number of approaches: ticket value, speed, range, etc, that can be tweaked to get it to "fit." It's also important to remember, we're still building the armor system out -- tanks are coming, localized damage will be iterated upon, more weapon platforms will be introduced. Keep the feedback coming! (And keep it civil, please.)

 

IMHO, I think we'll see more people thinking tactically/approaching it with a rock-paper-scissors style counters. I'm also a vehicle junkie, so the TOW is my mortal enemy and I hope it burns in hell for its transgressions.

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2 hours ago, OVKHuman said:

Honestly i agree. The TOW had made maps like kohat VERY unstatisfying. In this map vehicles dominate. Such a little part of combat is infantry. M2 bradleys and TOW fobs just chew up enemy 30s. In maps like narva, its ok to have m2 bradleys, while kohat should stick to what it was before. Thats because like OP said narva is basically a city, its oke having wire guided guns if they can be countered (btw i think that fob should only have 1 TOW and every full reload ie (3 slots) should take up about 500 ammo its a very powerful weapon with little drawback this forces a logi line like with mortars) in the city the m2 could be looking down the road firing TOWs at BTRs then all the sudden a 30 could appear in the back or a squad could shoot some LATs and HATs to kill it. In conclusion maps that have wide open areas should not get TOWs while compact maps should

Thats an intersting idea indeed . 

But "banning" specific weapons or vehicles on certain maps would really hurt the varaity we'll have , and at the same time i really like how powerful weapons feel in squad so i wouldn't want to nerf them , so a lower draw distanc/fog looks like the best route .

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Posted (edited)

tbh its the usual moaning.. ... 

 

insurgents need optics to counter US

Stryker needs 30mm to counter BTR

We need more Rpgs to counter everything..

Techies need armour so they are not destroyed by bullet fire

suppression to counter sniper

and two or three days of a bit of tow action... giggidy... and people already saying its op... so now the optics of the various vehicles is countered ..makes you need to think a bit more about sticking it on a hill and thinking your invincible.... 

Edited by embecmom

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, L0cation said:

And now a question for the professionals out there : is there a way in real life to deal with a TOW missle ? Are there any counter meassures vehicles can use other than breaking line of sight ? 

ERA maybe, something like Trophy more likely.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reactive_armour
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trophy_(countermeasure)

Edited by Nimbus

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36 minutes ago, embecmom said:

..makes you need to think a bit more about sticking it on a hill and thinking your invincible.... 

+1 

 

Hey! how about communicating properly to let your armored vehicles know where the TOW missile is on the map :) Is it too far to see? Ask your SL to mark it, shoot with your cannon in that direction, wait for height correction until the TOW is down....

 

COMMUNICATION IS KEY! 

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On 5/3/2018 at 6:44 AM, L0cation said:

To be honest is was more concerd about the TOW mounted on armoured vehicles ( and any other upcoming weapon types like this ) , where to only way to take it out - if its too far away with infantry is with something like a javalin missle or - ( please let them add this - air strikes by squad leader / manable howitzer that can get coordinates from infantry and light up the area with powerful accurate fire ).

Ah, I see. The easiest way is to set up a TOW or SPG in a hidden position that covers open areas the vehicle is likely to travel. Use flanking fire on it so it doesn't easily see you but if your choices are limited, set it up behind cover or just around the corner of a building where it isn't standing out in the open. If your position is discovered, you MUST reposition.

 

You can use other tactics as well by coordinating SPG techies, mines, and RPGs. However, to get the best bang for your buck you can have a small 3 man team set up a hidden SPG position on the map. That way you can use your team's manpower on objectives.

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While the TOW is definitely really strong currently, I think it's a bit too early to be thus concerned about it. For a very long time we haven't had a serious, long range threat to vehicles, so it's understandable that people haven't figured out how to approach situations with them uet(other then sending a squad around the flank to take out the fob). 

 

Give it some time, V11 literally just came out.. People screamed to the sky about how OP the 30MM was when it came out, and now it isn't as big of a threat as it used to be because of strategies to take it out.

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Check this guy out. He is running a squad of two 30mm BTRs but handles dealing with Strykers and an emplacement TOW very well:

 

 

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On 2018-05-02 at 8:30 PM, L0cation said:

DUDE ! I love you so much right nowww!  That's the first solution i've had in mind ,  and that's what i always keep suggesting but people always seem to dismiss the idea for some reason .

No no dust please. And no trees either. Vehicle battle is swift and harsh and should be. Drivers should be cautious. 

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They are likely to solve this the usual way by putting trees and obstacles everywhere where the tow could actually be deployed. So wouldn't bother much about heavy weapons at all. They will all be useless in the end when the map designers have finished tweaking. 

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Please do not `fix` the TOW missile. It is a powerful, but static, weaponsystem. Fight it accordingly, ie:

 

- drop mortars on it

- attack it with infantry

- attack it from outside it's FOV

- attack it from multiple angels/with multiple vehicles (or both)

- avoid the area

 

Seriously, learn to deal with it. I have yet to play a game where the TOW was an insurmountable problem.

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5 hours ago, Slavinkje said:

Please do not `fix` the TOW missile. It is a powerful, but static, weaponsystem. Fight it accordingly, ie:

 

- drop mortars on it

- attack it with infantry

- attack it from outside it's FOV

- attack it from multiple angels/with multiple vehicles (or both)

- avoid the area

 

Seriously, learn to deal with it. I have yet to play a game where the TOW was an insurmountable problem.

Exactly! People don't want heavy weapons... because well they...hurt. 

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TOW changes the dynamic of the game, which is wonderful.  It's supposed to be modern warfare requiring co ordination.  Armour isn't the end all it used to be, crews now need to think.

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5 hours ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

Exactly! People don't want heavy weapons... because well they...hurt. 

Yeah imagine you cannot camp on some nice hill and rape an fob or infantry all game long with nothing beeing able to kill you with ease.

Now tandem is a problem,tow is a problem and so on.

Just be cearful how you drive it and all and even if you are you can get hit well thats war for you.

 

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USo if we are talking about realism most modern armies and the us/Russia especially have active defense systems on most of their modern/modernized vehicles already. This means the TOW missile usually gets destroyed before even hitting the target

 

Leaving that aside the vehicles should get a higher initial acceleration to easily fall back behind an obsticle. Also the Speed of vehicles of road is currently let's say a bit unrealistic. Mostly because of the either unrealisticly steep hills or the unrealistic speed of vehics going on those hills. 

The reason why tows are so good is because they are hitting stationary targets most of the time and if there is a driving one the vehicles are very slow

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, Bahrein said:

Yeah imagine you cannot camp on some nice hill and rape an fob or infantry all game long with nothing beeing able to kill you with ease.

Now tandem is a problem,tow is a problem and so on.

Just be cearful how you drive it and all and even if you are you can get hit well thats war for you.

 

That's the thing. Your mindset asset-wise is:

Oh! Armour always  get taken out when they place their tow there. We have to redesign the game.

 

Instead it should be: Oh! Armour always gets taken out when they place their tow there - we have to take out their supply line so they run out of ammo. Or we have to use mortars for indirect fire. 

 

Game becomes strategy lacking when everything can always beat anything. No use put down a stationary tow because someone can always bypass it.

 

If fob is raped take it down.

 

Map design should make it so that there are good places to put assets, but that there are always also good counter-assets to counter those other assets in those sweet spots. There could be a few alternative ways of winning also. For example attack the supply lines. 

 

Currently it's mostly dumping people in the forest and they run around almost always without strategic thinking asset wise. Only strategy is where to put the fob and rally. It's basically infantry only combat with transportation. Heavy weapons are for shows mostly. I think it's a pity..... People will adapt to new circumstances. Just give them a chance. Some people who don't see the bigger strategy picture will cry of course: "I can't take out a Stryker alone as infantry with a bb-gun! It's unfair!" 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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26 minutes ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

That's the thing. Your mindset asset-wise is:

Oh! Armour always  get taken out when they place their tow there. We have to redesign the game.

 

Instead it should be: Oh! Armour always gets taken out when they place their tow there - we have to take out their supply line so they run out of ammo. Or we have to use mortars for indirect fire. 

 

Game becomes strategy lacking when everything can always beat anything. No use put down a stationary tow because someone can always bypass it.

 

If fob is raped take it down.

 

Map design should make it so that there are good places to put assets, but that there are always also good counter-assets to counter those other assets in those sweet spots. There could be a few alternative ways of winning also. For example attack the supply lines. 

 

Currently it's mostly dumping people in the forest and they run around almost always without strategic thinking asset wise. Only strategy is where to put the fob and rally. It's basically infantry only combat with transportation. Heavy weapons are for shows mostly. I think it's a pity..... People will adapt to new circumstances. Just give them a chance. Some people who don't see the bigger strategy picture will cry of course: "I can't take out a Stryker alone as infantry with a bb-gun! It's unfair!" 

I was actually sarcastic there buddy.

I understad you and agree with you.

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Wanted to jump in and reassure folks that the state of things is temporary -- disabling hits will be coming in the next iteration of the vehicle damage system. They should, in most cases, take the place of the one-hit kills... which we agree, aren't super fun. In the meantime, the designers are looking for tweaks and fixes to make things a little more enjoyable.

 

Overall, it seems like the implementation of TOWs is pretty well-received and we're very grateful for the feedback (and patience!) you've been giving us. Thank you all!

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Posted (edited)

Solution? Drop an 80 Mike Mike on top of their heads. Problem solved...lol M107? That shit is not needed in this game. I hope we all remember this is an "Early Access" state right? Tweaks will be made. Tactics will change.

Edited by BlackDog1247

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On 5/11/2018 at 2:57 AM, EcchiRevenge said:

If you thought this is bad, wait until FLIR gets put onto TOWs.

xD

 

People are gonna croak when FLIR gets added anywhere.... 

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On 5/3/2018 at 6:02 AM, 40mmrain said:

All of Squad's combat is about who sees who first. That's what modern combat is all about. The TOW's optics are already bad. Learn how to adapt.

Yeah because we all want to play modern warfare where everyone stands kilometers away and fires long range guided weapons.

 

If it keeps going the way it is with all the new weapons system to be added then this game will become a big stand off ranged gameplay mode... not what the people brought this game for.

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