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Good Day Squaddies.

 

Im am just curios on the damage you get for dropping of a wall thats 1 meter high and almost dying from it... I just feel thats a bit unrealistic if I must say.

 

Have a Great Day!

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huh? I don't think there is damage penalty for that height in game? Did you had low HP with bleeding?

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23 minutes ago, Disco said:

huh? I don't think there is damage penalty for that height in game? Did you had low HP with bleeding?

I dont really know - I just recently noticed it while watching a video and only realizing that its quite sensitive when it gets too falling. But it could just be me man

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Hm... I don't think it's 1m or anything low as that but not sure atm. You have to remember that, in game, characters are in combat gear. And some of them have full rucksacks.

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Just now, Disco said:

Hm... I don't think it's 1m or anything low as that but not sure atm. You have to remember that, in game, characters are in combat gear. And some of them have full rucksacks.

Thats true, I did not think about it in that way.

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If you test out fall damage on the shooting range you'll see you need to be quite high (est 2m) to inflict significant damage on yourself. You can end up in a bleeding state from fall damage which I still find a little strange. It could happen but isn't overly likely irl. If you end up sustaining significant fall damage I think a better way to indicate it other than bleeding would be for your character to just fall over like when your shot or knocked down by vehicles. You shouldn't just be able to jump down, sustain an injury and kill a foe while still standing. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Major Trouble said:

If you test out fall damage on the shooting range you'll see you need to be quite high (est 2m) to inflict significant damage on yourself. You can end up in a bleeding state from fall damage which I still find a little strange. It could happen but isn't overly likely irl. If you end up sustaining significant fall damage I think a better way to indicate it other than bleeding would be for your character to just fall over like when your shot or knocked down by vehicles. You shouldn't just be able to jump down, sustain an injury and kill a foe while still standing. 

I like the idea, would be really cool, but height should be really significant in order to send one tumbling over after landing. 

Edited by bravo2zero

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On 13/04/2018 at 4:00 PM, bravo2zero said:

I like the idea, would be really cool, but height should be really significant in order to send one tumbling over after landing. 

I prefer things that are based on realism in a game that way you're not surprised about what just happened. Jump down far enough to get injured and start bleeding but still standing there as if nothing happened - wtf? Did I just supposedly end up with a bone sticking out of my leg to cause me to bleed? How come I am still standing and can sprint as fast as I did before if I just broke my leg? Little things that make the game a bit more immersive because they're grounded in realism. That's what I'd like to see more of.

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Quick fix (Lol.. it won't be quick) for all this fall damage from minimum heights would be solved with a drop feature. Allow the player to lower themselves from a high area (Walls, buildings, ect.) Just like they have a "Climb" feature. Allow the players to drop down from a height slowly like the climb up or jump off quickly and take damage as is now (Or fall off the wall).

 

Its realistic, would fix most of the griping about fall damage and bleeding, leaves the player vulnerable to enemy fire while taking the safer drop option. I don't want to see squad turn into "HARD CORE PARKOUR!!!" military bullshit but that's how I've gotten down walls with combat gear, Slow with security. 

 

How to implement it? Sure as shit wouldn't use the jump key to initiate the drop. Could imagine the frustration from players leaping to their deaths when they wanted to drop.   Probably a mix of crouching and looking down at the edge or some shit idk.  

 

Lets beat this dead horse a little more, I think the meat isn't tender enough. 

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Fall over mechanic would solve this immediately for medium drops and stupid heights should be broken stamina and bleeding out.

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IMO it does need nerfing a bit, the way I see it is that if your soldier can climb on to a wall then he should be able to climb/jump back off without taking damage.

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7 hours ago, L0cation said:

+1 for fall damage nerf.

yes pls. 

 

i mean where is the point in 1% HP loss when you fall from like 1,5 or 2 meters? Nobody cares, only the poor medic is annoyed because he now has the stupid health symbol on his teammate.

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On ‎4‎/‎13‎/‎2018 at 5:16 AM, Toxity101 said:

Good Day Squaddies.

 

Im am just curios on the damage you get for dropping of a wall thats 1 meter high and almost dying from it... I just feel thats a bit unrealistic if I must say.

 

Have a Great Day!

I have to ask, have you ever jumped off a Humvee, let alone a wall wearing about 60lbs worth of combat gear on you? As former 240 gunner, climbing into that Humvee turret up and down all day in Iraq in 100 degree heat felt awfully painful on my knees. So imagine a fall from the high wall in all of that battle rattle. I think what bleeding simulates well is someone passing out from pain of the fractures.

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I agree with Caliell, I think most modern FPS has greatly skewed a players perception of how far an average human can land a jump... We're not talking shorts and t-shirt with both hands free, parkour style.

 

players are in full gear and weapons in hand...

IRL 6 foott drop in full combat gear weapon  in hand, likely to sprain an ankle at least, depending on the ground surface.

In squad I believe players don't take any damage below 8 feet, to.account for scaling down the wall, although this is still very arcade like as you have a weapon in your hand while scaling down, impossible to do in reality.

 

That being said I agree here that more needs to be done eventually, the fall damage is a temporary fix to a movement issue, hope we get to further enhance that feeling further  down the road, but simply allowing soldiers to leap out of 2 story windows is not the solution.

I'd like to see falls from 6-12 feet having little HP loss, but more visual feedback (stun animation?) And it needs to remove most or all of the stamina. "stunning" the player for a few seconds, so he cannot shoot, which would make players second guess jumping off walls in a combat situation, so there is more risk/reward element to the climbing action, bringing some more authenticity and immersion as well as gameplay balance to the climbing.

 

 

Side Note about falling IRL: to those that are physically fit and have done obstacle courses, they probably won't need any of this explained...

 

Falling sucks. Ladder accidents are brutal and don't have to happen at great heights. To be quite devastating.. I have RL friends that are quite fit that have had major falls from non extreme heights that have affected their mobility

 

Simulating full gear with a backpack with ~60 pounds, holding a weapon or tool of some type that weighs between 8-22 lbs, hold that weapon/tool in front with both hands ready to use while taking a step off a ledge 8 ft high... Recipe to get hurt big time depending on landing surface.

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47 minutes ago, fuzzhead said:

players are in full gear and weapons in hand...

IRL 6 foott drop in full combat gear weapon  in hand, likely to sprain an ankle at least, depending on the ground surface.

In squad I believe players don't take any damage below 8 feet, to.account for scaling down the wall, although this is still very arcade like as you have a weapon in your hand while scaling down, impossible to do in reality.
 

Falling sucks. Ladder accidents are brutal and don't have to happen at great heights. To be quite devastating.. I have RL friends that are quite fit that have had major falls from non extreme heights that have affected their mobility

 

Simulating full gear with a backpack with ~60 pounds, holding a weapon or tool of some type that weighs between 8-22 lbs, hold that weapon/tool in front with both hands ready to use while taking a step off a ledge 8 ft high... Recipe to get hurt big time depending on landing surface.

This^^

The most common injuries on deployment are usually ankle, knee or lower back related. From basic strains and swelling, to full on fractures. In some cases, slipped spinal disks. All from slips, trips and jumps. You have a higher chance of rolling your ankle, than getting shot. Not to mention, prolonged strain on joints can cause a lot of complications in the field and to overall performance. 

They way I explain it to people is - Go find an old back pack, and just any old chair you have. Fill the backpack with books or something that adds a little weight to it. Hop on the chair, and jump off, land flat on your feet. Pay attention to the backpack when you come to stop, as you make contact with the ground - The backpack keeps moving downwards due to the weight. Now Imagine full combat kit on, and jumping from the top of a 10ft wall or across a 5ft wide irrigation ditch.

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13 hours ago, fuzzhead said:

//snip

We have a 'fall down' animation already when run over by vehicles which leaves you vulnerable. Surly that could be used for the time being. Remove bleeding and add height related damage along with stamina loss would do it for me.

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I think the current fallover animation has some bugs with it.. when things get worked out we will prolly get an acceptable balance between mobility but with risk/reward.

I wouldn't expect it to change for v12

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Posted (edited)
22 hours ago, Caliell said:

I have to ask, have you ever jumped off a Humvee, let alone a wall wearing about 60lbs worth of combat gear on you? As former 240 gunner, climbing into that Humvee turret up and down all day in Iraq in 100 degree heat felt awfully painful on my knees. So imagine a fall from the high wall in all of that battle rattle. I think what bleeding simulates well is someone passing out from pain of the fractures.

Where is the Point in 1 or 2% HP loss after "falling" from a little over 1 meter. Realy, where is the point? It may be realistic, but there are tons of realistic things which are not in the game for some reason.

 

Also: in Reality i could carefully  climb down a two to three meter high wall. But climbing down anything (besides ladders) is simply not in the game. So yeah, It realy comes down to realism when i "fall" 1 meter, because i am unable to carefully climb down and afterwards the medic can heal me instantly in 1,5 seconds. So, back in the days, as a gunner, how often did your medic massage your ankles for two seconds for a realistic insta-Heal?;)

 

On top of that: My game character might have 30KG of gear to carry around, but i can't feel that in front of my monitor. Thats why there is a UI Element for Stamina i.e. 

 

Again, i am not saying anyone should be able to jump from the second floor, all i'm saying is the ~2% HP loss at very low heights is annoying and serves no purpose.

Edited by Borsti

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Posted (edited)
19 hours ago, Borsti said:

Where is the Point in 1 or 2% HP loss after "falling" from a little over 1 meter. Realy, where is the point? It may be realistic, but there are tons of realistic things which are not in the game for some reason.

 

Also: in Reality i could carefully  climb down a two to three meter high wall. But climbing down anything (besides ladders) is simply not in the game. So yeah, It realy comes down to realism when i "fall" 1 meter, because i am unable to carefully climb down and afterwards the medic can heal me instantly in 1,5 seconds. So, back in the days, as a gunner, how often did your medic massage your ankles for two seconds for a realistic insta-Heal?;)

 

On top of that: My game character might have 30KG of gear to carry around, but i can't feel that in front of my monitor. Thats why there is a UI Element for Stamina i.e. 

 

Again, i am not saying anyone should be able to jump from the second floor, all i'm saying is the ~2% HP loss at very low heights is annoying and serves no purpose.

First of all, yes every little thing counts and Squad simply cannot simulate Everything to a T, thus there have to be a compromise, let alone not to mention the game is still being developed.  Those little things in real life you call one or two percent? 99% of those is what usually where those 1% strains on your body added up, especially when rolling an ankle or two jumping down, even carefully. Let me tell you from my perspective both as gunner and as medic, since I happened to be both (two enlistments one 19D and then 68w).

From the gunners perspective in the way big fking yes, with the shit ton of Motrin and unable to go on the mission once due to rolled ankle while gently as possible climbing down from the turret, onto the hood and then ground. While medic wasn't there, the amounts of Motrin he prescribed in quantity was pretty hefty and he came for me later with an ice pack.

Have you ever tried to climb a wall "gently" while being shot at or harried by your sergeant due to low time frame while wearing 60lb kit at minimum? Good luck that gentle climb up and down.

Now here is my opinion as former medic. - the vast majority of injuries I treated was surprisingly not combat related at all, but due to Pvt Carl and Bobby McFckFck doing heroic shit like that. - Obstacle courses, road marches such as someone stepping in a pothole, at least two times I can remember due to some dimwit trying to poke a rattlesnake, another time someone being tangled up in concertina wire. The worst I remember one guy going into anaphylactic shock because his buddies pranked him to sit on a fire ant hill. Those incidents may not sound related, but the reality is those are the most common problems in combat deployments that take out soldiers out of the fight and not the enemy (by far and wide). And yes, it was pretty common for me to "massage the booboo" because some private Carl climbed a wall or even vaulted a fence and his plus 60lbs of body armor, helmet and weapon landed the wrong way. Of course as stereotypical medic I also carried bag of Motrin as well for those moments. So yes, that 1% does matter. Notice that most medics wont even bother to heal you in the game if you see that you just fell off let's say a garage or a mud wall. The Squad as the game can't just show it realistically.

Instead of the medic giving Motrin and water animation, we have magical medical pouches that if existed in real life, probably could of been capable of curing AIDS. As for the stairs, I don't seem to have had any problem with them in Squad. Never failed to climb one. In either case I always tried to be that magical medic like in Squad and in the way it is something akin the game trying to remind you, this is not Battlefield or CoD or PUBG, where recklessly running around is encouraged. 

Edited by Caliell

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Posted (edited)
On 7/28/2018 at 8:15 PM, Caliell said:

I have to ask, have you ever jumped off a Humvee, let alone a wall wearing about 60lbs worth of combat gear on you? As former 240 gunner, climbing into that Humvee turret up and down all day in Iraq in 100 degree heat felt awfully painful on my knees. So imagine a fall from the high wall in all of that battle rattle. I think what bleeding simulates well is someone passing out from pain of the fractures.

Poor knees, but in all honesty, in Squad if u did what u described you'd literally die in like 4 jumps or start to bleed out. So yes, it needs a nerf, and I've jumped from the top of MK 23/7 Ton truck(taller then ur humvee) with full combat gear as well while carrying weird shit cuz I'm Artillery in the SAME heat and didnt fall over, need a corpsman, or die. May not have been the softest landing but knees bend and one has strong calf and thigh muscles for a reason. Now accidentally falling off the 7 ton when I wasnt even trying to get out of it was a different story... that needed a medevac and surgery and dont forget a 9 inch scar that's a party favorite to show off

Edited by NelsonH

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