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SpecialAgentJohnson

Hand grenade bounce-back solution

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Posted (edited)

In reality it is very easy to lob in a grenade through a window. In Squad it is one of the most dangerous endeavours you could imagine, most often resulting in the grenade bouncing back from the wall landing next to you and blowing up yourself and your teammates, pissing them off as well. It is generally not recommended to lob grenades through windows even though in reality it is like the most common use case for a hand grenade. Clearing out buildings... So I suggest a solution to the problem: 

 

How about - much like deploying bipods on certain window surfaces - you could like, get the option to "hook onto the hole" if you are close enough, and press the right mouse button to practically guarantee (through software) that the bloody nade does go through the hole EVERY time! This would improve gameplay tremendously and be much more realistic as well. Should be dead easy to drop something inside an open window even for a child. Anyway, I think this is a very good suggestion. Right mouse button should be left as it is today. Please let me know what you think of it. :-)

 

 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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Any window with a proper window frame has a high chance of returning your nade. Had this scenario happen to me before and watched a friend do the exact same thing so yes please to your suggestion. Some form of close to window auto nade deployment is needed. It could even use the same key for deploying bipods but instead, with nade in hand,  chuck through the window without fail when close enough like bipods resting works.

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Just now, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

I think right mouse button is actually intended for that kind of action. Although" unguided".

Right mouse is underarm throw but I guess it could auto lock to a window if close enough but that also could lead to an inadvertent team kill in certain situations.

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Posted (edited)
54 minutes ago, Major Trouble said:

Right mouse is underarm throw but I guess it could auto lock to a window if close enough but that also could lead to an inadvertent team kill in certain situations.

Could be like a text message saying something when able to lock. Although underarm throw is almost never useful for any other kind of situation. But sure, underarm throw still must function whilst in other situations. Like now, when not close to a window proposedly. Bipod button might be fine as well, of course. 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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1 minute ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

Could be like a text message saying something when able to lock. Although underarm throw is almost never useful for any other kind of situation

I use underarm throws a lot especially somewhere like Sumari or when you're on a roof with enemy below and nearby.

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I think the center of the screen should be the angle the grenade is thrown instead of having the character lob it in that direction, would make the game more intuitive.

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44 minutes ago, Randall172 said:

I think the center of the screen should be the angle the grenade is thrown instead of having the character lob it in that direction, would make the game more intuitive.

Please explain more thoroughly. 

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24 minutes ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

Please explain more thoroughly. 

correction your character places their thumb in the direction the grenade will be thrown.

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Posted (edited)
12 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

Just give the option to toggle a guide for the first few meters of travel.

This, you know roughly where a tennis/cricket ball is going to travel when you throw it. It's not making the game more casual by adding a faint guide to the throw animation.

It makes it more realistic. 

Edited by Wonka

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Oh gosh.. It is one of those easy to jump in, hard to master weapons. Fully possible to master it >90%  if the nade throw is not random. The ACE solution makes me want to laugh out. Tartantycos solution isn't much better. 

 

..And yes the hand grenades are the most dangerous weapon for own troops and the user and yes those bouncing nades happen also in real life.

 

Anyway the throw control should be anyway based on the acceleration of the mousewheel spin.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, WARti0k0ne -BG- said:

Oh gosh.. It is one of those easy to jump in, hard to master weapons. Fully possible to master it >90%  if the nade throw is not random. The ACE solution makes me want to laugh out. Tartantycos solution isn't much better. 

 

..And yes the hand grenades are the most dangerous weapon for own troops and the user and yes those bouncing nades happen also in real life.

 

Anyway the throw control should be anyway based on the acceleration of the mousewheel spin.

No not the mouse wheel. And maybe yes they do happen. Maybe once in 40 times because soldiers are stressed out. Though a kid can drop a rock though a window and so should a soldier be able to. In squad it's at best 1 in 2 that doesn't bounce back however close and prepared you are. It's not realistic. 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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i agree with the issue ... and the solution for this ... is like some of the games have is some kind of line or dots of the path .... 

honestly its a very ugly solution

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I personally don't want the dotted solution. That's for ranged throws anyway and you're unlikely to be caught in the blast if you misjudged your aim. There should still be that element of skill to learn for throwing grenades.

 

I am pretty sure irl no grunt is going to throw a grenade at a window which has an inbuilt frame due to the accuracy required to land the shot. Open windows are another proposition. Small bunker windows not so much. We just need a way to reliably punch the grenade inside, or outside, when up close.

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Posted (edited)

For underside throw the hand indicator is not as accurate as for overside throw where the thumb is almost dead on where the nade leaves the player model. In underside throw the trajectory is off by about three finger (game) to right.

Edited by WARti0k0ne -BG-

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Posted (edited)

Maybe a part of the problem is that the trajectory of the underarm throw isn't realistic in a sense that noone would throw a grenade like that because it is too dangerous with that steep arched parabola almost straight upwards. I think a more useful throw would come a little bit more from the right and with a lot flatter trajectory/parabola. I also find that the underarm throw has too much power in it. When lobbing over a wall it goes way off up in the air often landing too far away to be useful. Maybe right mouse button should really be a very short overarm throw instead. Would be much more useful. Though wouldn't look like the movies. Honestly -does anyone ever use underarm throw for nades in real life even? If you roll a nade across a bumpy street it might stop just about anywhere making it very dangerous and difficult to control. If you stood by a window, would you use an underarm throw really? Or would you point your arm out and basically drop the nade inside? Same goes for dropping a nade over a wall. Would you really use an underarm throw? Any use case for underarm throw I can think of in real life would be to throw a nade under a car or something. All MRAPs have armor underneath though so not much use for that. Throwing just a single few nades in the army I remember them as quite heavy also. 

 

Still, if they can do vaulting then maybe they could do something better still. 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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4 minutes ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

x-snip-x I also find that the underarm throw has too much power in it. When lobbing over a wall it goes way off up in the air often landing too far away to be useful.

 

Still, if they can do vaulting then maybe they could do something better still. 

That is the reason I'm promoter of the mousewheel as power control mechanism for the nade throws (among others) and not just for weapon selection.

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1 hour ago, WARti0k0ne -BG- said:

That is the reason I'm promoter of the mousewheel as power control mechanism for the nade throws (among others) and not just for weapon selection.

Mouse wheels can vary in quality though and maybe some people don't even have one. Use number for weapons. 

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2 hours ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

Mouse wheels can vary in quality though and maybe some people don't even have one. Use number for weapons. 

I haven't seen a serious mouse since nineties that doesn't have a wheel on it.

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grab frame with bipod key would be nice. Could also use the climb animation in some way. Both of these ideas would require a change to all the windows to work.

 

I'd prefer if the grenade direction was indicated in the game somehow, like @Randall172 suggested. Putting your left arm out as a balance and targeting assist seems like the perfect guide.

I'm not part of the development team but I can confidently tell you that no HUD graphics will be added, dont even bother talking about it...

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Yeah some king of idea where the nade would go or something is a good idea.

Even in real life when you try to trow a stone tru a window you have like 90% or more chance to trow it in.

In squad you dont have any feeling like that more or less is up to chance or practice in the training room.

For me i usually evade trowing nades thru a second story window especially when friendlies around.

I am more into RPG frag round tru the window ;-)

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