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Bonnie Money

Marker restriction is absurd

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If I need to put markers I switch quickly as a new SL to put them, then go back in my squad, but it takes times and it gets messy in the squad.

 

Why just not let 1 or 2 markers available for each squad members ?

 

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Why not just tell your squad leader what to mark... and have them mark it for you...? Like it's supposed to be. 

 

Ya know... communication... teamwork, all that jazz?

Edited by Psyrus

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Yeah I don't get that. Usually between the coordinates, and the geographical marks already on the map, plus whatever the SL puts down from my directions they can usually get it close enough that it's relevant. Marks do not need to be exact down to the meter. If you're constantly having issues getting a SL to put relevant marks on the map, my first thought is one of two things.

1) you're constantly giving piss poor directions to the point that the SL can't figure out what you're saying or where you want the mark.

2) that the information you're giving him isn't relevant enough to bother with. I had a squad mate constantly bitch at me once about "there's enemies in the compound to our east". Yeah, no shit. There's a FOB/HAB 2 compounds over, and we're on the defend flag. Of course they're going to be coming between there and here.... no need to mark the shit out of the map with the obvious. The same applies to insurgent/militia techies. Yes they can do some damage, but it's next to pointless to mark the map with one, because he'll be half way across it in 30 seconds and nowhere near the mark. BRDM/BTR/Striker/MRAP, a little different. But a techie? meh, w/e.

Edited by Ti0mat

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I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

And if the squad is cut in half, the small half should be able to act autonomus.

 

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

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Markers placed on the map are visible to all team members, not just your squad.  Personally, I like the current system because it encourages chain-of-command communication of enemy positions and keeps a lot of nonsense off the map.  With 30+ people having access to the map, it would be littered with the position of every enemy seen.

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On 13/01/2018 at 1:04 AM, Caelib said:

Markers placed on the map are visible to all team members, not just your squad.  Personally, I like the current system because it encourages chain-of-command communication of enemy positions and keeps a lot of nonsense off the map.  With 30+ people having access to the map, it would be littered with the position of every enemy seen.

+1

I was thinking however, that the scout class should be able to place one generic "scout" marker on the map which is limited to one at a time, which the squad leader can look at and then swap out for the more accurate, specific one. Still requires communication but also adds greater depth to the scout role.

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On 1/12/2018 at 12:03 PM, Bonnie Money said:

I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

And if the squad is cut in half, the small half should be able to act autonomus.

 

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

 

That I agree with - looking for e781 is a pain in the ass. But you can always drop a mark and ask how accurate it is. I mean you know instinctively (or should) that E-7-8 is in the upper third of the E7 tile. Just drop a mark and ask how good it is.

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As SL, I take this time in most cases. As SL, I am able to pick up the guy from the map who said "about 200m to the east of me" and in case of doubt I ask again who said that report. Certainly it is not possible in every situation, but in this hot situation you can not mark anything anyway.

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On 1/12/2018 at 12:03 PM, Bonnie Money said:

I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

This is why I'd love to see a dedicated "Comm" role.  Just like in real battle, you have your Squad Lead (Actual) and the Squads Comm guy.  That way, comm guys can talk to comm guys and relay to squad leads, but squad leads can jump on squad chat when needed so they can talk directly to each other when needed.

 

One game, we actually tried this in a very round-about way.  It was a very interesting experience.  We had an SL but he took a regular rifleman kit and I took the SL kit and in the game I was just a guy handling the logistics of comms, map marker placements, vehicle approvals for the real SL.  He would tell me to tell the other SL's something and I'd pass it along.  If the other SL's were communicating with us, I received the transmission and then passed it along to our real SL.  Anyone in the group that called out enemy position/movements, I was the one to mark which freed him up from having to do it.  Even though I handled all these duties, our "REAL" SL, who was just a rifleman or scout, was the one actually making all the decisions, calling all the shots, telling people where to go, etc.  I stuck to him like glue the entire round so that we could drop RP's where he wanted, he could chat with me in local comms, etc.

 

It was an interesting experience because it freed the SL from some of the more menial tasks like marking the map, approving vehicles, listening to other SL's complain that all the other squads were why the team was loosing, etc.  It was fun for me because it gave me a new role to play and master.  We didn't stick with it because the other Squadies with us had a hard time wrapping their head around the idea since the game obviously wasn't designed to be played like this (with the SL icon on the map being the biggest issue,) but as a proof of concept, it was sort of fun to try.

 

If you are looking to try something different and you play with the same guys on a regular basis, it's something a bit fun to mess around with.

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1 hour ago, 3S_Moe said:

snip

Radiomen are great in something like Arma where you're playing with a clan, I guess even if there are milsim clans playing Squad, but for public matches they'd be an absolute shitshow. It's hard enough getting enough people to step up during a match to squad lead (just about 4 per side), nevermind needing to double that for a radioman for each squad who has just as much responsibility.

 

*snip*
Just wrote  6 paragraph essay about my issues with map markers, radio comms and the vehicle claiming system, especially on ME maps, which I'll spare everyone. As an aside, ME maps tend to be so cramped together, with muddy colours, and a thousand mud huts and walls everywhere, combined with the fact that the average squad is so bad at covering their sectors, that calling out a contact's position can actually be the worst thing you can do, because suddenly you have everyone in the squad checking that direction (which the contact probably isn't even in anymore), and leave yourself wide open to someone else running up to you

*snip*

 

Another change that could be made is having every rifleman be able to mark contacts on the map, but have them only visible to the rest of the squad (to keep things from getting out of hand). Squad leader markers being able to be seen by everyone (perhaps different colours, etc.) This is similar to how it's done in Arma, but has its own whole host of issues that I don't see worthwhile in it being implemented, especially not when there's more important and substantial things the devs could be spending their time on.

 

 

Edited by Kerri

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On 1/24/2018 at 4:58 PM, Kerri said:

Another change that could be made is having every rifleman be able to mark contacts on the map, but have them only visible to the rest of the squad (to keep things from getting out of hand). Squad leader markers being able to be seen by everyone (perhaps different colours, etc.) This is similar to how it's done in Arma, but has its own whole host of issues that I don't see worthwhile in it being implemented, especially not when there's more important and substantial things the devs could be spending their time on.

I still like the idea of a single generic marker for some roles (scout, marksman, etc). Perhaps it's something that could be expanded on... to something as you suggested... but overall I still do not think that the issue of accurately marking 'things' is that big of an issue. If the mark is important enough, the SL will mark it... but they do not need to mark every single enemy the team see's... because as you said, within 30 seconds it's likely useless anyway.

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On 1/12/2018 at 3:03 PM, Bonnie Money said:

I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

And if the squad is cut in half, the small half should be able to act autonomus.

 

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

My only thing on this that drives me nuts the fact that the lins are so thin and i can barely tell the differense between grids/keypads/sub grids the lins need to be bolder or on a diff color scheme. if i could see the lins better it would be much faster to mark positions. as of now i have to sit there looking at it moving my mouse curser around in order to find grids.

Edited by ♠DEG♠

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18 minutes ago, ♠DEG♠ said:

My only thing on this that drives me nuts the fact that the lins are so thin and i can barely tell the differense between grids/keypads/sub grids the lins need to be bolder or on a diff color scheme. if i could see the lins better it would be much faster to mark positions. as of now i have to sit there looking at it moving my mouse curser around in order to find grids.

This!!

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The whole point of having the SL role is to take on certain responsibilities that other roles do not have. this is one of them. Let them do their job of marking the map

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On 1/12/2018 at 3:03 PM, Bonnie Money said:

I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

And if the squad is cut in half, the small half should be able to act autonomus.

 

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

Honestly you probably aren't the best fit to be a squad leader then. The SL should not be the one doing 100% of the shooting. The SL should be the one making the decisions, marking targets(this is why ONLY the SL has tracers as a rifleman), and generally keeping the squad informed. If your squad is "cut in half" and "should be able to act autonomous" then that other half needs to be its own squad.

 

Allowing subordinates to mark targets and place move markers undermines the SL.

If you have lead a Squad before, you would know by now that people won't follow you if you don't lead. Simple as that.

If people start making decisions for you, then you aren't the leader.

Edited by Nossa

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1 hour ago, Japub said:

This!!

Buy a bigger/ higher resolution screen.

 

Easy fix.

 

Assuming you can afford/able to do so that is.

 

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11 hours ago, Nossa said:

Buy a bigger/ higher resolution screen.

 

Easy fix.

 

Assuming you can afford/able to do so that is.

 

...

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On 1/27/2018 at 2:48 PM, Nossa said:

Buy a bigger/ higher resolution screen.

 

Easy fix.

 

Assuming you can afford/able to do so that is.

 

Really? The map grid lines are terrible ever since they changed them.it deff needs attention! What kind of mil sim has a map in it that's grid lines are barely legible.

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Only Squad Leaders should have access to place markers on the map. 

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back to this again...the reason no markers for everyone? Trolls...some smart arse will draw allover the map as happened when this ability was there before. Limit to SL or additional fire team lead when fireteams appear.

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On 1/10/2018 at 8:52 PM, Bonnie Money said:

If I need to put markers I switch quickly as a new SL to put them, then go back in my squad, but it takes times and it gets messy in the squad.

 

Why just not let 1 or 2 markers available for each squad members ?

 

Think about it. What you are requesting is that each member of a team be allowed to place 2 markers. That means you'd have the possibility of 80 markers on a map at any given time. When 100 player servers are enabled, it will be 100 markers on a map at a time.

 

Also, when developing a game you need to do everything you can to enforce/encourage behaviours you desire in your players. In this case, communication is a big part of Squad and it has been developed in this way. To do what you are asking would take away another instance of encouraging player communication in the game.

 

There is your answer.

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On 29/01/2018 at 4:15 PM, ♠DEG♠ said:

Really? The map grid lines are terrible ever since they changed them.it deff needs attention! What kind of mil sim has a map in it that's grid lines are barely legible.

 

On 29/01/2018 at 4:15 PM, ♠DEG♠ said:

Buy a bigger/ higher resolution screen.

Playing at 3840x2160 on a 32" screen and the grid lines are also way too thin to be useful. At what resolution and with what size screen do they look ok?

 

I think that the change to such fine lines puts a dependency on using the cursor instead of actually map reading, de-skilling the players; so I'd like to see it restored to the old style grid lines.

Also be good to see the SL marker reduced in size again, perhaps closer to where it was as it's large enough to obscure three squad members right now.

 

Protegimus

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23 minutes ago, Protegimus said:

 

Playing at 3840x2160 on a 32" screen and the grid lines are also way too thin to be useful. At what resolution and with what size screen do they look ok?

 

I think that the change to such fine lines puts a dependency on using the cursor instead of actually map reading, de-skilling the players; so I'd like to see it restored to the old style grid lines.

Also be good to see the SL marker reduced in size again, perhaps closer to where it was as it's large enough to obscure three squad members right now.

 

Protegimus

+1

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On 1/12/2018 at 3:03 PM, Bonnie Money said:

I sometimes play SL, but everytime I play SL I have to manage many things* and you don't have the time to find the E 7-8-1 square or even near.

 

And if the squad is cut in half, the small half should be able to act autonomus.

 

 

*such as thinking while talking to squad, talking in local, talking to others squad leaders, while driving, while putting markers all the time on the map, plus watching around and be alert for ennemies. 

Sorry to say it but I don't think you're cut out to SL then. There's a lot of work for an SL and its a lot of responsibility. I like how squad members have to pass location marks to their SL, who then can mark and pass it on to other SL's in the command chat. It adds a bit of realism to the comms and puts importance on effective and concise comms. If squad members could just mark things or even add a simple mark so that squad leads could see, then all that extra depth would be lost. Also it would just add way more work for the SL, cause people would mark shit all the time to call out anyone and everyone that shot at them. SL's would spend their entire time updating their marks for the team. It would basically be like marking in battlefield, which is a little too game-y for squad.

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About the map markers ..they should be restricted to SL. but can we get some more attention about the grid lines/layout on the map...cause this is one of my biggest quality of life improvements needed on squad.

I can't tell the damn difference between the lines make em bolder ...more definitive. Ever since they changed them it's a choir to mark something ...and after 800hrs I don't think I'm ever going to get use to it at this point.

Edited by ♠DEG♠

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