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Required experience for being a SL

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On 17/12/2017 at 6:59 PM, BatSithCrazy said:

Or you can join a server "like RIP server" where locked squads are not allowed "Server rules". Some servers like "QFF1 and QFF2" allow locked squads but only if they are runing morter, logistics or armor. If you play on a server that is managed correctly and there are rules against bullshit with good admins you should be able to enjoy Squad a bit more then picking random servers with no rules and miss managed.  

 

As far as SL is consered, befriend a good SL and try adding him to your friends list, play with him or her often if you are not interested in joining a clan.

 

Take note: The locking mechanic is to be used for limiting number of squad members for a certain type of a task that is needed to do the job in the field, this is so that you do not waste manpower like having 9 ppl babysitting a 1 or 2 mortars. If its beeing used for anything ales other then functionality, its abused for favoritism and selectivism.

 

Favoritism and selectivism, is easly managed by server admins. It's in the interest of admins to keep a healthy server, by asking a squad leader of a 5 man, why they locked down their squad and what is the pourpose of the 5 man team. If the squad isnt called mortar team, or logistic, fob, trans squad or something similar that tells the rest of the team what the squads functionality is.

 

Then that 5 man squad should be asked to open their squad to others or be kicked for favoritism and selectivism. period.

 

Added note: Clan Squads should be exempted rule. If they want to do Recon or somthing sneaky behind enemy lines. Nevertheless those squads should state their clan tags in the squad name and squad function, squad name =WAR= MIC ONLY RECON or

[IDF] MORTAR, LOGI, FOB or (RIP) ARMOR 2 PPL MAX.

 

I think locking squads by language is also functionality. All of us ([ANDES]) speaks spanish... and english at different levels. At squad level you need to give information fast and having to think what you are saying or repeating because someone just can´t understand your accent is a no go. SL radio is not a problem, because you just give basic information and mark the map. We always asumme a support role to prevent shit talk from other players.

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1 hour ago, Giongiorris said:

I think locking squads by language is also functionality. All of us ([ANDES]) speaks spanish... and english at different levels. At squad level you need to give information fast and having to think what you are saying or repeating because someone just can´t understand your accent is a no go. SL radio is not a problem, because you just give basic information and mark the map. We always asumme a support role to prevent shit talk from other players.

Yes, of course! if you have a specific language that you only use in the squad. You should be able to lock it down just for that language. But you need to communicate the function of the lock to the rest of the team, in the squad name.

 

Example, [ANDES] SPN MIC ONLY. [ANDES] Clan tag, SPN language, MIC ONLY need to have a mic to play in this squad.

 

If you describe what it is you are locking your squad for, I have no problem. [ANDES] SPN ONLY, MIC or something.

Edited by BatSithCrazy

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On 12/17/2017 at 1:59 PM, BatSithCrazy said:

Take note: The locking mechanic is to be used for limiting number of squad members for a certain type of a task that is needed to do the job in the field, this is so that you do not waste manpower like having 9 ppl babysitting a 1 or 2 mortars. If its beeing used for anything ales other then functionality, its abused for favoritism and selectivism.

 

Favoritism and selectivism, is easly managed by server admins. It's in the interest of admins to keep a healthy server, by asking a squad leader of a 5 man, why they locked down their squad and what is the pourpose of the 5 man team. If the squad isnt called mortar team, or logistic, fob, trans squad or something similar that tells the rest of the team what the squads functionality is.

 

Then that 5 man squad should be asked to open their squad to others or be kicked for favoritism and selectivism. period.

 

Added note: Clan Squads should be exempted rule. If they want to do Recon or somthing sneaky behind enemy lines. Nevertheless those squads should state their clan tags in the squad name and squad function, squad name =WAR= MIC ONLY RECON or

[IDF] MORTAR, LOGI, FOB or (RIP) ARMOR 2 PPL MAX.

 

What a pile of bullshit. Why the hell would you kick a squad that's locked to 5 guys as long as they're not hindering the team and are fighting/defending an active objective? Maybe they just got tired of playing with idiots? You act like favoritism and/or selectivism is a problem - it's not. Currently we get 40 players per team - likely 39 if there's a couple reserved slots (which out of the current populated servers is 12 of the top 14). If you have 5 guys in one squad, that leaves you with 34/35 players for the rest of the squads... which equals (and I know this will be a shock), three 9 man squads, and one 7/8 man squad.

 

Yes, this is absolutely terrible, and clearly hindering the team. O.o Obviously it's MUCH better to have 4x9 and a 4 man squad. :rolleyes

 

Please tell me you're not an admin on a server, and if you are which one... so that I know to avoid it.

 

 

Edited by Ti0mat
Grammer

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Thread title: Required experience for being a SL

 

Just saying....

 

Otherwise I agree with:

1 hour ago, Ti0mat said:

What a pile of bullshit. Why the hell would you kick a squad that's locked to 5 guys as long as they're not hindering the team and are fighting/defending an active objective?

 

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My suggestion for this would be to create a system based on positive ratings only.  Each squad leader should have some sort of number rating next to their names - like the number of times they have been squad leader.  So in the "Squad" list, players can make educated choices when joining squads because they can see that number.

 

If somebody wants to try out being a squad leader for the first time, they are going to have to chance it and earn their way into the rating system.

 

Being a good squad leaders takes practice so creating some sort of end-match voting for all squad members, for example:

 

Did your squad leader do a good job?  Yes / No

 

If at least four squad members vote "Yes", that squad leaders gets a +1.

 

If the developers are going to create something like this, it needs to be troll-proof so a down-voting system will not fly.

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Someone has potential be a great squad leader. But his first and another ten experiences will be terrible because he doesnt know game mechanic at all. People rating him terribly and then others will not follow him because he has terrible ratting. But scenario without rating would be. That after 10th game he will have great round. With ratting he will never know because he gave up. without ratting he will not give up and 11th game is great. And he get selfconfidence. Rattings is not good in first phase of learning. But if people rattings others at begining than it destroy them. Rattings are good in second phase of learning. When rattings is motivation for that peoples. But in first phase its demotivating. This same system we use in schools and result is terrible. Many people have  just terrible performance after that. Just strong souls will get through. But its just couple of percents. Many others great are just destroyed at begining. 

also there are many trolls. Because people are averagely not competent in many situations and act realy realy terrible. Squad leader will do some stuff and just beause of one mistake he will get terrible ratting...For example because he decided stay at defence and in his squad was guys who want CoD action. Than this great leader is literally destroyed. Peoples will regulary positive just in specific situation. Action and .. Action. And just those actin squad leader will have positive rattings. But this game (and life) is not just about action. But about patience, defense, support, silent and discipline. Rattings will kill many great leaders even thay figure out that thay are great. 

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2 hours ago, Ti0mat said:

 

What a pile of bullshit. Why the hell would you kick a squad that's locked to 5 guys as long as they're not hindering the team and are fighting/defending an active objective? Maybe they just got tired of playing with idiots? You act like favoritism and/or selectivism is a problem - it's not. Currently we get 40 players per team - likely 39 if there's a couple reserved slots (which out of the current populated servers is 12 of the top 14). If you have 5 guys in one squad, that leaves you with 34/35 players for the rest of the squads... which equals (and I know this will be a shock), three 9 man squads, and one 7/8 man squad.

 

Yes, this is absolutely terrible, and clearly hindering the team. O.o Obviously it's MUCH better to have 4x9 and a 4 man squad. :rolleyes

 

Please tell me you're not an admin on a server, and if you are which one... so that I know to avoid it.

 

 

I gotta jump in on this... multiple small squads are not good for the game.. you struggle to defend, struggle cap flags and struggle to attack... it takes even more co-ordination at SL chat level ... but the scenario you describe is just the usual gameplay and no issues.  Its when you get 3 or 4, 2/3 man squads..90% of the time they are not there to run supplies or help with mortars...you get multiple little locked squads you are nearly down a whole squad not helping in the game... so for me setting limits on locked squads or when you can lock a squad based on no. of members is beneficial.. 

Edited by embecmom

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Posted (edited)

Having more squads gives you more rally points. If you have more rally points than the other side, you have more players coming into objectives.

 

Also, it's easier to control smaller squads. With 4 man teams (fireteams), I'm easily able to avoid larger squads and get right into cap radius or the enemy FOB, and make sure we have 360 security with each person.

 

A lot of times that 4 man squad can easily take on 9 men as long as you got the right squad leader. Remember those times when just one or two people seem to wipe out your entire squad and you're asking how the hell this is happening? That was my squad.

 

Most of the time you don't have to worry about that though. Squads are usually open and maxed out to 9, specialist locked squads are locked to vehicles or clans, and you'll never have a dozen of 2 man squads because there are simply not enough people who squad lead in the game.

Edited by Cavazos

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1 hour ago, Cavazos said:

Having more squads gives you more rally points. If you have more rally points than the other side, you have more players coming into objectives.

 

Also, it's easier to control smaller squads. With 4 man teams (fireteams), I'm easily able to avoid larger squads and get right into cap radius or the enemy FOB, and make sure we have 360 security with each person.

 

A lot of times that 4 man squad can easily take on 9 men as long as you got the right squad leader. Remember those times when just one or two people seem to wipe out your entire squad and you're asking how the hell this is happening? That was my squad.

 

Most of the time you don't have to worry about that though. Squads are usually open and maxed out to 9, specialist locked squads are locked to vehicles or clans, and you'll never have a dozen of 2 man squads because there are simply not enough people who squad lead in the game.

I sometimes split my squad in two teams Alpha & Bravo (classic fire/assault) and take the lead of one of them and "promoting" a member of the second one as corporal to lead the second team.

Depending on the members and on the corporal abilities (and of course, on mines too :D I'm certainly not the best SL ever xD I just do my best for the Country), usually works quite well.

 

-----------------------------------------

 

I regularly played as SL since my 30-50 first hours on Squad ; I announce since the beginning that I'd do my best and that I'm open to new ideas or tips from veterans in my squad ; with practice and an open-mind its possible to be a satisfying SL. We even "won" (well, not alone xD) games with a full english speaking squad while I'm french, SLing,  and my accent is terrible...

 

And believe me, If I can do that, many others can xD

 

I admit it can be annoying to be in a beginner's squad but as long as he's open to ideas and tips, very good things can be done ; we should not forget that the best and fastest way to learn is by making mistakes ; just make them "cleverly" and learn form your squadmates who know the game better than us, and even a beginner can effectively lead a squad to victory.

 

One last word : I suggest reading the +++++'s SL guide which is a master piece ;) (pour les francophones, je l'ai traduit, voir en 2ème page du lien)

There's also FeatherSton3's one which you can find here.

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A good leader can organize a squad into two fireteams which will work organically with one another. Too many squad leaders try to micro manage every single aspect of their squad. That's not how it's supposed to be done. That's how a squad gets wiped out in a situation it should otherwise survive. Leadership should be done from the ground up. When you've got a squad split into two fireteams providing bounding security for one another and organization into a base of fire element and maneuver element, you've got yourself a very dynamic group to play with. Assigning two team leaders to a squad frees the squad leader to perform other tasks. Team leaders should be the ones ordering their individual fireteam members, and Squad leaders should be ordering their two Team leaders. It should be simple.

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3 minutes ago, WendyVonBraun said:

A good leader can organize a squad into two fireteams which will work organically with one another. Too many squad leaders try to micro manage every single aspect of their squad. That's not how it's supposed to be done. That's how a squad gets wiped out in a situation it should otherwise survive. Leadership should be done from the ground up. When you've got a squad split into two fireteams providing bounding security for one another and organization into a base of fire element and maneuver element, you've got yourself a very dynamic group to play with. Assigning two team leaders to a squad frees the squad leader to perform other tasks. Team leaders should be the ones ordering their individual fireteam members, and Squad leaders should be ordering their two Team leaders. It should be simple.

Really? In a public match playing with random people? People you can't even pronounce their nick names or know their depth of knowledge of the game? I don't think so. In a perfect world sure yeah or with friends but not so much in a public match.

 

I, on the other hand, keep things simple by getting my entire 9-man squad (including myself) to fight on the same objective. The only time I separate the squad is in the early beginning by putting myself + 2 medics + LAT in the Logi and the rest in another vehicle on our way to our objective. The rest of the match my squad will stay together as much as possible.

 

The reason for this is pretty straight forward; There is 0% guarantee the same 8 guys in my squad will remain online for the duration of the match whereas I know I will (most of the time). Less micromanaging = more effective. 

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Random SL doing shit is not a problem for me. I'll just joing another squad or create my own. In fact, it is the way of the Squad to allow SLs to do whatever they want. But that's where it gets tricky and it is precisely the point that irritates me. SLs are reserved the right to kick member for whatever reason and sometimes they will kick you just because his BFF started a fight with you even though you're not even paying attention to his shenanigans. You're are just focusing at the task at hand like an disciplined soldier. This one match in particular I had to open a squad just to myself because all other were full and his was locked with 8 people in it. It turns out that at the end of the match I killed a lot more than this whole squad together, operating without a squad with a medic to revive me and fall in together.

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Just now, CptDirty said:

Really? In a public match playing with random people? People you can't even pronounce their nick names or know their depth of knowledge of the game? I don't think so. In a perfect world sure yeah or with friends but not so much in a public match.

 

I, on the other hand, keep things simple by getting my entire 9-man squad (including myself) to fight on the same objective. The only time I separate the squad is in the early beginning by putting myself + 2 medics + LAT in the Logi and the rest in another vehicle on our way to our objective. The rest of the match my squad will stay together as much as possible.

 

The reason for this is pretty straight forward; There is 0% guarantee the same 8 guys in my squad will remain online for the duration of the match whereas I know I will (most of the time). Less micromanaging = more effective. 

I've had plenty of games where 8 randoms turned out being the best players I've ever led. In fact usually that is the case for me. I've put exactly what I've explained in practice many times successfully. Even on free weekends.

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10 hours ago, WendyVonBraun said:

I've had plenty of games where 8 randoms turned out being the best players I've ever led. In fact usually that is the case for me. I've put exactly what I've explained in practice many times successfully. Even on free weekends.

Me too, I have posted about it previously... but pretty much the only requirement for a good squad experience is having people willing to follow orders. New players are equally as capable of doing that as experienced players, and often have a better attitude about it as well!

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6 hours ago, Psyrus said:

Me too, I have posted about it previously... but pretty much the only requirement for a good squad experience is having people willing to follow orders. New players are equally as capable of doing that as experienced players, and often have a better attitude about it as well!

+1

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Psyrus said:

Me too, I have posted about it previously... but pretty much the only requirement for a good squad experience is having people willing to follow orders. New players are equally as capable of doing that as experienced players, and often have a better attitude about it as well!

This. You get a group of pubbies that listen and actually follow your directions, then it can be a joy. Obviously your directions need to make sense, which means you need a plan and need to know what you're doing, but as long as that's the case and your squadies are not completely incompetent, then everyone can have a good time - even if they are a bunch of random's with varying degree's of experience.

 

As someone following a SL around (because sometimes you just want to go shoot ppl and not SL), even with a ton of hours, I have zero issues following one around who's giving clear and concise orders. Some may think he's being an ass by micro managing you - but as long as the orders make sense and it's not completely over the top, it's fine. Besides, if you don't like it, you're always free to join another squad or create your own.

 

Edited by Ti0mat

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There is a lot of joy going from raw to competent squad. And to hear " this is the best squad ever"(even with a loss). It's that group Co operation that pushe's it over the top.

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My only problem with the micro managing is that you're now listening to the input of 8 players whereas splitting your squad into fireteams minimizes that to only 2 players. It frees up your comms, you can coordinate with other squads much easier, you'll be much more effective in your role as another rifle along the line too since you're more focused on the fluid situation in front of you as opposed to focusing on why player limpd*ck54 isn't crouched looking east. I'm not saying it's for everyone, it's foreign to most people. But coming from a military background, I strongly believe this is how it should be done, and *I* do it with a reasonable degree of success.

Next time you play as SL give this way a try, and tell us your results in detail. It's good for the community to develop and share new methods. if it works for you then it may work for others.

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14 minutes ago, Smee said:

There is a lot of joy going from raw to competent squad. And to hear " this is the best squad ever"(even with a loss). It's that group Co operation that pushe's it over the top.

 

12 hours ago, Psyrus said:

Me too, I have posted about it previously... but pretty much the only requirement for a good squad experience is having people willing to follow orders. New players are equally as capable of doing that as experienced players, and often have a better attitude about it as well!

Absolutely this...

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On 12/19/2017 at 6:05 PM, PolishKruk said:

TLDR: Its a catch 22. You can't prevent new players from being SL without simultaneously requiring veteran players to take the role. More people need to tackle the role so the same five guys on a team don't get burnt out.

Nailed it on the head.

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Posted (edited)

A bigger issue is joining a squad, picking a role, then the squad leader saying am not leading, leaving the squad and rejoining. You then get given it in the middle of the map and are unable to do anything until your next death. 

Also from experience, I gave up as SL. My main support for the team as a whole was to be on defence. Too many SL and squads just want to attack. You MUST have a squad on defence or your team can never push forward. Personally I find being on defence setting my men and giving them positions and arc's as very rewarding. Finding players who find defending is not easy or that will hold where you ask to be. SAW or roof, Marksman outside on over watch, infantry on 360 arc's

 

Being on defence it's quiet... then hell on earth as you are attacked.. that for me is more enjoyable than the cluster f* that happens with lone wolfs. 

Edited by Para

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Posted (edited)
On 1/1/2018 at 8:00 AM, Cavazos said:

Also, it's easier to control smaller squads. With 4 man teams (fireteams), I'm easily able to avoid larger squads and get right into cap radius or the enemy FOB, and make sure we have 360 security with each person.

 

This can't be stressed enough - especially for newer SLs. Lock your squad at 6/7 people, and while it doesn't sound like much of a difference over 9, it is. Although it really depends on who some of the squad members are. You get a few very experienced members who are precise with their callouts, do not clutter the coms and help the SL out, and it's easy to SL them. But a bunch of intermediate players or newer ones... for a newer SL, the smaller the squad, the easier their job will be.

 

The only disappointing thing about a smaller squad is you do not get that very valuable 2nd LAT kit until you have 8 players. But depending on who you're playing this may not be a big deal.

Edited by Ti0mat

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I was playing SL yesterday and I explicitly named the squad with something in portuguese so I could play with my friend and perhaps some wondering brazilian in american servers could join. Yet a lot of nonbrazilian folks joined. Well, not to worry. I shall do my duty and be a proper SL.

 

I've got the transport truck and moved to the flank of the enemy captured flag. Set up a rally point. Ordered my two ATs to go first so they could destroy the parked Striker just waiting to get destroyed so after that the rest of the squad, counting on them, could advance. They took 5min to walk less than 100m and still couldn't do it.

After we all died, the enemy striker has moved away from that flag. I ordered my scoped riflemen and marksman to take position in the hill, hold fire until the rest of the squad reaches the wall of the village where the flag was and then shoot everybody on the rooftops and anyone else they could see inside the village before we could fall in killing the remains.

 

Again, we lost. Such a simple task. Sometimes we have to understand, even though we do have stupid SLs, that there are a lot of noobs playing that don't do justice to the good SLs too.

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I dont get why everybody is against a ranking system?!

I get that nobody likes leveling up for perks, unlocks and so on. A rank should not give you any gameplay advantage in a realistic, teamplay-oriented tactic-shooter like Squad. This would ruin the whole purpose of the game. 

But what is wrong with a ranking system? I think a ranking system WITHOUT any advantages besides having a certain rank/level is a really good thing. Such a level is just for you. And maybe for the example for squad leader you can see how experienced he might be. And this is not breaking the game/giving a disadvantage. It is just helping the teamplay aspect, because it is just normal that you do not promote new players to a leading-position.

But the most important thing is: you can see a progress FOR YOURSELF! and statistics are always very important and interesting (for me). I just like to see my progress. Coming everyday back to a game, playing it for hours and you can not see what you have done with all your time can be a very demotivating.

Edited by keen

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