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Mad Ani

Quality of players during sales and the game being ruined

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3 minutes ago, LuckyJack888 said:

1. There is no significant reward or penalty for not following orders. Points mean very little and there is no rank or recognition system.

2. Although you haven't even played a single round, we trust that you have the brains and experience to lead a squad, take command of your team's vehicle assets, place FOBS, spend the build points on someone else's FOB, and generally ruin the gaming experience of other players.


1. Follow orders = have fun. Dont follow = get kicked from the squad. That's enough reward, penalty I think.

2. Well if there's noone better to take the job, that's what happens. History is filled with incompetent commanders.

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10 minutes ago, Peerun said:


1. Follow orders = have fun. Dont follow = get kicked from the squad. That's enough reward, penalty I think.

2. Well if there's noone better to take the job, that's what happens. History is filled with incompetent commanders.

I'm just going to go ahead and fall back on my earlier point about fanboys.

 

1. You can't "kick" a Squad Leader. Furthermore, your statement that kicking a squad member is "enough reward, penalty" is a typical fanboy response. So the reward is not getting kicked? GTFO

2. Your second rebuttal is also a fanboy response that amounts to "so what?"

 

Having a "so what" "the game is perfect" attitude won't help the developers make a better gaming experience.

 

Something that you'll learn in the art of writing is that you want beta readers that will offer constructive criticism. Those who provide feedback like yours won't help the author improve his work and sell more books. You aren't helping anybody by having a "so what" "just deal with it" attitude.

 

There is obviously a real issue here that requires a real solution.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, LuckyJack888 said:

There is obviously a real issue here that requires a real solution.


Agreed.
However, I don't see how your suggestion solves anything. You can still have a serverful of unranked/low rank players and then, what?

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1 hour ago, LuckyJack888 said:

Something that you'll learn in the art of writing is that you want beta readers that will offer constructive criticism. Those who provide feedback like yours won't help the author improve his work and sell more books. You aren't helping anybody by having a "so what" "just deal with it" attitude.


The art of writing is obviously not something that you have picked up.

1 hour ago, LuckyJack888 said:

You can't "kick" a Squad Leader. Furthermore, your statement that kicking a squad member is "enough reward, penalty" is a typical fanboy response. So the reward is not getting kicked? GTFO

So what reward, other than playing the game, would you recommend? Should the game follow you on Twitter?

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1 hour ago, LuckyJack888 said:

Your second rebuttal is also a fanboy response that amounts to "so what?"

I was simply stating a fact. If you're having a dinner party, but you don't own any cutlery, you would do good being prepared to get your hands dirty.

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I'm not naming and shaming here, but a guy with 0.0 hours in SQUAD joins the server and instantly makes a squad. He then starts asking how to place markers on the map (great that he's typing and asking). This is where SL kit should really have a minimum amount of hours before unlocking the kit. I know it has been discussed many times and split decision, but this just goes to show people jumping right into SL role without even playing the game at all to learn any of the basics or learning the maps.

By the way, the round just started that's why squads were starting to fill up in the screenshot...

unknown.png


 

By the way, I'm not bashing the noobs, I'm giving opinion on the mechanics.

 

Just to prove it, here's a video of me helping the noobs. We try our best to teach them stuff.


https://www.twitch.tv/videos/185311578

Edited by Mad Ani

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4 minutes ago, Mad Ani said:

I'm not naming and shaming here, but a guy with 0.0 hours in SQUAD joins the server and instantly makes a squad. He then starts asking how to place markers on the map (great that he's typing and asking). This is where SL kit should really have a minimum amount of hours before unlocking the kit. I know it has been discussed many times and split decision, but this just goes to show people jumping right into SL role without even playing the game at all to learn any of the basics or learning the maps.

By the way, the round just started that's why squads were starting to fill up in the screenshot...

unknown.png

 

Its also been mentioned a few times before, but I think the best way to deal with this is an "SL rank", not barring people from giving it a go.  Who knows?  Maybe the kid is a prodigy and deserves a chance?  Maybe he's seen it all on youtube and theres no one else making a squad?

 

Its good to let them have a crack at it, but there should be fair warning for other people on his team.  Either so they can join the squad and help him, or so other SLs don't expect too much of the dude and get angry when he doesn't deliver.

 

Much like on these forums how there are forum ranks, a similar system could be good for SLs.  Nothing to do with "XP" or "kills" or any shit like that, just a review how many hours he's spent leading.

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Just now, Kendo said:

 

Its also been mentioned a few times before, but I think the best way to deal with this is an "SL rank", not barring people from giving it a go.  Who knows?  Maybe the kid is a prodigy and deserves a chance?  Maybe he's seen it all on youtube and theres no one else making a squad?

 

Its good to let them have a crack at it, but there should be fair warning for other people on his team.  Either so they can join the squad and help him, or so other SLs don't expect too much of the dude and get angry when he doesn't deliver.

 

Much like on these forums how there are forum ranks, a similar system could be good for SLs.  Nothing to do with "XP" or "kills" or any shit like that, just a review how many hours he's spent leading.

Showing ranks based on time played in the game would be cool! Then we can see instantly who is new or not. Just ideas throwing out there.

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I am glad i am not the only one that the free weekend stuff and sales is killing the game or at least making some of us players fearing a free weekend and sales.

Its killing me i swear i will just stop playing it when the time is like that.

The new free weekend player will not think game is good because there is a lot of new players and he dose not know a thing about game that's a really bad move i think.

If you want people spending money and buying your game make updates and the people will see how awesome the game is amd buy it no matter the cost.

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On 2017. 11. 5. at 3:32 AM, LuckyJack888 said:

I love these fanboy yoga teacher "Let's hold hands and sing Kumbaya" responses.

The thing is it has to be you that keep the positive mood and fluctuate when situations are given. I know it sounds dumb but it is what it is..

On 2017. 11. 5. at 3:32 AM, LuckyJack888 said:

If the majority of the community is complaining about poor gameplay experience during sales (and they most certainly are) then there's a problem. No amount of "just light some candles, relax and breath a little while you try to open up your heart chakra" is going to make the problem go away.

 

Remeber, more money they earn, more works can they can put into this game. 

 

On 2017. 11. 5. at 3:32 AM, LuckyJack888 said:

1. You will follow orders without question, hesitation, complaint or suggestion.

2. You are retard that doesn't know anything. The word "recruit" and "retard" means exactly the same thing.

3. You aren't qualified to do anything, say anything or lead anything. See #2.

1. One of the biggest problem of Squad as of right now. You need to realize you are playing a military game. You are not in a military. SL shouldn't be condescending most of times. Yea if your squad is not following order, act like a leader. LEAD do not CONDESCEND.

2. Whoa take it easy. And who is "You"? and No it doesn't mean same 

On 2017. 11. 5. at 3:32 AM, LuckyJack888 said:

1. There is no significant reward or penalty for not following orders. Points mean very little and there is no rank or recognition system.

1. SL has every right to kick you out of squad when situation is given. That's the penalty. 

  True that points means less ATM but you need to remember....

Squad is still in Alpha stage

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While i think suchs ranking based on hours could be a fine addition,  im not sure if it would rly help towards new players being SL. Its basicly just a faster way of seing their hours?. Besides think i saw some OWI info a while back where they said rankings will not happen. (not 100% sure tho) .

 

The only possible way is to lock SL to amount of 100 hours maybe, or maybe a forced 10 hours in all classes to unlock it. But honestly im not sure thats rly a good solution either.

 

There is rly no quick fix. I never SL, so this might sound hollow, but my hope is SL´s would be abit more friendly towards new players especially with the free weekend coming up.


 

 

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53 minutes ago, S^^ said:

While i think suchs ranking based on hours could be a fine addition,  im not sure if it would rly help towards new players being SL. Its basicly just a faster way of seing their hours?. Besides think i saw some OWI info a while back where they said rankings will not happen. (not 100% sure tho) .

 

The only possible way is to lock SL to amount of 100 hours maybe, or maybe a forced 10 hours in all classes to unlock it. But honestly im not sure thats rly a good solution either.

 

There is rly no quick fix. I never SL, so this might sound hollow, but my hope is SL´s would be abit more friendly towards new players especially with the free weekend coming up.


 

 

We are friendly and assist but there's a point of them not listening to really simple instructions. It's like they don't even have their headset on.  After so many rounds of this you log off thinking that was so much effort and stress, plus it's getting worse. That's the point of this thread. Not to mock or shame the noobs but to highlight a general feeling amongst those of us that have been around for a long time. So many rounds has nobody stepping up SL and this is why day zero noobs stepping up and not knowing the absolute basics of the game.

 

There are some games out there that FORCE new players to do training or a short prologue before it unlocks multilayer. I think THIS might benefit everyone! ^_^

Edited by Mad Ani

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This thread is some of the most arrogant stuff I have read in a long long time.
The act of superiority and people sitting on pedistal is straight out sad.


I have been in this game since the absolute first day and spent more hours than most in it which means I know a lot of the faces in this thread.
I know that once upon a time you had no idea how to play, you could not follow simple instructions and you would wander around like headless chickens and I was left sitting, is it so damn hard?

Yeah, Squad is kind of hard. It has a lot of small stuff that takes ages to learn ,edge cases you need to learn because of experience and stuff that you need to try before it doesn't work. And it does this while having almost NO information to the new player. We're an early access game, it's easy for those of us who has played for a while to know the in and out because content grew very slowly so we got really used quickly to everything.

But a new player, especially non PR players (Which are the VAST majority) comes in never having played a game with:

FOBs and rally mechanics
Having to join a group and team up.
A flag system like Squad
Kit restrictions and structured teams (Infantry squads, vehicles, logistics, gigantic map)
Different weapons for different purposes
"Advanced" medic system.


I mean the usual player comes from Call Of Duty or Battlefield, if you're lucky Red Orchestra or Rising Storm.
COD? Do they even have medics? BF? Yeah OK, defrib. and medic bag, some what comparable but still not. Also running from the same location over and over in most cases ( I know spawn radios exist) etc etc.


It's a **** ton of things for them to learn, and one match takes 45-60 minutes and doesn't exactly cover all stages of the game.

And instead of helping, being glad that we're getting more players and growing as a game which will only mean more content in terms of mods and other variations, you sit here cesspooling about how annoying it is that someone asks you which rocket goes for vehicles and which goes for infantry?

And some of you clan people whom I have never ever seen playing anything above 12vs12 or 18vs18 without coalitions, how do you expect to ever get to 50vs50 with a player base of 2000 players per day?

Here's a hint: You won't.


And what's even more laughable is the fact that you act superior and arrogant like you're all knowing when the reality is that you all SUCKED once upon a time. And when you sucked the game was much easier than it was today. Spawning was just slapping down a FOB, didn't need a logi, didn't need a HAB.

There were no vehicles to care about.
Invasion? Conquest? Nope. You just had AAS, and in rare cases, insurgency.
You were protected by your sandbag from everything, you didn't need to watch the skys in case someone decides to drop a mortar on your head.
You never ever drove around worrying about mines or IEDs.


It's against the forum rules to name drop, but here's a few things I've seen PLAYERS IN THIS THREAD acting like you're so good do the last 45 days:


Player 1, clan player: Pick marksman over LAT as US vs Russia on Yehorivka AAS v1. You know the map were russia has 3 damn BTR's and 2 MTLB's that your little M110 can't do crap against. Proceeded to die multiple times.

Player 2, clan player: Sit on an uncap flag saying "When you cap X we'll be capping this instantly!!!" and not answering when told that we're never going to cap it because we're 9 people down.

Player 3, clan player during CCFN (Supposed to be somewhat high skill level): Spend 10 minutes walking around trying to "flank" and then keep fighting on an uncap after defensive objective was lost for about 10 minutes until game lost.

Player 4, no clan what I know: Decided that a fantastic idea was to drive the BTR straight into Stepne and was very suprised when he instantly died. Blamed infantry for not covering him.


I can go on for a while, but I'm pretty sure I've made my point.

And here's another fact, for some of us who plays this game A LOT and at a high competitive level, how good do you think you are in our eyes?
Do you hear us constantly shitting on you on forums and being annoyed that you're joining our public games?



Remember what you all came from, because a while back you were all new, didn't have a clue what was happening or how to play the game and someone taught you the ropes and had their patience with you.


Pay it forward and show some respect. These are humans trying to have fun. Just like you.


Regards, Nordic.

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27 minutes ago, Nordic said:

This thread is some of the most arrogant stuff I have read in a long long time.
The act of superiority and people sitting on pedistal is straight out sad.


I have been in this game since the absolute first day and spent more hours than most in it which means I know a lot of the faces in this thread.
I know that once upon a time you had no idea how to play, you could not follow simple instructions and you would wander around like headless chickens and I was left sitting, is it so damn hard?

Yeah, Squad is kind of hard. It has a lot of small stuff that takes ages to learn ,edge cases you need to learn because of experience and stuff that you need to try before it doesn't work. And it does this while having almost NO information to the new player. We're an early access game, it's easy for those of us who has played for a while to know the in and out because content grew very slowly so we got really used quickly to everything.

But a new player, especially non PR players (Which are the VAST majority) comes in never having played a game with:

FOBs and rally mechanics
Having to join a group and team up.
A flag system like Squad
Kit restrictions and structured teams (Infantry squads, vehicles, logistics, gigantic map)
Different weapons for different purposes
"Advanced" medic system.


I mean the usual player comes from Call Of Duty or Battlefield, if you're lucky Red Orchestra or Rising Storm.
COD? Do they even have medics? BF? Yeah OK, defrib. and medic bag, some what comparable but still not. Also running from the same location over and over in most cases ( I know spawn radios exist) etc etc.


It's a **** ton of things for them to learn, and one match takes 45-60 minutes and doesn't exactly cover all stages of the game.

And instead of helping, being glad that we're getting more players and growing as a game which will only mean more content in terms of mods and other variations, you sit here cesspooling about how annoying it is that someone asks you which rocket goes for vehicles and which goes for infantry?

And some of you clan people whom I have never ever seen playing anything above 12vs12 or 18vs18 without coalitions, how do you expect to ever get to 50vs50 with a player base of 2000 players per day?

Here's a hint: You won't.


And what's even more laughable is the fact that you act superior and arrogant like you're all knowing when the reality is that you all SUCKED once upon a time. And when you sucked the game was much easier than it was today. Spawning was just slapping down a FOB, didn't need a logi, didn't need a HAB.

There were no vehicles to care about.
Invasion? Conquest? Nope. You just had AAS, and in rare cases, insurgency.
You were protected by your sandbag from everything, you didn't need to watch the skys in case someone decides to drop a mortar on your head.
You never ever drove around worrying about mines or IEDs.


It's against the forum rules to name drop, but here's a few things I've seen PLAYERS IN THIS THREAD acting like you're so good do the last 45 days:


Player 1, clan player: Pick marksman over LAT as US vs Russia on Yehorivka AAS v1. You know the map were russia has 3 damn BTR's and 2 MTLB's that your little M110 can't do crap against. Proceeded to die multiple times.

Player 2, clan player: Sit on an uncap flag saying "When you cap X we'll be capping this instantly!!!" and not answering when told that we're never going to cap it because we're 9 people down.

Player 3, clan player during CCFN (Supposed to be somewhat high skill level): Spend 10 minutes walking around trying to "flank" and then keep fighting on an uncap after defensive objective was lost for about 10 minutes until game lost.

Player 4, no clan what I know: Decided that a fantastic idea was to drive the BTR straight into Stepne and was very suprised when he instantly died. Blamed infantry for not covering him.


I can go on for a while, but I'm pretty sure I've made my point.

And here's another fact, for some of us who plays this game A LOT and at a high competitive level, how good do you think you are in our eyes?
Do you hear us constantly shitting on you on forums and being annoyed that you're joining our public games?



Remember what you all came from, because a while back you were all new, didn't have a clue what was happening or how to play the game and someone taught you the ropes and had their patience with you.


Pay it forward and show some respect. These are humans trying to have fun. Just like you.


Regards, Nordic.

Wow. I agree with some of this but you are really calling the kettle black here with your approach to all this. The arrogance you speak of is so prevalent in your own words that it really isn't fair to criticize these guys. I haven't read the whole thread, wouldn't surprise me in the least to discover the usual culprits being high horsed pricks over the same gripes. I know, I used to be one of them. But for you, a QA Tester to act like this is quite unprofessional and you do represent the development team whether you recognize it or not. These guys rude as they may be, many backed this project as soon as we could, and paid money for a promise. The issue is that we see more and more content in every subsequent recap that never gets released. There is an actual issue here because every sale there is an influx of new players who show up, look around a bit and say "whoops, this isn't battlefield" and leave never to be seen again. You will see this die down when there is an actual playerbase to speak of other than your original backers. 

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19 minutes ago, NotBrad said:

Wow. I agree with some of this but you are really calling the kettle black here with your approach to all this. The arrogance you speak of is so prevalent in your own words that it really isn't fair to criticize these guys. I haven't read the whole thread, wouldn't surprise me in the least to discover the usual culprits being high horsed pricks over the same gripes. I know, I used to be one of them. But for you, a QA Tester to act like this is quite unprofessional and you do represent the development team whether you recognize it or not. These guys rude as they may be, many backed this project as soon as we could, and paid money for a promise. The issue is that we see more and more content in every subsequent recap that never gets released. There is an actual issue here because every sale there is an influx of new players who show up, look around a bit and say "whoops, this isn't battlefield" and leave never to be seen again. You will see this die down when there is an actual playerbase to speak of other than your original backers. 

Nailed it.

2 things to fix this whole topic, picking out pieces of the thread and coming up with the ideas, which I think would be massively beneficial for everyone...

1/ Force new players to do a training session or a short prologue before it unlocks multiplayer.
2/ Don't have true ranks, but at least something to show the amount of hours people have played the game. This will instantly help those joining a Squad and knowing that SL is new or veteran.

Edited by Mad Ani

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17 minutes ago, NotBrad said:

Wow. I agree with some of this but you are really calling the kettle black here with your approach to all this. The arrogance you speak of is so prevalent in your own words that it really isn't fair to criticize these guys. I haven't read the whole thread, wouldn't surprise me in the least to discover the usual culprits being high horsed pricks over the same gripes. I know, I used to be one of them. But for you, a QA Tester to act like this is quite unprofessional and you do represent the development team whether you recognize it or not. These guys rude as they may be, many backed this project as soon as we could, and paid money for a promise. The issue is that we see more and more content in every subsequent recap that never gets released. There is an actual issue here because every sale there is an influx of new players who show up, look around a bit and say "whoops, this isn't battlefield" and leave never to be seen again. You will see this die down when there is an actual playerbase to speak of other than your original backers. 

 

No, he is exactly right, and not even in an arrogant or unprofessional way.

He pointed out the problem in the right words, just as needed.

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2 minutes ago, Mad Ani said:

Nailed it.

2 things to fix this whole topic, picking out pieces of the thread and coming up with the ideas, which I think would be massively beneficial for everyone...

1/ Force new players to do a training session or a short prologue before it unlocks multiplayer.
2/ Don't have true ranks, but at least something to show the amount of hours people have played the game. This will instantly help those joining a Squad and knowing that SL is new or veteran.


If you want to know how many hours someone has played you can look up their steam profile. Not sure why hours mean so much to you. Give me 2ish weeks and i can have a brand new account that never connected to a server with 400ish hours in the game. Hours don't mean anything. Not now, or ever.

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7 minutes ago, Elirah said:

 

No, he is exactly right, and not even in an arrogant or unprofessional way.

He pointed out the problem in the right words, just as needed.

No, he is part of the team behind the game, he has a standard to uphold as part of that, it's the role of the moderators to post that.

edit: 

made it clearer

Edited by NotBrad

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Just now, Odin said:


If you want to know how many hours someone has played you can look up their steam profile. Not sure why hours mean so much to you. Give me 2ish weeks and i can have a brand new account that never connected to a server with 400ish hours in the game. Hours don't mean anything. Not now, or ever.

A fair few steam profiles are hidden. This is the only way we find out if someone is new or not, helps us to admin things with "accidents".

When joining a SL and you can see his hours/rank, then you have an idea if he's very new to the game and that determines the outcome of the round for you. Experienced people can go in and help that guy or they can avoid if they don't like playing with new guys.

These are simply ideas being thrown about to try and come up solutions.

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3 minutes ago, NotBrad said:

No, he is part of the team behind the game, he has a standard to uphold as part of that, it's the role of the moderators to do that.

 

Much to our chagrin we have discovered that Nordic does have opinions as well occasionally. 

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3 minutes ago, Odin said:

 

Much to our chagrin we have discovered that Nordic does have opinions as well occasionally. 

I'm not trying to undermine you guys, I mean to be constructive, albeit it can seem hostile. I'm not against him voicing his opinions, but he should really avoid aggravating the community, this forum is hostile enough without further strain on dev-community relations 

Edited by NotBrad

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Yeah Odin, I know "hours played" doesn't necessarily mean anything for sure, but its the simplest and least invasive signal for whether someone knows about Fob mechanics etc etc.  

 

Its by no means an vitally important thing to know -- its pretty useless in fact since the majority of the time it'll just be registering the thousands of hours that the usual suspects all have.

 

Thing is, when you see "hours:0" or however it would be displayed, that would help everyone involved -- both the new player and the rest of the team.  Nothing worse than finding out 25 mins into a match that the other SL is new and that's why he's done X, Y and Z...  and you could have helped him out with it from the start if only you had known.

 

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17 minutes ago, NotBrad said:

No, he is part of the team behind the game, he has a standard to uphold as part of that, it's the role of the moderators to do that.

He just told you the standards he upholds. So he did just what you expect from him.

 

The time you played is quite unimportant. The guy with 0 hours sometimes is better than the guy with 2000 hours. 

Its really important to respect every player in what he wants from this game. Everyone start at 0 at some point. 

I sadly cant communicate in english as good as Nordic can, but restrictions other than read a manual (voluntary) is too much to get into the game,

All you need to learn, you are going to learn in game, with real humans. You have to do you own mistakes, just as everyone made his mistakes.

Even with 0 hours playtime, you should go squadleader and try out yourself. If he gets support from other players, he might stay in the game and is going to try his best to be a good squadleader. 

Everyone in this game should try and hold on every new player we can get, and not tell him to go away because he is knew. That is the arrogance we dont need.

 

Edited by Elirah

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6 minutes ago, Kendo said:

Yeah Odin, I know "hours played" doesn't necessarily mean anything for sure, but its the simplest and least invasive signal for whether someone knows about Fob mechanics etc etc.  

 

Its by no means an vitally important thing to know -- its pretty useless in fact since the majority of the time it'll just be registering the thousands of hours that the usual suspects all have.

 

Thing is, when you see "hours:0" or however it would be displayed, that would help everyone involved -- both the new player and the rest of the team.  Nothing worse than finding out 25 mins into a match that the other SL is new and that's why he's done X, Y and Z...  and you could have helped him out with it from the start if only you had known.

 


To be fair, hours played EVEN IF i was to entertain that idea, wouldn't work either. If a player has their profile locked, oops there is the end of that idea. Hours in itself is a useless stat and will also, not be implemented.  

Patience guys. I am absolutely sure there will be a few features that will fix some of the complaints you have sometime in the future. Until then, breathe. And stop bashing new players. Please and thank you.

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1 minute ago, Elirah said:

Even with 0 hours playtime, you should go squadleader and try out yourself. If he gets support from other players, he might stay in the game and is going to try his best to be a good squadleader. 

 

The keyword there being "if".  I think people shoot themselves in the foot sometimes because we all know Squad can get very "high octane" and a lot of pressure can be put on SLs.  Not many people will come forward and say "sorry, I'm new".  Cant blame them really with the internet being the way it is.

 

If I'm forming a plan at the start and I see another SL that I can quickly identify as new to the game, then great: I'll help him through what to do, how to claim vehicles for his mates etc.  I'll also not suggest to him as critical or intricate a job, or perhaps be more forgiving if it doesn't go to plan.

 

But I can't help people if I don't know they need help, and I'm not going to skim through every SL on steam before the match to do that..

 

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