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Gatzby

September 2017 Recap

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Nice! Now everyone will slowly go prone when they surprise each other and then shoot it out xD

 

At least at first.....

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21 hours ago, L0cation said:

I think that even main battle tank should be manned by only two men ( but with a crewman kit ) where one is both the driver and the commander and the second is the main gunner . the reason is that we don't aim for full realism here( as cool as it is ) ... I mean what do you expect from a loader to do ? With the way i discribed you have two equally fun roles for both the driver and the gunner , while still making sure that operation of a heavy vehicle requires coordination . 

But the main reason this is important is for making sure more vehicles would be manned at the same time ... I mean we already have a problem where alot of vehicles are just parked at main , with a simpler system like this 4 guys can man 2 tanks instead of 1 . 

The loader often mans a machine gun on the turret in most tanks when he is not reloading of course, so just let him do that and let the cannon autoload, though have it stop autoloading in case he abandons his place. That way we have semi-realism and the loader can still have fun.

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38 minutes ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

The loader often mans a machine gun on the turret in most tanks when he is not reloading of course, so just let him do that and let the cannon autoload, though have it stop autoloading in case he abandons his place. That way we have semi-realism and the loader can still have fun.

No need for a a loader man .... Just like there is no need for a transport chopper co-pilot and people who man the machine guns on the sides , we need the spare players to be on the ground fighting or manning other vehicles like logistics and jeeps .

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9 minutes ago, L0cation said:

No need for a a loader man .... Just like there is no need for a transport chopper co-pilot and people who man the machine guns on the sides , we need the spare players to be on the ground fighting or manning other vehicles like logistics and jeeps .

You are neglecting a need for choppers to have defence capability if they do not have gunner positions.  While chopper is a carrier of squads, it should have gunners shouldn't it?  And co pilot seat could be used if pilot gets shot while piloting and can take over quickly avoiding crash.

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1 hour ago, XRobinson said:

You are neglecting a need for choppers to have defence capability if they do not have gunner positions.  While chopper is a carrier of squads, it should have gunners shouldn't it?  And co pilot seat could be used if pilot gets shot while piloting and can take over quickly avoiding crash.

Yes my friend but you have to remember , this is NOT a milsim , squads pase is alot faster than that , people want something to do ! They want to feel like they are actually contributing ! People here are already very impatient .... Players already are having it hard to wait for a medic to revive them so they just respawn on the quickist rally to come back to the action , let alone stay and defened objectives/go on long flanks/wait for a vehicle pick up or do logistics runs ! Are you going to "ground" one player to be a co-pilot only for that insanly small chance of the pilot to be shot through the window ? Or other TWO players on the guns on the sides which are barley ever used ?? The only dedecated sit in the helicopter should be the pilot and all the others just for the soilders the chopper transports for that run , you could just make it that the gunners leave the chopper last to defend it while the others get out and when someone sits in the co-pilot sit he can automaticly take control of the chopper if the pilot is down ( not extremely realistic i know ) but remeber we already have problems with bringing 100 players on a server we still have to wait and see if we can get that , if we some how can manage to get 200 player servers than i am all for these dedicated sits for the more hard core players , but for now ... It just doesn't fit .

Edited by L0cation

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Staging area and territory control is great news! Can't wait V10

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@LOcation you feel people should be in logistics and jeeps, when air vehicles are the ones to take those out?  Its going ti be an air war just as much as a ground war, I think you do not want choppers at all, and they worked in BF with gunners.  Yeah pilot can be alone wile not transporting squads, but that doesn't mean there are no gunner seats..the air war is with the ground units, you just want ground units fighting ground units and not air vehicles too?  Strange, nothing to do with being mil sim in my eyes.

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1 hour ago, XRobinson said:

@LOcation you feel people should be in logistics and jeeps, when air vehicles are the ones to take those out?  Its going ti be an air war just as much as a ground war, I think you do not want choppers at all, and they worked in BF with gunners.  Yeah pilot can be alone wile not transporting squads, but that doesn't mean there are no gunner seats..the air war is with the ground units, you just want ground units fighting ground units and not air vehicles too?  Strange, nothing to do with being mil sim in my eyes.

I don't know what type of combat you expect from transport choppers ... But i can almost be certain when i tell you it's not going to be like you think ( fights might accour between attack choppers and Maybe fixed wing aircraft (please god let these be added ) but transport choppers are just gonna fly in quick -  drop troops and quickly fly back to base ... The damage moudels in the game are very high a tansport chopper won't risk overstaying in order to give you this cinimatic close air support you see in movies ( if you've played project reality you know exactly what i am talk about with the way aircraft play - transport choppers avoid all possible contact and attack helicopters fly really high and rain heavy accurate bursts of damage from far away - you'll always never see an attack chopper dive in with rockets )  , in addition these roles are "boring" compared to the all other things you can do instead , ofcourse no one is stopping you from filling these roles , but after a while you'll drop the idea yourself i promise you .

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If we are talking Black Hawk, it does more than just transport: "The ESSS can also carry 10,000 lb (4,500 kg) of armament such as rockets, missiles and gun pods." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikorsky_UH-60_Black_Hawk

It is a multi mission capable helo.  I understand if you just want a troop carrier in game, but if you got a helo that does both carry and shoot, you can use it both ways, as a gunship also, and that's how it was used in BF.  And you flipped on your mil sim, now you do want choppers to be more mil sim?  Instead of like BF. Black Hawk will have no gunner?

Guess the gunship varient will not be used in game...as It is not troop carrier while it is a gunship.  I just viewed helos having guns like in all the Vietnam films of helos, being able to shoot and carry.

Edited by XRobinson

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Besides...you're going to want your chopper to be able to defend itself when it's dropping off troops or picking up troops. Troops could be under heavy fire and call in for heli transport. That's when your heli is going to want to lay some bullets while the troops hop in or out of the chopper.

Edited by WarEagle751

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45 minutes ago, XRobinson said:

If we are talking Black Hawk, it does more than just transport: "The ESSS can also carry 10,000 lb (4,500 kg) of armament such as rockets, missiles and gun pods." https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sikorsky_UH-60_Black_Hawk

It is a multi mission capable helo.  I understand if you just want a troop carrier in game, but if you got a helo that does both carry and shoot, you can use it both ways, as a gunship also, and that's how it was used in BF.  And you flipped on your mil sim, now you do want choppers to be more mil sim?  Instead of like BF. Black Hawk will have no gunner?

Guess the gunship varient will not be used in game...as It is not troop carrier while it is a gunship.  I just viewed helos having guns like in all the Vietnam films of helos, being able to shoot and carry.

It is not about what i "want" and stop giving these "milsim or battlefield" examples like we have to chose only one style like there is no middleground .... I am just telling you about how it is probably going to be - becuase in this regard squad is very similar to PR when it come ls to play style , becuase of the very high damge moudels choppers are too easy to shut down , and most pilots will refuse requests of squad leaders to land inside or close to hot zones ( i want the ammo crates back from project reality in order to give transport choppers the abillity to do logistics runs aswell , and maybe even for heavier choppers the abillity to carry light ground vehicles ) . 

In any case you will be able to probably convince some guys to be your gunners but they must likely quit the job when they realize that they don't really get to shoot anything with these big guns , but good luck convincing someone to be your co-pilot ( aside from your friends or role players ) , ofcourse this play style is open for everyone but if we'll have dedicated vehicles squads like we had in project reality ( which i hope we will ) so in the "air transport" squad your best bet would be one pilot per chopper and if you want extra protection maybe a pilot and one "co-pilot" that would act as one of the gunners when the chopper is empty and a co-pilot when it's full , the other two guys you want to have in your chopper would be much better and much rather manning an attack chopper or a tank .

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33 minutes ago, WarEagle751 said:

Besides...you're going to want your chopper to be able to defend itself when it's dropping off troops or picking up troops. Troops could be under heavy fire and call in for heli transport. That's when your heli is going to want to lay some bullets while the troops hop in or out of the chopper.

Again , these cinimatics "chopper comes in and lands in a hot zone with gunners covering the infantry that are getting inside the chopper and then they fly away safely" you see in movies will never happen unfortunately.

One of two thing will happen : 

1 . the chopper tries to land in a hot zone - gunners won't be able to actully shoot anything becuase of the movement ( ever tried to hit something with the 0.50 cal when sitting in a speeding humvee? ) and if you see the enemy he probably sees your fat-ass chopper and by that time your choppers is probably a huge fireball , if you are fighting a conventional force - chopper is shut down by armored vehicles in seconds , and if agaisnt an unconventional faction a thousand RPGs or even granade launchers will take your chopper down .  

2 . what is the smartest thing to do and probably what mostly will happen - chopper pilor would kindly refuse to land near the hot zone , so it just will bring fresh troops and land them somewhere far away from the action , they will setup a rally and continue the attack from there , or if a squad leader inside a hot zone would need a chopper - his squad will back off from the action the safer place for the chopper to pick them up , in the end the chopper won't need any dedicated gunners or a co-pilot becuase it would must likely will fly in safer areas , and if still needed , 50% of the time it will have the gunners becuase it will contain troops .

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I am looking forward to Helicopters and possible aircraft. I would like to fly them even if it doesn't have armament. I heard a joystick and pedals would be needed is that correct? 

 

For tanks I can see two crew members working but if the Abrams gets the top 50 cal hmg a commander could use it as well as help spot targets, imho.

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3 hours ago, L0cation said:

Again , these cinimatics "chopper comes in and lands in a hot zone with gunners covering the infantry that are getting inside the chopper and then they fly away safely" you see in movies will never happen unfortunately.

One of two thing will happen : 

1 . the chopper tries to land in a hot zone - gunners won't be able to actully shoot anything becuase of the movement ( ever tried to hit something with the 0.50 cal when sitting in a speeding humvee? ) and if you see the enemy he probably sees your fat-ass chopper and by that time your choppers is probably a huge fireball , if you are fighting a conventional force - chopper is shut down by armored vehicles in seconds , and if agaisnt an unconventional faction a thousand RPGs or even granade launchers will take your chopper down .  

2 . what is the smartest thing to do and probably what mostly will happen - chopper pilor would kindly refuse to land near the hot zone , so it just will bring fresh troops and land them somewhere far away from the action , they will setup a rally and continue the attack from there , or if a squad leader inside a hot zone would need a chopper - his squad will back off from the action the safer place for the chopper to pick them up , in the end the chopper won't need any dedicated gunners or a co-pilot becuase it would must likely will fly in safer areas , and if still needed , 50% of the time it will have the gunners becuase it will contain troops .

In Project Reality were a lot of hot zone landings. A lot of bullets flying at the heli while it lands, drops off and returns.

Sure it got damaged, but if it got communicated well, the heli often survived.

So, why cant we have that in Squad too?

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18 hours ago, PROTOCOL said:

They're broken again? I thought they were fixed a few patches ago. Last time I used them they worked. 

 

Seems like they gave up and game-mode died off after the cache spawn bug. Would like to see it working and back in rotation! 

Isurgency is a great game-mode for serveral reasons and the "you didnt know anything" at the start being bluefor is my favorit one.

 

btw. i still hope that the C&C game-mode is comming back somedays.

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1 hour ago, Elirah said:

In Project Reality were a lot of hot zone landings.

And many, many transport-chopper carcasses scattered across the battlefield :P

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2 hours ago, Elirah said:

In Project Reality were a lot of hot zone landings. A lot of bullets flying at the heli while it lands, drops off and returns.

Sure it got damaged, but if it got communicated well, the heli often survived.

So, why cant we have that in Squad too?

This option is always open for you ... If you manage to pull this off , great for you . smart pilots must likely won't risk it .

I think you don't really get what the "argurment" is all about .... It's about people who want to have a crew of 4 per a transport helicopter ( pilot , co-pilot , and two gunners ) while i keep explaining them that there is ofcourse a possibilty to play like that , most guys will contribute much more doing other stuff ... And most likely will prefer to do something else becuase the lake of action they would get from these roles .

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How much polygons these model have? I always liked more simple models with nice textures which can still look nice, all the bolts sticking out and fully modeled tracks.. does this kind of stuff wont make performance even worse?

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29 minutes ago, zelatur said:

How much polygons these model have? I always liked more simple models with nice textures which can still look nice, all the bolts sticking out and fully modeled tracks.. does this kind of stuff wont make performance even worse?

Reasonably sure those are the high poly models that they're showcasing there. Those will then be baked down to textures and applied to a low poly model 

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Wanted to make sure motherdear's update was available here too:

 

 
And for those of you asking for dates. =)
 

 

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@Gatzby Thanks for those reddit links. It have been a pretty hard to follow where SQD is going as that sort of more technical information, while exist, is littered to several communication platforms, most of them more unstructured than forums. 

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Considering the view distance in Squad, the size of the maps, plus the weaponry available to the other side and their effective ranges, unless transport helos are almost indestructible, you're not going to see any survive hot zone landings. Hell, I can barely envision them being able to fly out of main tbh. Light armor can already park on one side of some maps and cover half of it, let alone once we have AA in game. 

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@L0cation I would say having miniguns on the heli and a second pilot seat could help by increasing options but you wouldn't be required to use them.

I personally would enjoy aircraft as soon as possible whether or not they have armament.

I'm thinking maybe we could get some kind of player controlled scout drone with a camera for the US and Russia teams.

 

The new map, vehicles and equipment look amazing, I was just thinking that squad could benefit from a snow environment. The new game mode seriously looks like a huge improvement and more fun than current modes. I'm guessing it would work like this: the areas would change colour to a certain side when there is a majority of one team there and then stays that way until another team has majority in that area, basically like a territory map you would see in the news. I'm curious to see how the resources work. I'm enjoying this game.

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If they at least give the transport choppers gunner positions at least the squad being transported could man those positions. I rather land / take off knowing someone is there to try to give some support fire. If players want to play as gunner crew they would also have that option. 

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