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3 hours ago, Elirah said:

I would like to see this implementation:

 

- you need 1 squadmember to place the rally.

- you cant place it if the enemy is near (70 meters)

- it will despawn after 1 or 2 minutes

- if it despawned it has a cooldown of 2 minutes

- if its overrun (enemy got closer than 70 meters) you have a cooldown of 5 minutes

- you can refresh the cooldown when you are in mainbase or any point where you can resupply

What you suggesting is an overall nerf to the frequency which might be nice .... But it doesn't adress the problem that rally points let's you know about enemy proximty which is a very big issue aswell . 

I would suggest to keep everything you said but instead of the. Enemy relation thing , for a limited amout of time rally point would be active but only if there are 50% or more squad members around it .

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not sure you can avoid anyone knowing enemy is taking or near a rally.. there has to be a cost for it being found.. either its camped or taken... it would be like removing an indication the enemy is digging the hab or fob down... that also gives info.. 

 

the only other way to do it is that it cant be destroyed but another cannot be placed until all spawns are used so placing it far away from where you are attacking has a risk...

 

 

Edited by embecmom

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6 hours ago, L0cation said:

What you suggesting is an overall nerf to the frequency which might be nice .... But it doesn't adress the problem that rally points let's you know about enemy proximty which is a very big issue aswell . 

I would suggest to keep everything you said but instead of the. Enemy relation thing , for a limited amout of time rally point would be active but only if there are 50% or more squad members around it .

 

Its not just the frequency. 70m radius is pretty far, an thus could be nearly anything. Also, because you can so rarely put a really point down, you end up saving it for just rallying up the squad. That means, to place a really you have to get away from the enemy at least 70m. If you try and place it, you get the same message, so you wouldnt know if you cant place it because its on cooldown, or because an enemy is near. 

The problem with having it not based on the distance to the enemy is, that you can spawn a squad right infront or behind the enemies. Which makes up for stupid gameplay. You kill 7 squadmembers, and suddenly the whole squad is infront of you again, as they respawned.

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1 hour ago, Elirah said:

 

Its not just the frequency. 70m radius is pretty far, an thus could be nearly anything. Also, because you can so rarely put a really point down, you end up saving it for just rallying up the squad. That means, to place a really you have to get away from the enemy at least 70m. If you try and place it, you get the same message, so you wouldnt know if you cant place it because its on cooldown, or because an enemy is near. 

The problem with having it not based on the distance to the enemy is, that you can spawn a squad right infront or behind the enemies. Which makes up for stupid gameplay. You kill 7 squadmembers, and suddenly the whole squad is infront of you again, as they respawned.

That's why i suggested that it would requier 50% of the squad ( not including squad leader ) or more meaning that if in a full squad more than 4 guys have died they wouldn't be able to come back with a rally , but should be able to come back with a vehicle so the remaining squad members should wait for them in the hot zone or fallback to fully regroup at a safer place .

Edited by L0cation

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@Elirah I think you missed the point of this thread. The problem is not the rally but the magical power it has to detect enemy. I use it a lot.

 

1. Cant place rally, enemy close (go hunting 50m radius)

2. Rally wiped by enemy (go hunting 5m radius)

 

In many cases the enemy wont even know they have wiped a rally, this is silly. It needs to be a decision to take the rally down...such as digging it quickly. 

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8 minutes ago, suds said:

@Elirah I think you missed the point of this thread. The problem is not the rally but the magical power it has to detect enemy. I use it a lot.

 

1. Cant place rally, enemy close (go hunting 50m radius)

2. Rally wiped by enemy (go hunting 5m radius)

 

In many cases the enemy wont even know they have wiped a rally, this is silly. It needs to be a decision to take the rally down...such as digging it quickly. 

If my vision of rallypoints gets implemented though:

1. Cant place rally -> enemy could be 70 m radius, or my rally is on cooldown

2. rally wiped -> ran out of time, or enemy was within 70 m radius

 

In both cases you have a higher chance of wasting time searching something you wont find, or you get in contact with the enemy, which is good, because the rally doesnt tell you, where the enemy is from your point of view. You wont get an advantage. 

In case it was an enemy wiping or preventing the rally, the time you need to get to him (70 m) he might be gone for a long time. 

 

Fobs are the same kind of "magical power" enemy detector. What do you want to do against that?

Edited by Elirah
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just boost respawn time if enemy close (same as FOB is currently)  and drop it if friendly is close.  Encourages people to group near rally and if extended to include FOB would make the FOB spawn of a manned FOB even more appealing.

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52 minutes ago, suds said:

@Elirah I think you missed the point of this thread. The problem is not the rally but the magical power it has to detect enemy. I use it a lot.

 

No Rally Points have a bucket full of problems to the gameplay-experience with current implementation. The "Radar" feature is just one of many.

 

Edit. BTW. Here is what were discussed about a year ago:

 

Edited by WARti0k0ne -BG-

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perhaps there can be improvements but different isnt wrong, its just not a copy.

 

different is usually better because we all know that nothing is perfect.

 

no need to go back to PR, lets explore the possibility that this system is good before dropping it.

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I tryed geting the community to use vehicles to move around, like a transport squad but they don't care, It just too milsim. Really we are trying to improve game by makeing so it rewards smart plays and not rushing, lonewolf tactics.

Here is the reference: 

Spoiler

 

And my argument: 

the CCP system will heavily balance the game, don’t change spawn timers but if medic can not fully heal, the fobs medic station would be more important than endless pushing, and it will make transport more valuable. Dropping off fresh troops and picking up injured ones. Also when the troops are being switched, the squad leader can share intel and make a better assault, makeing the troops get more kills, hence become fun.

Also I would get rid of rally spawning and instantly dieing from a sniper or camper as the squad would go back to the fob (spawn the hab with transport)

 

 

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Rally Points are fine.

But about the enemy radar thing there is something that can be finetuned with time of development.

 

My suggestions for the future are:

-Radius with enemy's close preventing putting a rp depends on mapsize

 

-if you try to put a rally and enemy is in range the old rp has to dissappear

 

-also different radius when the rally goes away when a enemy is passing it (depending on mapsize to)

 

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There's another thread discussing rallies and current issues surrounding them that I've replied to but I'll post my suggestions here.

 

a) Rallies expire after a period of time, that period of time being longer than it takes for the squad leader to respawn and reset it. 

 

b) Alternatively, or as an addition to the above, rally points need to be finite. A squad leader gets one he can place, if he uses it and it is either discovered, used up or expires, he'll need to either re-arm at an ammunition crate or respawn.

 

However, in order to effectively implement the second (one-use) suggestion, you'd need to first fix the abuse of FOBs and ammo crates (squad leader can currently place a radio, use the starting points from the radio to place an ammo box, rearm himself, and then have the radio dug up. This whole thing results in a squad effectively having infinite ammo without having to rely on either a fixed base of operations or even logistics trucks)

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On 25/09/2017 at 12:28 AM, embecmom said:

another cannot be placed until all spawns are used

absolutely.

On 25/09/2017 at 5:02 AM, suds said:

It needs to be a decision to take the rally down...such as digging it quickly. 

agreed, so it requires some effort.

2 hours ago, Kerri said:

rally points need to be finite.

and/or limited frequency of availability - say 1 RP per n-minutes (5-10?), regardless of already spawned RP. ie; current RP has just been used up and it's been 7 minutes since it was placed, so there will be a 3 minute wait to place a new RP (assume 10 minute limit). if the RP has been up for more than 10 minutes then you can place a new one immediately - the longer you 'use' a RP for, the less time needed to wait to replace it.

these numbers would of course depend on how things work in general, in game (testing n stuffs. you know what i mean, hopefully).

 

i would also suggest no notifications of RP's being attacked or being lost - let the SL find out the hard way and it removes the Radar-like behaviour.

 

Edited by LaughingJack

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Make rally points temporary unless placed close to a fob or apc. Either 30 seconds or 60 doesn't matter, as long as it's not permanent. Fobs need to become the main spawn points.

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1 hour ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Make rally points temporary unless placed close to a fob or apc. Either 30 seconds or 60 doesn't matter, as long as it's not permanent. Fobs need to become the main spawn points.

+1

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1 hour ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Make rally points temporary unless placed close to a fob or apc. Either 30 seconds or 60 doesn't matter, as long as it's not permanent. Fobs need to become the main spawn points.

Yeah, I think that would be a nice evolution. If you're within the white circle of the FOB, your rally will not despawn, but if you are outside a fob radius, the rally lasts a minute

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1 hour ago, Psyrus said:

Yeah, I think that would be a nice evolution. If you're within the white circle of the FOB, your rally will not despawn, but if you are outside a fob radius, the rally lasts a minute

Yeah, in addition to this, though this is kinda off-topic here, i think that building FoBs on objectives should be heavily punished. Simply have it so that you can't spawn on a fob if there are 5 enemies within 200 metres of it.

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5 hours ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Yeah, in addition to this, though this is kinda off-topic here, i think that building FoBs on objectives should be heavily punished. Simply have it so that you can't spawn on a fob if there are 5 enemies within 200 metres of it.

+1 to everything that sounds like PR...:)

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18 hours ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Yeah, in addition to this, though this is kinda off-topic here, i think that building FoBs on objectives should be heavily punished. Simply have it so that you can't spawn on a fob if there are 5 enemies within 200 metres of it.

I don't share that viewpoint. Why do you think so? Personally, I think fortifying an objective that was captured from the enemy makes a lot of sense (putting a fob on it etc)

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8 hours ago, Psyrus said:

I don't share that viewpoint. Why do you think so? Personally, I think fortifying an objective that was captured from the enemy makes a lot of sense (putting a fob on it etc)

Because endless meatgrinder and no room for movement or tactics.

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46 minutes ago, Guan_Yu007 said:

Because endless meatgrinder and no room for movement or tactics.

On the other hand though what's the point of even having user built defensive fortifications in the game to keep people out of a flag if a couple players can disable a HAB merely by their proximity? Just another one of the oddball contradictions where certain features of Squad fight against each other.

 

 

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11 hours ago, Psyrus said:

I don't share that viewpoint. Why do you think so? Personally, I think fortifying an objective that was captured from the enemy makes a lot of sense (putting a fob on it etc)

IT would make sense in reality. Yes. Because in reality, fortifying means build defensive structures and send reinforcements to the area from somewhere else.

 

But fortifying in Squad means building a facility that spanws people out of the blue. 

 

So fortify an objective with hescos, mgs and others, not with a HAB. The only way to avoid that irrealistic constant intense meatgrinder that occurs is what PR did. Hab gets disabled when 4 nmes are 150 mts I think?...dont remember now.

Edited by Nightingale87

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2 hours ago, Zylfrax791 said:

On the other hand though what's the point of even having user built defensive fortifications in the game to keep people out of a flag if a couple players can disable a HAB merely by their proximity? Just another one of the oddball contradictions where certain features of Squad fight against each other.

 

 

Agreed... The "Presence is Strong" No need to physically Destroy Enemies HAB's/Fortifications Just some Nubs entering the Zone...And whats wrong with the "Meatgrinder"? I Love shooting schmucks who keep on Re-Spawning.

I know we talked about it before, but one way was having a Re-Spawn Armour like in the days of "JointOperation" 5secs of SavingGrace then your Deadmeat...

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