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Posted (edited)

I'd like to be able to issue a warning to a squad member who doesn't do what he is told. Just kicking them might be too harsh lots of times. If you had the option to first give them a warning so they get a chance to improve that would be nice. Problem with using comms only is that sometimes they don't seem to think you are addressing them for some reason or they are doing other stuff. So to raise the stakes a bit I would like to be able to issue a warning very directly to them only, like in red text or so: "Warning: you are about to be kicked from the squad".

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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I don't think I understand your logic here. Do you think that a squad member who ignores your spoken warning would be more responsive to a pop-up text?

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Posted (edited)

Well, sounds stupid when you put it like that but yes. Or I mean if you had 2 steps being required to kick someone they would get an eye-opener when the first step was really taken. Compare it to the violation points on this forum for example. They could talk to me but this has more effect kind of. If it is part of the game-mechanics so to speak. 

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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Verbal communication is effective enough. No need for more context menu items and clutter and more stuff to press to issue a warning to someone not following orders. If they don't respond via coms then they shouldn't be in the squad anyway. The whole point of squad is communication. Just my 2 cents.

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I think you just tell them verbally and type in chat... then no excuses.. unless you are a bit feardy to say something.. I ask for mic confirmation.. if not mic I ask for it in chat... I then issue a warning that if member doesn't begin to follow instructions then kick.. I don't care if they get pissed about it... I kick players when they do stupid things (ie the other day one asked for Humvee at main and proceeded to drive it straight into a town of insurgents and got it blown up..kicked immediately no warning)..... I'm not overly strict when I sl but I there are 8 other members who can be impacted by one stupid player , I put the team members first and kick when necessary... 

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How about double-press the kick Button? First it says "kick", then "really?" (player gets a warning message at this stage and you may leave it like that...or press again), then off he goes. I think it'd be good for those of us who are not hardcore enough to just ditch them.

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Posted (edited)

i agree most everyone else, verbally should just do the trick. Although i do see your side @SpecialAgentJohnson 

I think there should be another way to punish a squadmate other than a kick. That would help but i cant think of anything. Anyone else have any ideas for other options to punish disobident squad members? Either way a lesser punishment would be nice. But either way i think this should happen, they should make kicking even more severe to deter people who are going against the SL and a lesser removal for other reasons:

 

PLEASE DEVS THIS WOULD HELP A TON:

1)Kicking also forces the offender to respawn. With a timer nearly or equal to if he committed suicide. Kit penalty on next spawn

2)click "kick"  and then a dialog box opens asking for a typed reason, option to cancel is also present. The reason is then posted in team chat. If left blank it will say [playername] kicked from [squad number] "no reason given". This warns other SLs. Comms are busy as it is.

3)You can "honrably kick" or "remove" a squad member which does not appear in team chat and does not force the player to respawn. No kit penalty.

 

Lets face it. U kick some guy for not grouping up and going off on his own. It leaves him with his gun and still able to do what ever he wants. Its not enough. Often times (when the offender is not lone wolfing) the guy is still just fighting with us even after hes been kicked and calling out targets and everything. Annoying. If he is kicked because he just keeps yelling at the SL for no real reason, he should be gone. I dont want him hanging around. In my experiance the guy still is yelling at people and threatening to TK people. Why does the SL have to deal with this if he has been kicked?

 

"oh you kicked me, so what? What u gonna do SL, i ll block all the door ways. Whyd u kick me i was trying to help! All i was doing was telling u that u suck at driving!" "I did not hit one tree, and i let you drive and u still kept saying i sucked the whole way there. You ran into 5 trees. I told you multiple times to stop talking. Clear the comms." "no no u suck sl u suck, i hate u sl. Whyd u have to kick me sl. But i dont even care. I am going to go tell squad 3 next door how much of a dumb ass you are and then come back here just to piss u off." 

 

Ok sure he can get banned. But that could be a while, 3mins or more even if there is an admin. An SL should be able to solve the problem by doing the only thing he can do. Kicking people. It should just end it. No questions asked. He cant stand around and say f u SL a million times.

Edited by madcat768

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I think youre givin squad leaders a lil bit too much power there, mad cat.

 

In regards to the op, just do it verbally. I know it comes off as really aggressive but you gotta do it

 

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Posted (edited)

@40mmrain yeah it is more power. Maybe you are right? I will think about it more. I am basing this idea off that nearly all SLs in squad arent trolls. In my experience there arent many. Will there be more trolls if this does happen? I dont know. But i believe there is enough opportunity to ruin everyone elses game as an SL currently anyways. Will this help the game? I think so, as long as more trolls trying to be SLs dont magically hop on squad after freeweekend. If so the game will have more problems than just someone getting kicked. If that is not the case it will help those who are trying to actually play the game.

 

Otherwise:

i am not worried about taking a bigger penalty for getting kicked, because i dont get kicked. The people who should be kicked, get kicked then they stick around. Yell at people, TK people, threaten to TK people. Or just dont care at all because they are lone wolfing anyways.

 

Why as an SL do i have to tolerate anyone screaming at me unnecessarily after ive kicked him? Why? The SL is powerless. The only thing i do is tell him to shut up, ask if an admin is online after its been a few minutes. And try to ignore him for the rest of the time. I have had people that ive kicked follow me around nearly the whole match. Hasnt happened more than a few times but it has happened to me. Kicking people doesnt help enough. I just dont talk to him and act like hes not there. but......

Kicking people does not solve the problem immediately. In some cases not at all.   

 

Some info about me:

When I SL, i dont kick people for being mic less, new to the game or bad at the game. As long as they are listening and stick with the group. I am not an overly strict sl. If someone says my driving sucks i let them drive. If someone is yelling at me to get a rally constantly (to a certain extent). I will if i can. If someone suggests a better strategy we will start doing it. But if someone just wants to screw with me and the rest of the squad i want him gone as soon as i press kick.

Edited by madcat768

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I like the warning message idea, then the kick as a visual thing.

Audio can be just, well unreliable. They could have sound all set wrong, poor headset and an AR going off, be a bit shy or simply miss the verbal warning re other comm's.

It's not right, it makes no sense to me as I play pretty hardcore, in a clan. Our audio is fantastic people simply arn't in our Squads unless they communicate effectively. But that's not the case for many.

I like it, press warn, then press kick. That's a much more reliable way to do things, along with of course verbal communication.

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, madcat768 said:

1)Kicking also forces the offender to respawn. With a timer nearly or equal to if he committed suicide. Kit penalty on next spawn

A lot of SLs kick to make room for clan members so to punish players by forcing them to wait at spawn for a long period of time will be even more frustrating, so I'm not a fan of this suggestion

 

18 hours ago, SpecialAgentJohnson said:

I'd like to be able to issue a warning to a squad member who doesn't do what he is told. Just kicking them might be too harsh lots of times. If you had the option to first give them a warning so they get a chance to improve that would be nice. Problem with using comms only is that sometimes they don't seem to think you are addressing them for some reason or they are doing other stuff. So to raise the stakes a bit I would like to be able to issue a warning very directly to them only, like in red text or so: "Warning: you are about to be kicked from the squad".

I doubt it'll be used, if a SL spots someone lone-wolfing or doing something annoying, they'll just say something on comms as they do currently and then kick them - it's just much easier to do.

 

If someone is lone-wolfing/ignoring the SL's orders and then not paying attention to comms, I see nothing wrong with them being kicked.

Edited by Arcapse

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, madcat768 said:

3)You can "honrably kick" or "remove" a squad member which does not appear in team chat and does not force the player to respawn. No kit penalty

@Arcapse you didnt finish reading lol.  I would also add that before the game starts the only option is "remove" instead of kick and that i changed my mind, any SL kicking someone must type the reason. It can not be left blank. And I would add that a timer may be added to squad changing. So that offenders may not easily escape.

 

"... they should make kicking even more severe to deter people who are going against the SL and a lesser removal for other reasons:  "

 

Click on player on squad roster:

Options are as follows:

"Promote to Squad Leader" - Dialog box: Are you sure?: Affirmative, Cancel

"Honorably Remove"(might be better named) - Dialog Box: Are you sure?: Affirmative, Cancel

"Kick"- Dialog Box: State Reason [text box]: Affirmative, Cancel - if yes in team chat: [Player name] Kicked from Squad [squad number] due to [Given Reason]

 

When a commander is present, there could be even another layer of security to prevent an SL from just kicking instead of removing. Such as the need to request Commander approval in order to kick someone. THIS might help solve your concerns @40mmrain A dialog box will open up for the commander: Squad Leader [squad number] [SL playerName] requesting "Harsh Kick" due to [typed given reason]: Request: Approved, Denied. If approved then the statment is also posted in team chat.

Edited by madcat768

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^^Yeah you're correct, sorry :P

 

10 hours ago, madcat768 said:

Ok sure he can get banned. But that could be a while, 3mins or more even if there is an admin. An SL should be able to solve the problem by doing the only thing he can do. Kicking people. It should just end it. No questions asked. He cant stand around and say f u SL a million times.

I feel it is giving too much power to Squad Leaders, which could be any random player

 

Imo, moderating and punishing problematic players falls under server admins and moderators, not SLs. At least admin should be following a set of guidelines.

 

If there's too much of a delay on any admin action on a server, that to me is an issue with the server and the admin team, not an issue with SLs not being given enough tools.

 

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I think empower the SL'ers more,

They are the guys on the ground, they are the ones that effect the Squads experience.

Keep in mind, we can just change Squad or start one ourselves, so it goes both way's.

But I seriously only ever need to change Squad on random public servers, regular community servers or when with the clan/friends this is just never an issue.

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Allowing some random SL to kick someone from a communities server will never happen. That is up to the owners and admins of that particular server. 

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Why over-engineer something that is so simple?

First warning is the title of the game they're playing, isn't it?

 

squad
skwäd/
noun
 
  1. a small group of people having a particular task.
    "an assassination squad"
    synonyms: team, crew, gang, band, cell, body, mob, outfit, force
    "an assassination squad"
    • a small number of soldiers assembled for drill or assigned to some special task, especially an infantry unit forming part of a platoon.
      synonyms: detachment, detail, unit, platoon, battery, troop, patrol, squadron, cadre, commando, tiger team
      "an elite reconnaissance squad"

 

Give them the boot if they're not adhering to your orders and working with the other 8 people in their squad. If they want to go play lone-wolf, have them install CoD and give that a whirl. They'll be happier, you'll be happier, we'll all be happier.
 

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I've noticed that typically insubordination involves multiple players going off doing their own thing. That said, so my softer approach is to not say anything more, simply give the person that listens the least the SL role and then just leave the Squad and form a new one. 

 

This usually has fewer long term negative effects because first of all I don't have some salty dog chasing after me to revenge TK me for his kick but also now that this butthead is an SL I can ignore their requests for assistance and help other folks that are focused on the objectives instead.

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9 minutes ago, Zylfrax791 said:

I've noticed that typically insubordination involves multiple players going off doing their own thing. That said, so my softer approach is to not say anything more, simply give the person that listens the least the SL role and then just leave the Squad and form a new one. 

 

This usually has fewer long term negative effects because first of all I don't have some salty dog chasing after me to revenge TK me for his kick but also now that this butthead is an SL I can ignore their requests for assistance and help other folks that are focused on the objectives instead.

whilst I understand why you go off to setup another one, its a real pia for the players in your squad that were doing the right thing.. it has been made easier since you get to keep the kit now, but tends to leave everyone without a spawn and no leadership. .. I would just kick the offending player than punish the whole squad.. and if he TKs me its only going to happen once then he will be banned as I play on very good clan servers.

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Posted (edited)
7 hours ago, Odin said:

Allowing some random SL to kick someone from a communities server will never happen. That is up to the owners and admins of that particular server. 

I dont think anyone here has said they wanted that to happen. I think everyone is talking about kicking from the squad, not from the server? if you are referring to my post, when i say kicking i mean kicking from the squad and forcing them to respawn. Not from the server. I should have made it more clear. "gone" as gone from the general area where our squad is in the game, or at least give us a head start when leaving a HAB. I agree that is too much power, for sls to kick people from a server.

 Right now just kicking someone from the squad does not resolve the situation immediately and sometimes not at all. Because that same guy is still free to scream at you, block doors, threaten to TK all because he is not removed from the general area. There has been times where the offender has followed me around for nearly a whole game. Just trying to screw with everyone. So many times ive kicked people from the squad who just want to cause trouble and they just stand right in front of me for saying "ohhh you kicked me, i dont care" and he keeps doing what got him kicked in the first place. The SL is powerless.

  @Zylfrax791 so you are saying it will just make it worse if you choose to harsh kick them rather than remove? I am suggesting there are options for both. Because i dont know about you but i still have had people chase me around the map either way. Those kinds of people dont care. They want to screw with you and your squad for fun no matter what. You dont go easier on them just cause you are worried about their reaction. Their intent is to mess with you, they should be back on a spawn timer away from everyone else. You need some means to control the situation. Instead of hitting kick from squad as is and ignore them. Throwing your arms up in the air and telling the guy "fine you win, keep blocking the doors all you want" has not helpped me very much. You need to say "knock it off, stop or i ll send you back to the spawn timer" you need actions to back up your words and not to whimp out. Whimping out is all an SL can do right now or and wait for an admin to intervene. "Cut that out right now! Or u wont be able to use squad comms but you will still be able to piss us off any way you please until an admin connects OR an enemy kills you....maybe someone will tk you back if you really start to? I dont condone it but it can happen?" Think he cares?

 

19 hours ago, madcat768 said:

1)Kicking also forces the offender to respawn. With a timer nearly or equal to if he committed suicide. Kit penalty on next spawn

Quote

2)click "kick"  and then a dialog box opens asking for a typed reason, option to cancel is also present. The reason is then posted in team chat. If left blank it will say [playername] kicked from [squad number] "no reason given". This warns other SLs. Comms are busy as it is.

3)You can "honrably kick" or "remove" a squad member which does not appear in team chat and does not force the player to respawn. No kit penalty.

 

Quote

Click on player on squad roster:

Options are as follows:

"Promote to Squad Leader" - Dialog box: Are you sure?: Affirmative, Cancel

"Honorably Remove"(might be better named) - Dialog Box: Are you sure?: Affirmative, Cancel

"Kick"- Dialog Box: State Reason [text box]: Affirmative, Cancel - if yes in team chat: [Player name] Kicked from Squad [squad number] due to [Given Reason]

with possible additional commander approval required for hard squad kick. Soft kick no approval needed.

Edited by madcat768

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52 minutes ago, embecmom said:

whilst I understand why you go off to setup another one, its a real pia for the players in your squad that were doing the right thing.. it has been made easier since you get to keep the kit now, but tends to leave everyone without a spawn and no leadership. .. I would just kick the offending player than punish the whole squad.. and if he TKs me its only going to happen once then he will be banned as I play on very good clan servers.

I should have prefeced that by saying I typically only do that if there is an ammo crate nearby. This is why most of the time I only squad lead with one or more of my son's. Otherwise I just join somebody else's squad and try to get the scoped rifle.

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I'd second a menu function that visually warns of an impending kick from the squad, mainly because I commonly find myself in situations where I can't hear the SL due to noise in game, being under heavy fire or in a vehicle. I don't think it needs to be mandatory, but it'd be nice to have the option. 

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6 hours ago, LugNut said:

I'd second a menu function that visually warns of an impending kick from the squad, mainly because I commonly find myself in situations where I can't hear the SL due to noise in game, being under heavy fire or in a vehicle. I don't think it needs to be mandatory, but it'd be nice to have the option. 

 

 

Lower gameplay volume and raise coms volume....problem solved

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Posted (edited)

More ways for soft "people control" is always a good thing. This is a community after all, a message from UI is more authorative than verbal warning especially in cases where parties have hard time to understand each others for technical, cultural or emotional reasons.

Edited by WARti0k0ne -BG-

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Posted (edited)
On 2017-08-14 at 11:42 PM, WARti0k0ne -BG- said:

More ways for soft "people control" is always a good thing. This is a community after all, a message from UI is more authorative than verbal warning especially in cases where parties have hard time to understand each others for technical, cultural or emotional reasons.

 Exactly my point. Show people that you have the finger on the trigger vs pulling the trigger (actually kicking).

 

A problem is that some people talk a lot and do a little. So just talking may not deter some people because no one knows each other and what the sl is capable of.

 

Sometimes you have a situation where exactly no one follows sl. You talk but no one cares. What are gonna do then? You can't actually kick everyone because then you would be left alone in the squad and lead nothing. A warning would signal that you really mean that you are about to kick them for sure.

 

I don't think we should give sl anymore authority though. Kicking is good enough. Also some sl's are psycho and can't be trusted with treating people justly. Shouldn't have too much power.

Edited by SpecialAgentJohnson

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Fist thing is first, can we PLEASE move the button to "kick from squad" further away from the button to "promote to squad leader".  Its actually quite funny when you think about it, but in the heat of battle when you're trying to get rid of the troll and you end up making him the squadleader.... well, no one is laughing then (except maybe the troll).

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