Gatzby

Release: Alpha Version 9.6

140 posts in this topic
2 hours ago, nooomy said:

Yes do not add anymore shit to the HUD! Or if you are going to add something make it smaller and temporary so it fades away after a while

I agree... they could have made it temporary. But a permanent  hud item? Really disappointed. But oh wel everything else looks great

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2 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

 

Arduras, your argument here only makes sense if I was arguing for auto-generating resources, which I am obviously not. I have no idea why you're even arguing this, it sounds like you're in favor of exactly the same thing I am.

 

This is the fact: It is now easier for player far away from any logistical support to resupply. It is actually easier to do in 9.6 than in 9.5. I can place a FOB, drop an ammo crate, and resupply a LAT in less time than it would take in 9.5 to drop a FOB and wait for enough supplies for an infinite ammo crate. And I can repeat this process over and over in the same spot or on the move.

 

In 9.5 I had to actually drop a FOB, either wait for 300 supplies or come back later. Then I'd have to travel to and from that FOB to resupply. Now, I can just stop in the middle of nowhere and drop/takedown/drop/etc. until resupplied. I don't have to travel to and from a fixed location, risking detection and destruction while low on ammo. I can just do it right then and there.

 

Right now, if you have no logistics available to you, there's literally no harm in you doing the same thing on an objective, either. You'll set up a FOB there eventually so you're not blocking anything, you're not losing any tickets by setting up and taking down FOBs, so you have instant resupply anywhere there's no logistical support(And where you have logistical support, you have supplies anyway). Not as helpful as the infinite ammo crates in 9.5, but hardly a crippling situation.

 

This was just a poorly thought out decision by the devs, and I hope they remove ALL resources from placed FOBs in a hotfix soon.

 

I agree, I've seen SL's drop radios, use the 200 pts asap on sandbags or whatnot, we dig the radio, get those pts again and repeat. Inconvenient? Sure, but better than nothing if you're across the map setting up a backcapping fob. 

 

The new system needs to start with zero resources. 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, tatzhit said:

If I'm reading the patch notes correctly, you only get one LAT resupply from a FOB like that (100 ammo points per FOB).
So, at least 3 people working together and spending a couple minutes to get a a few rockets for one guy while blocking friendly FOBs in vicinity and risking ticket loss? Non-issue.

 

First off, it takes a couple of seconds. FOB and ammo crate is up in 10 seconds, FOB is back down in about 10-15 seconds. Compare that to the minutes you had to wait before you could set up an ammo crate in 9.5.

 

And I just came from a match where the enemy was resupplying their LATs in the back field this way. They had a bunch of RPGs in the back, camping any exit from main, and had unlimited ammunition. No need for logistics, no need to wait several minutes, no need to go to and from the ammo FOB. Just drop it where you are, resupply and take it down. Took all of half a day for this to become a thing.

 

1 hour ago, tatzhit said:

Not to mention any relevant objective will likely already have a FOB on it, meaning that this tactic is impossible anywhere but the non-contested areas of the map.

 

But the non-contested areas of the map is exactly where you build these FOBs. Apparently, you guys are playing on some shit servers not to have seen this tactics before, but in 9.5 teams would drop a bunch of FOBs all over the map for repairs and rearming. You'd spend 30 seconds going back to this FOB instead of 2-3 minutes going back to main for repairs. The repair stations aren't a problem anymore, but as the bolded text above points out, people are already abusing the immediate infinite ammo FOBs.

 

1 hour ago, tatzhit said:

I'd say the on-demand HMG would be a bigger issue than the low-supply ammo crate, but even that was far easier in 9.5 and people still didn't do it.

 

That's a completely different thing. The reason why people don't place FOBs to place HMG emplacements, in 9.5 or 9.6, is because you have to place the 20 ticket FOB asset first, and then you're going to build and use an emplacement that is noisy as hell and gives away the position of the 20 ticket FOB asset. The non-use of emplacements has nothing to do with the recent changes.

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3 hours ago, IINAYDOGII said:

hideable HUD elements should hopefully come - I dont need to have a icon telling me if im stood up or not, id rather have the option to turn it off. If you need/want it thats totally cool, but hopefully give us options as to how much information we are spoonfed. 

This^^^ if I want know if I am standing or crouching I can just look down and see my legs. And if I want to know if I am in prone I'll just see the ground right there! That new icon should totally be optional. Pointless HUD distraction. 

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1 hour ago, Pvt. Lewis said:

I agree... they could have made it temporary. But a permanent  hud item? Really disappointed. But oh wel everything else looks great

I think the stance is a temporary bfix I think ibthebjext up date it might jurbpop up to hen go?

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1 hour ago, Pvt. Lewis said:

This^^^ if I want know if I am standing or crouching I can just look down and see my legs. And if I want to know if I am in prone I'll just see the ground right there! That new icon should totally be optional. Pointless HUD distraction. 

 

People have been asking for an indicator since the first releases. People are tired of needing to look at their feet to see what stance they are.

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Narva - Great map but i was waiting also for Narvas most famous thing "Hermans Castle"

 

Spoiler

army-soldiers-and-estonian-army-scouts-m

Here you  can see US soldiers marching through the Narva (near the castle) on February 2017

 

As Estonian i didnt like the thing that the Narva is full of Ladas, Old Mercedes cars and etc Russian things. Also it is full of Russian languaged signs :D Narva is still an city of Estonia. But it is okay, atleast it have Grenholm Manufracture.

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13 hours ago, Inkompetent said:

I don't know about that HDD-space fix for patches that was supposed to be in 9.5 Hotfix, and thus keep down the required space for future patches.

 

Tried to update Squad today, and despite the patch being 3.3 GB I couldn't download it through Steam with 19GB free on my SSD because of "insufficient disk space". Since one can't relocate games to another drive if they need to be updated I had to uninstall the game and download it from scratch.

 

Thus it appears as if that fix doesn't actually work.

 

I know it's a pain in the ass but you can move another game to a different drive, update Squad and then move the other game back again. Had to do that a few times lately as my SSD is getting full.

 

As for the stance indicator all it needs is a simple little dot to indicate you're crouched. If it isn't there you must be standing and we can all tell if you're prone.

Edited by Major Trouble

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35 minutes ago, DoctorKamikaze said:

 

People have been asking for an indicator since the first releases. People are tired of needing to look at their feet to see what stance they are.

 

I could see lean and crouch togglers needing this, and for new players it will be nice for the other information it provides.  Doesn't bother me, but I also didn't use it last night or in the playtests.

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2 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

 

First off, it takes a couple of seconds. FOB and ammo crate is up in 10 seconds, FOB is back down in about 10-15 seconds. Compare that to the minutes you had to wait before you could set up an ammo crate in 9.5.

 

And I just came from a match where the enemy was resupplying their LATs in the back field this way. They had a bunch of RPGs in the back, camping any exit from main, and had unlimited ammunition. No need for logistics, no need to wait several minutes, no need to go to and from the ammo FOB. Just drop it where you are, resupply and take it down. Took all of half a day for this to become a thing.

 

 

But the non-contested areas of the map is exactly where you build these FOBs. Apparently, you guys are playing on some shit servers not to have seen this tactics before, but in 9.5 teams would drop a bunch of FOBs all over the map for repairs and rearming. You'd spend 30 seconds going back to this FOB instead of 2-3 minutes going back to main for repairs. The repair stations aren't a problem anymore, but as the bolded text above points out, people are already abusing the immediate infinite ammo FOBs.

 

 

That's a completely different thing. The reason why people don't place FOBs to place HMG emplacements, in 9.5 or 9.6, is because you have to place the 20 ticket FOB asset first, and then you're going to build and use an emplacement that is noisy as hell and gives away the position of the 20 ticket FOB asset. The non-use of emplacements has nothing to do with the recent changes.

 

Back in 9.5 you had to wait a couple minutes to get ammo crate, but resupplies were infinite. In 9.6 you can get one in about a minute all told, but it only gives one LAT resupply. Excuse me if I don't see a problem.
 
Enemy LATs wandering in far-off areas wasn't usually a problem in 9.5 with infinite resupply ammo crates, I doubt it will suddenly become a problem in 9.6 with the extremely limited ones. Moreover, if the enemy does camp main or hide in the back field, this means they remove one of their squads from fighting for objectives, which will likely hurt their team in the end.

Overall, I would say the FOB system changes might be inconvenient on some levels, but appear to be a good thing for game balance.

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Wow! I'm liking this small update. Especially the new Narva map and updated Al Basrah.

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7 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

 

Arduras, your argument here only makes sense if I was arguing for auto-generating resources, which I am obviously not. I have no idea why you're even arguing this, it sounds like you're in favor of exactly the same thing I am.

 

This is the fact: It is now easier for player far away from any logistical support to resupply. It is actually easier to do in 9.6 than in 9.5. I can place a FOB, drop an ammo crate, and resupply a LAT in less time than it would take in 9.5 to drop a FOB and wait for enough supplies for an infinite ammo crate. And I can repeat this process over and over in the same spot or on the move.

 

In 9.5 I had to actually drop a FOB, either wait for 300 supplies or come back later. Then I'd have to travel to and from that FOB to resupply. Now, I can just stop in the middle of nowhere and drop/takedown/drop/etc. until resupplied. I don't have to travel to and from a fixed location, risking detection and destruction while low on ammo. I can just do it right then and there.

 

Right now, if you have no logistics available to you, there's literally no harm in you doing the same thing on an objective, either. You'll set up a FOB there eventually so you're not blocking anything, you're not losing any tickets by setting up and taking down FOBs, so you have instant resupply anywhere there's no logistical support(And where you have logistical support, you have supplies anyway). Not as helpful as the infinite ammo crates in 9.5, but hardly a crippling situation.

 

This was just a poorly thought out decision by the devs, and I hope they remove ALL resources from placed FOBs in a hotfix soon.

I think ammo crates should be like 225 or 250, cheap-ish but not spammable. That being said, some kits really do need ammo more than others.

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3 minutes ago, Arduras said:

I think ammo crates should be like 225 or 250, cheap-ish but not spammable. That being said, some kits really do need ammo more than others.

 

The ammo crate cost is irrelevant to the discussion. The problem is simply that FOBs start with any resources at all. There's no reason for it. Just played another round where people are dumping quick FOBs for a reload(Me included). Even in the middle of hotly contested areas, despite what people were claiming here.

 

Remove starting resources from FOBs, problem solved.

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50 minutes ago, tatzhit said:

 

Back in 9.5 you had to wait a couple minutes to get ammo crate, but resupplies were infinite. In 9.6 you can get one in about a minute all told, but it only gives one LAT resupply. Excuse me if I don't see a problem.
 
Enemy LATs wandering in far-off areas wasn't usually a problem in 9.5 with infinite resupply ammo crates, I doubt it will suddenly become a problem in 9.6 with the extremely limited ones. Moreover, if the enemy does camp main or hide in the back field, this means they remove one of their squads from fighting for objectives, which will likely hurt their team in the end.

Overall, I would say the FOB system changes might be inconvenient on some levels, but appear to be a good thing for game balance.

 

No, you don't just get one LAT resupply. YOU GET AS MANY AS YOU WANT BECAUSE YOU CAN JUST KEEP PLACING AND REMOVING FOBS. I just played a round where squads were doing this constantly(Me included). Got a couple of vehicle kills that I wouldn't even have gotten in 9.5 because resupply is so easily accessible.

 

It does not hurt the enemy to cut off all of a team's logistics, blocking HAB construction, ammo resupply, and vehicle field repairs, while also destroying vehicles costing tickets. 

 

Again, IT ISN'T INCONVENIENT. IT IS EXTREMELY CONVENIENT. I can resupply my LAT on the move in under a minute. Don't have to worry about waiting around for minutes, leaving a FOB unattended, or anything. Just dump, build, and remove. 

 

This isn't even a discussion anymore. It's already happening in-game constantly. Even in contested areas. 

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The starting points are there to give you the ability to give you a quickstart on building defenses and emplacements for the FOB, right? But because it can also be used for other things it becomes problematic. What if we remove the point cost for basic sandbag structures, as well as the cost of losing them, and also remove the starting points you get? Sandbags aren't really expensive assets anyway, they're literally bags of sand, so it would make sense to be able to churn those out with reckless abandon.

 

Maybe that would get people to make FOBs a bit more defendable in general, rather than having that situation where it's either a location worth spending points on, or it's not worth doing anything but the bare minimum. I think it might lead to more mid-tier FOBs without a lot of emplacements but with some more oomph. You'd still need constant supplies to maintain any sort of active base with mortars and hmgs and stuff, but you could at least form some sort of basic defensive structures to protect from attacks.

Edited by Qaiex

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28 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

 

The ammo crate cost is irrelevant to the discussion. The problem is simply that FOBs start with any resources at all. There's no reason for it. Just played another round where people are dumping quick FOBs for a reload(Me included). Even in the middle of hotly contested areas, despite what people were claiming here.

 

Remove starting resources from FOBs, problem solved.

 

Yep that seems like the best solution. Otherwise, its as you noted:

1) Put FOB

2) Put Ammo Crate

3) Get Ammo from Crate

4) Dig up FOB

5) Rinse and Repeat 

 

Really, you should have to bring a Logi with you in order to get points to a FOB quickly.

Edited by DoctorKamikaze

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2 hours ago, Kalev Kurg said:

Narva - Great map but i was waiting also for Narvas most famous thing "Hermans Castle"

 

  Hide contents

army-soldiers-and-estonian-army-scouts-m

Here you  can see US soldiers marching through the Narva (near the castle) on February 2017

 

As Estonian i didnt like the thing that the Narva is full of Ladas, Old Mercedes cars and etc Russian things. Also it is full of Russian languaged signs :D Narva is still an city of Estonia. But it is okay, atleast it have Grenholm Manufracture.

If you read notes there is a castle in narva in game 

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3 minutes ago, Qaiex said:

The starting points are there to give you the ability to start building a quickstart on building stuff for the FOB, right? What if we remove the point cost for basic sandbag structures, as well as the cost of losing them, and also remove the starting points you get? Sandbags aren't really expensive assets anyway, they're literally bags of sand, so it would make sense to be able to churn those out with reckless abandon.

 

Maybe that would get people to make FOBs a bit more defendable in general, rather than having that situation where it's either a location worth spending points on, or it's not worth doing anything but the bare minimum. I think it might lead to more mid-tier FOBs without a lot of emplacements but with some more oomph.

You'd still need constant supplies to maintain any sort of active base with mortars and hmgs and stuff, but you could at least form some sort of basic defensive structures to protect from attacks.

 

There's no need to complicate this. Remove the starting resources, problem solved. If you want to build fortifications and emplacements, simply get a logistics truck to deliver supplies.

 

If you want to see more varied FOB use, you need to remove the ticket value. The reason why you don't see anything other than fortified defensive objectives and barebones offensive FOBs is because placing a FOB to protect the flank of an objective with HMGs for a couple of minutes is not worth the risk of losing 20 tickets.

 

If I could set up FOBs without having to worry about potentially losing 20 tickets, I'd build fortified hardpoints on choke points and in overwatch positions. Especially if they reduced the build time a bit. But as it is, there's no way I'm going to risk 20 tickets to maybe have some effective fire on a target for a couple of minutes.

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43 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

 

The ammo crate cost is irrelevant to the discussion. The problem is simply that FOBs start with any resources at all. There's no reason for it. Just played another round where people are dumping quick FOBs for a reload(Me included). Even in the middle of hotly contested areas, despite what people were claiming here.

 

Remove starting resources from FOBs, problem solved.

 

What is a hotly contested area doing without a spawn FOB?

 

Once again: reloading was easier in 9.5 because you had to wait a couple minutes in order to had unlimited reloads. In 9.6, you can do it slightly quicker, but it only gives you one reload. What's better - infinite reloads for everyone in a couple minutes, or one reload for one LAT in one minute?

Yes, I get that now it's slightly quicker to "resupply on the move". But what kind of map is this relevant on? We're fighting over static objectives for chrissakes, are entire squads running circles out in the field or something, >400m from nearest combat area? 

Maybe for servers that have very little population or servers where people don't play the objective and wander out in the wilderness, this is an issue. Oh, and in Conquest mode (or whatever its called, the mode where all flags are capturable). But AFAIK hardly anyone plays it, and even there, back FOBs are much less of an issue now than 9.5 because they don't accumulate points anymore.

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10 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

 

There's no need to complicate this. Remove the starting resources, problem solved. If you want to build fortifications and emplacements, simply get a logistics truck to deliver supplies.

 

If you want to see more varied FOB use, you need to remove the ticket value. The reason why you don't see anything other than fortified defensive objectives and barebones offensive FOBs is because placing a FOB to protect the flank of an objective with HMGs for a couple of minutes is not worth the risk of losing 20 tickets.

 

If I could set up FOBs without having to worry about potentially losing 20 tickets, I'd build fortified hardpoints on choke points and in overwatch positions. Especially if they reduced the build time a bit. But as it is, there's no way I'm going to risk 20 tickets to maybe have some effective fire on a target for a couple of minutes.

They could have a fov where islts let's you build sandbags and ammo crate once per team member for that team bthis means you'd destory enemy ammo boxes at say ten tickets each then a base would cost 20 tickets too build once two bases can be build they. Would be like the current model .

 

So to understand this a fob would come a base two per team per map

A  new fob like thing would be able to build sand bags and ammo only no cost for losing the fob but a lose for the ammo box of ten tickets bases would lose a 20 ticket 

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18 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

 

There's no need to complicate this. Remove the starting resources, problem solved. If you want to build fortifications and emplacements, simply get a logistics truck to deliver supplies.

 

If you want to see more varied FOB use, you need to remove the ticket value. The reason why you don't see anything other than fortified defensive objectives and barebones offensive FOBs is because placing a FOB to protect the flank of an objective with HMGs for a couple of minutes is not worth the risk of losing 20 tickets.

 

If I could set up FOBs without having to worry about potentially losing 20 tickets, I'd build fortified hardpoints on choke points and in overwatch positions. Especially if they reduced the build time a bit. But as it is, there's no way I'm going to risk 20 tickets to maybe have some effective fire on a target for a couple of minutes.

 

Exactly, which is why free sandbags would be so beneficial. You remove the problem of infinite ammo crates by making it impossible to build ammo crates or any other construction without logi supplies, and at the same time you prevent the change from making FOBs without logi supplies completely defenseless, which I assume is the point of starting you with a small amount of construction points. Right? To encourage people to build actual Forward Operating Bases rather than deployable spawn points.

Edited by Qaiex

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2 minutes ago, Qaiex said:

 

Exactly, which is why free sandbags would be so beneficial. You remove the problem of infinite ammo crates by making it impossible to build ammo crates or any other construction without logi supplies, and at the same time you prevent the change from making FOBs without logi supplies completely defenseless, which I assume is the point of starting you with a small amount of construction points. Right? To encourage people to build actual Forward Operating Bases rather than deployable spawn points.

You could just make fob as real life with like a cheek poibtbof just ammo box abd sand bags the fob then would cost 10 tickets

 

Then a actually base would cost 20 tickets and could build mortars hesoc blocks etc 

 

Main base would be your starting point and vechines point etc but can't be built on 

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