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I played my first real night of squad since the 9.4 update released. Throughout the many rounds I played, I got to experience the mortars a good bit. I saw enemy points be barraged by our mortars, as well as enemy mortars barrage me. The effects and sounds are of course incredible, but I couldn't help noticing that they didn't really seem to be terribly effective. At one point a mortar shell landed just a couple meters in front of me, and I walked off just fine. It seemed like mortaring a point barely did anything at all to the enemy, and maybe even helped them with the time our team backed off of it to watch the salvo. Does anyone else think they might be a little too sucky?

Edited by Sorta

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Yup, they're extremely underpowered and short ranged compared to their real life counterparts. Because of inherently unrealistic parts of Squad such as main bases, flags, and map borders, that would tend to make mortars more powerful than they should be, they've been weakened. I do think they're still too weak in their current state though..

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Thats because non of you people are using it properly, sorry to tell you. Don't use it as a "Fire and hope you hit something" kind of weapon. You need a forward spotter. When I play with my mates I sit on the mortar while my SL places markers and calls corrections for me, I went 20 - 0 without a single resupply in about 40min. They are also extremely effective against light vehicles.

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^This totally.

I have seen 2x Squads absolutely destroyed and Whole Squads pinned down, making them obsolete just by Accurate MortarFire.

 

If you've survived a direct strike....Well its a bug or you're a lucky bastard. xD

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I've been killed only once by a mortar attack since their addition. Though I love using them when you have a good spotter to relay info.

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This is true, but then again you can spam enemies with tons of freedom. Nerf the shooting speed, buff damage please thank you best DEVs best gaem wooooooh <3 <3 <3

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I agree. Make it a one shot per load/more time in between each shot and a longer reload, then increase the damage and radius of the impacts, along with better penetration values.

Edited by Catindabox

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On 04/06/2017 at 0:27 PM, Sorta said:

I couldn't help noticing that they didn't really seem to be terribly effective.

They aren't just not effective. They are counter-productive. When you use mortars, you are actually hurting your team. Here is why:

1. You need 3 people to use mortars(2 mortars + 1 guy in the supply truck). 3 infantries can do so much more:

 

Mediocre infantry soldier(mediocre infantry player with 100 hours and 100 IQ) make 15 kills per round average(arithmetical average of all rounds). Good ones make 30 per round average(arithmetical average of all rounds). Multiply it by 3 infantry players and you get 45 kills between 3 players. In order to be able to justify use of mortars, you need to make at least ~40 kills using those 2 mortars. Which obviously will not happen. Some guy said he once did 20 kills using mortar. And that is Ok-ish and mediocre. In order to justify mortars, you need to make 20 kills average(not incapacitated but confirmed kills, after players give up). And the fact that some guy randomly got 20 kills with mortars once proves exactly my point(exception proves the rule). You need to make it every round to even just justify use of mortars itself. If you make less, it is just better to go infantry.

Mediocre mortars currently make 0-2 confirmed kills and about 4 incapacitated. Which is unacceptable.

 

2. You need to use construction points to put mortars. When you compare mortars to infantry, infantry don't require construction points and it is better to put ammo crate for your grenadier. 1 grenadier on 1 ammo crate doesn't require help of a supply truck or ammo points. 1 grenadier is also much more cost-effective, effective and efficient artillery than 2 mortars combined(it was a bad game by me, not even average grenadier-artillery spam):
If you want to compare mortars to vehicles, instead of 2 mortars people can put 2 repair stations for vehicles. Repair stations far more useful than mortars. Here's what mediocre driver can do on public server(I'm better than a mediocre driver but anyone can do this on public server):

 

Proper repair stations can help vehicles to get up to 50+ kills per vehicle(not to mention amount of enemy vehicles they can take down with the help of repair stations) and decide outcome of the match: 1 good driver on public can make enemy team to lose up to a 200 tickets(destroying enemy vehicles and infantries only). 2 good vehicles(2 players 1-manning 2 Strykers or one 30mm BTR and one 14mm BTR) combined can make enemy team lose up to a 300 tickets in a round(destroyed vehicles and infantries) on public FFA servers.

Mortars can't do even one tenths of that even if you had a wallhack and an aimbot for mortars because of 18 seconds lag of shells of mortars.

 

3. Mortars use ammo points, which vehicles could have used to actually do something useful. Very often I, as a vehicle driver, have to go to a main base or to another FOB to resupply because kids on mortars used all of the ammo on a closest FOB to me. If they made at least 20 kills per mortar, I could probably understand that. But they don't. At the end of the round they have ~2 kills(keksarcastic_hand.gif). And I lose this precious time on my vehicle to go to main base, which I could have used to destroy one more Stryker or 30mm BTR instead, or to kill whole enemy squads, if mortar kids hadn't use all ammo on the closest FOB.

 

4. Mortars completely occupy 1 supply truck, which could be going from FOB to FOB and resupply them, so SLs could put repair stations and ammo crates for their vehicles, grenadiers, medics and infantries, each of which(separately by themselves) are far more cost-effective, effective and efficient than 2 mortars combined together, as it was explained above.

 

If mortars were as powerful as in Battlefield 2, didn't use construction and ammo points, then they could be at least somehow a little bit effective(instead of counter-productive, as they are in Squad):

 

PS I don't care that it is used in the clan wars atm. Majority of people are just wrong. Majority of people is almost always wrong about majority of things, anyway. That's why top teams are top in all games, they see the game differently compared to majority of other people and they play game differently compared to majority.

 

Game is in alpha, changes a lot every few weeks and pretty much all teams(and people) play this game very poorly(and in the wrong way) compared to a level it could be if game didn't change that much and teams(and people) understood game better. And there is nothing wrong in not understanding that mortars are actually counter-productive unless you play this game 150 hours a week, which majority of people don't do, obviously.

Edited by Skul

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29 minutes ago, Skul said:

They aren't just not effective. They are counter-productive. When you use mortars, you are actually hurting your team. Here is why:

1. You need 3 people to use mortars(2 mortars + 1 guy in the supply truck). 3 infantries can do so much more
Disregarding the fact that you pulled those numbers about kills out of your ass.
You really only need 1 person to use mortars. That's the actual minimum and you would know that, if you ever used common sense. Mortar capacity = 1. One person = one mortar. That's it.

 

2. You need to use construction points to put mortars. When you compare mortars to infantry, infantry don't require construction points and it is better to put ammo crate for your grenadier.
Yes, because as we all know a GL can
1. scare away or destroy vehicles
2. effectively supress infantry
3. fire accurately at medium distance
4. fire at all over 600m or so..
Pls. Your name should be EmptySkul.

 

If you want to compare mortars to vehicles, instead of 2 mortars people can put 2 repair stations for vehicles.
Or you could have 1 repair station and 1 mortar, how about that lol

Proper repair stations can help vehicles to get up to 50+ kills per vehicle(not to mention amount of enemy vehicles they can take down with the help of repair stations) and decide outcome of the match: 1 good driver on public can make enemy team to lose up to a 200 tickets(destroying enemy vehicles and infantries only). 2 good vehicles(2 players 1-manning 2 Strykers or 1 30mm BTR and 1 14mm BTR) combined can make enemy team lose up to a 300 tickets in a round(destroyed vehicles and infantries) on public FFA servers.

Mortars can't do even one tenths of that even if you had a wallhack and an aimbot for mortars because of 18 seconds lag of shells of mortars.
Vehicles can also lose you a lot of tickets. Mortars don't.

 

3. Mortars use ammo points, which vehicles could have used to actually do something useful. Very often I, as a vehicle driver, have to go to a main base or to another FOB to resupply because kids on mortars used all of the ammo on a closest FOB to me. If they made at least 20 kills per mortar, I could probably understand that. But they don't. At the end of the round they have ~2 kills(keksarcastic_hand.gif). And I lose this precious time on my vehicle to go to main base, which I could have used to destroy one more Stryker or 30mm BTR instead, or to kill whole enemy squads, if mortar kids hadn't use all ammo on the closest FOB.
Are you actually making fun of someone because of their KD ratio? Disgusting.

 

4. Mortars completely occupy 1 supply truck, which could be going from FOB to FOB and resupply them, so SLs could put repair stations and ammo crates for their vehicles, grenadiers, medics and infantries, each of which(separately by themselves) are far more cost-effective, effective and efficient than 2 mortars combined together, as it was explained above.
That's just plainly false. The truck can still go from FOB to FOB. You would need to fire 2 mortars non-stop to completely occupy one truck and on bigger maps, there is more than one. Plus, noone is going to be mad if you decide to use the truck for 5 minutes to make a new FOB instead of resupplying their mortars. Communicate. Ask.

Overall I think you're suffering from the so called V7 delusion. That is to say, a new toy is added into the game and you get mad, because the vast majority of people haven't learned how to use it.

 

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Splash damage needs increasing and damage.

 

Also we want sexy smoke nades back please, and the old dust kick up we had.

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21 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

Just target HABs and you'll be swimming in kills.

Show us a video? What's swimming in kills? 20? 50? 70?

 

23 hours ago, CC-Marley said:

I've been killed only once by a mortar attack since their addition. Though I love using them when you have a good spotter to relay info.

I think I have been incapacitated once or twice by mortars, got revived 5 seconds later by a medic. I don't think I have ever been actually killed by mortars. Never got destroyed in a vehicle by a mortar(2500 hours played so far). So it kinda hints how useful mortars actually are... I even like when I get mortared, it makes people think I'm going to sit inside buildings or whatever. I push in front of mortar fire instead or use their sounds as a cover to make a maneuver, so enemies can't hear me sprinting and while they are waiting for mortar fire to stop firing, so they can move themselves...

 

On 04/06/2017 at 4:14 PM, NanoAgeWarrior said:

Don't use it as a "Fire and hope you hit something" kind of weapon. You need a forward spotter. When I play with my mates I sit on the mortar while my SL places markers and calls corrections for me, I went 20 - 0 without a single resupply in about 40min. They are also extremely effective against light vehicles.

You need to go 20+ every round to justify use of these mortars. If you don't go 20+ every round, it is counter-productive.

 

On 04/06/2017 at 3:02 PM, Shields said:

If used properly they're worth using.

Video? Anyone? At least 20 kills, every round?

Edited by Skul

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7 minutes ago, Skul said:

Do you even understand how hard it will be for me and other people to quote you when you use your method to quote other people? I'm not even going to start to try to quote these monstrosity quotes you use.


It's pretty easy actually, just rely on your own numbered list. Poor excuse.

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1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Overall I think you're suffering from the so called V7 delusion. That is to say, a new toy is added into the game and you get mad, because the vast majority of people haven't learned how to use it.

Nah. Not my case. For example, I think IEDs and mines are a very good, balanced and proper tools.

I can even tell you from here UH-60 with its mini-guns will probably rule this game(100 kills between gunners) for a long time after it will be released if OWI don't make overpowered anti-aircraft guns(like in BF3/4).

It will be a massacre(like in BF2 and Bad Company 2):

 

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

That's just plainly false. The truck can still go from FOB to FOB. You would need to fire 2 mortars non-stop to completely occupy one truck and on bigger maps, there is more than one.

You're missing the point. Truck should be constantly going from FOB to FOB without interfering to resupply counter-productive mortars. Doesn't matter if there is 1 or 2 trucks on the map.

 

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Plus, noone is going to be mad if you decide to use the truck for 5 minutes to make a new FOB instead of resupplying their mortars. Communicate. Ask.

Nah, doesn't work like that in real world. Kids just continue to go from main towards their super mortar FOB to resupply their ammo on their mortars. They almost never give you their supply truck.

 

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Are you actually making fun of someone because of their KD ratio? Disgusting.

Only because of their profanity and make-belief that they know something about the game, when in fact they know exactly jack.

When players ask something, I politely tell them how to do something right. The thing is that majority think they know everything about this game when in fact they don't know anything about this game.

 

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Vehicles can also lose you a lot of tickets. Mortars don't.

Yes, you're right about vehicles. But about mortars you're not right. Mortars can't lose you tickets only directly. Indirectly they can lose you a lot of tickets and even lose matches for you because of explained reasons above(waste of human resources, supply truck, construction points, ammo points, etc.). Poor use of vehicles can, obviously, lose matches for you, too. But the thing is, proper use of vehicles carry matches while mortars can't possibly carry matches even if you had wallhack and an aimbot for mortars.

 

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Yes, because as we all know a GL can
1. scare away or destroy vehicles
2. effectively supress infantry
3. fire accurately at medium distance
4. fire at all over 600m or so..
Pls. Your name should be EmptySkul.

1. GL can do that more effectively than mortars.

2. GL can do that more effectively than mortars.

3. GL can do that more effectively than mortars.

4. GL can do that more effectively than mortars.

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

You really only need 1 person to use mortars. That's the actual minimum and you would know that, if you ever used common sense. Mortar capacity = 1. One person = one mortar. That's it.

1 person will just use all ammo on the FOB, which could be used to resupply vehicles, which actually do a lot of work on the map(as you could see on videos above, which I provided).

1 hour ago, Peerun said:

Disregarding the fact that you pulled those numbers about kills out of your ass.

Nah, 2500 hours played. Just experience and personal notes while playing publics, clan wars and tournaments with and against players of all kinds.

 

I also wonder Peerun, what makes you such an expert in this game(idc how many posts you have on this forum)?

Edited by Skul

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as a combat engineer for the U.S Army Ive seen mortars fire and strike their targets both far away and up close, the fastest mortar team in the army can fire 1 round in about 3-4 seconds, the slowest can still fire 1 round in between 5-10 seconds so asking to nerf the reload time is ridiculous cause then it wouldn't be a accurate weapons system.

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I think the biggest question to ask is are the people using them having fun? If so, then I think it's a good addition. Things can always be tweaked, but if people are enjoying them, have at it.

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