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As you all know devs added some wierd stuff like MTLB 30mm and MTLB KPVT 14.5. I just want to ask where did you get info these vehicles are in service? The MTLB itself is just a multi-purpose towing vehicle probably equally compared to M113. Why the hell you decided to make them as IFV. Maximum it can carry troops and be in a role as APC (armed with 7.62 or 12.7). Are you making this game based on real facts or just your imagination? 

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Those versions of the MTLB exist and are used. I've seen some footage of the 30mm MTLB used in Russian army drills for example.

 

There are two reasons the devs added this archaic APC at this point in development. Firstly, they already had access to the model, from what I recall one of the devs made the MTLBM prior to the development of Squad. Secondly, at this point in the game a more advanced vehicle couldn't really be sustained for both balance and systems reasons.

 

The MTLB is probably going to become a rarity for Russian forces when more vehicles are added, but I think Militia and Insurgents will continue to use them.

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Currently in the game we do not have a single IFV, so what you are claiming is false. We only got APCs, MTLB is an APC. Even though they put 30mm on it it does not make it IFV.

 

Can you provide me a link of where I can check Russian line of upgunned MTLBs? I want to see if that 30mm is there.

 

As I remember these tracked MTLBs are still in service in the north of the country, while in the south you can see more BTRs, all depends on the weather and environment.  Not to forget they are fully amphibious, can't wait until we see full advantages and disadvantages in the game.

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According to wikipedia the 30mm variant is designated as an MT-LB 6MB by the Russians, but it seems there are are even a few variants of 30mm turrets. Not sure how their designation works exactly.

 

Also, there are quite a few other countries around the world who have MT-LBs in service, and some also do their own modifications.

Edited by JarryHead

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APC's are pretty much lesser armed IFV's, it comes down to the situation and what role it requires to take up depending on the scenario. If troops are dismounted and are in need of a heavier weapon and/or cover, then APC's will assist and act to some degree in the role of an IFV. With Squad only having transport, logistics and APC's in game currently, the APC's not only fill in as a transport but also in a fire support role...even if a large portion of Squads player base use them like they're Abram's MBT's in the middle of Fallujah.

Also a light warning, if you want to be taken seriously and want players/devs to acknowledge your post, be a little more respectful. Also take note of these forum rules for future reference.

 

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36 minutes ago, Stom said:

Those versions of the MTLB exist and are used. I've seen some footage of the 30mm MTLB used in Russian army drills for example.

 

There are two reasons the devs added this archaic APC at this point in development. Firstly, they already had access to the model, from what I recall one of the devs made the MTLBM prior to the development of Squad. Secondly, at this point in the game a more advanced vehicle couldn't really be sustained for both balance and systems reasons.

 

The MTLB is probably going to become a rarity for Russian forces when more vehicles are added, but I think Militia and Insurgents will continue to use them.

 

The 30mm MTLB footage was made in early 2000. And they were just a prototypes and unseccessfull ones. 

You will see none of them in russian army (i mean 30mm 2a42 and 14.5mm KPVT). 

Thats what I'm pointing to.

Other MTLBs are very common in russian army with PKT 7.62 and 12.7 NSVT.

 

P.S. I'm not arguing about tactics in use of this vehicle. 

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45 minutes ago, Rainmaker said:

Currently in the game we do not have a single IFV, so what you are claiming is false. We only got APCs, MTLB is an APC. Even though they put 30mm on it it does not make it IFV.

 

Can you provide me a link of where I can check Russian line of upgunned MTLBs? I want to see if that 30mm is there.

 

As I remember these tracked MTLBs are still in service in the north of the country, while in the south you can see more BTRs, all depends on the weather and environment.  Not to forget they are fully amphibious, can't wait until we see full advantages and disadvantages in the game.

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MT-LB here is the link that shows all modifications of MTLB include prototypes which never went into production include 6MA 14.5 and 6MB 30mm. They are in service around the country (it's not depends on climate) as towing vehicle or as APC (7.62mm and 12.7mm) nothing more.

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49 minutes ago, JarryHead said:

According to wikipedia the 30mm variant is designated as an MT-LB 6MB by the Russians, but it seems there are are even a few variants of 30mm turrets. Not sure how their designation works exactly.

 

Also, there are quite a few other countries around the world who have MT-LBs in service, and some also do their own modifications.

 

I do understand, but puting these prototype vehicles in game makes no sense. Why not to make some laser tanks soviets produced? They were also a prototypes. I hope you see my point.

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Firstly - I agree with z3k4. You are most likely guided by the imagination, adding this technique to the game. At the same time, nobody living in Russia consulted with anyone from anyone.
Mtlb is used in the Russian army, but only within the country. I did not see any confirmation of the use of this technique in real combat (in any other
A real conflict) over the past 40 years.
Especially in such modifications. With 30mm and with 14,5mm.

 


Come please to Russia on August 22-27. We will host a military exhibition "Army 2017". 
It will display the entire Russian technique used by the Russian Army. And you will not need to invent inexistent and unused equipment and weapons.

 

If there is no such opportunity to come. Then just ask the community about weapons. And not be guided by false internet gossip that our army is equiped with sticks and stones.

 

Secondly - @Dubs no one asked about the rules or tactics of the application of this technique in the game or in real combat.

 

Thirdly - @Dubs no one insulted anyone. Reminder of the rules here is unnecessary.
 

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13 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

I do understand, but puting these prototype vehicles in game makes no sense. Why not to make some laser tanks soviets produced? They were also a prototypes. I hope you see my point.

 

But what makes you think they are prototypes? Information of the production of these modernized MT-LBs will surely be hard to find on the internet, but I'm pretty sure they aren't just prototypes.

You'll probably struggle to find any references to them being used in combat, but it doesn't mean they don't exists. The modernized MT-LBs were only developed during the 90s.

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Can't we just agree that in the "world of Squad" the MT-LB prototypes were successful and were put into service. This is the thing about games, books, movies etc. You can take stuff from the real world but you can alter some stuff.

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1 hour ago, Dubs said:

APC's are pretty much lesser armed IFV's, it comes down to the situation and what role it requires to take up depending on the scenario. If troops are dismounted and are in need of a heavier weapon and/or cover, then APC's will assist and act to some degree in the role of an IFV. With Squad only having transport, logistics and APC's in game currently, the APC's not only fill in as a transport but also in a fire support role...even if a large portion of Squads player base use them like they're Abram's MBT's in the middle of Fallujah.

Also a light warning, if you want to be taken seriously and want players/devs to acknowledge your post, be a little more respectful. Also take note of these forum rules for future reference.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

§1 Show Respect

This community can only work if we all respect each other. To that end, it is imperative that any time you engage with another user, either directly or indirectly, you show them respect with the content of your post. In particular refrain from flaming, insulting, abusing, taunting, racism, and other similar types of actions towards other forum users.

 

§2 Attitude & Behavior

Poor attitude and behavior are the most common ways a negative / unsafe environment is created and perpetuated. As such that kind of behavior will not be allowed on these forums. Please be mindful of this rule when posting personal positions and opinions regarding topics which could be considered contentious in nature. As a rule of thumb, keep your posts civil in nature, and refrain from making posts that are likely to incite arguments and create a negative environment. As a privately hosted web forum we reserve the right to maintain an environment that we are happy the majority of our players are comfortable with.

§5 Attitude towards Squad and the Development Team
As per §1 and §2, keep in mind to be respectful and reasonable, not only towards all users of the forum, but also towards the Squad Team and towards any ideas and content and the game itself. Criticism is welcome, but if it is not constructive and/or if it is offensive, the Moderation may need to step in. Please refrain from posting if you are upset, angry or drunk, or you may be punished for things you wouldn’t have otherwise written, which is not in anyone's interest.

 


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I'm so sorry, but don't take it as an offence. This development of vehicles you never saw, and never used and can judge by watching videos reminds me Hollywood movies where american actors playing russians with horrible accent which I (russian) can't understand. But americans and other non russian speakers will think it's a real russian language. The same happens here with these vehicles, weapons and other stuff. 

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6 minutes ago, JarryHead said:

 

But what makes you think they are prototypes? Information of the production of these modernized MT-LBs will surely be hard to find on the internet, but I'm pretty sure they aren't just prototypes.

You'll probably struggle to find any references to them being used in combat, but it doesn't mean they don't exists. The modernized MT-LBs were only developed during the 90s.

 

What mekes you think they are not? I don't think you can argue being in South Africa about russian vehicles with russian?! Just imagine if I'd say americans mostly use M113 as main IFV with 25mm gun. 

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4 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

What mekes you think they are not? I don't think you can argue being in South Africa about russian vehicles with russian?! Just imagine if I'd say americans mostly use M113 as main IFV with 25mm gun. 

 

I'm not claiming to be an expert, I'm just speculating. I asked you why you think they we're only developed as prototypes, but you gave no answer.
 

I guess the fact that you can find photos of these variants being displayed at exhibitions would make me think that they want to sell them, but whether they are in service, I would not know.

Getting back to the point of your first post, the devs didn't use their imagination, because these vehicles do exists, whether only as prototypes or not. They just decided to implement them, because they can. Squad has never tried to be 100% factual, most of the maps are fictional.

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1 minute ago, JarryHead said:

 

I'm not claiming to be an expert, I'm just speculating. I asked you why you think they we're only developed as prototypes, but you gave no answer.
 

I guess the fact that you can find photos of these variants being displayed at exhibitions would make me think that they want to sell them, but whether they are in service, I would not know.

Getting back to the point of your first post, the devs didn't use their imagination, because these vehicles do exists, whether only as prototypes or not. They just decided to implement them, because they can. Squad has never tried to be 100% factual, most of the maps are fictional.

 

Because it is a prototype. Russian army has a aconscription system and NONE of my friends saw such types of vehicles. Some of the tank divisions not even have MTLBs in any configuration. As i said in other post if they use prototypes in game why wouldn't they put a soviet laser tank https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1K17_Szhatie

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1 minute ago, z3k4 said:

As i said in other post if they use prototypes in game why wouldn't they put a soviet laser tank

Because they don't want to. But they wanted different variants of the MT-LB so they put them in

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3 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

Because it is a prototype. Russian army has a aconscription system and NONE of my friends saw such types of vehicles. Some of the tank divisions not even have MTLBs in any configuration. As i said in other post if they use prototypes in game why wouldn't they put a soviet laser tank https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1K17_Szhatie

 

Well, thank you for answering, now you've given a basis for your argument. 
 

That is an interesting laser tank prototype, if there was a good use for it, the devs could make it xD

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44 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

I'm so sorry, but don't take it as an offence. This development of vehicles you never saw, and never used and can judge by watching videos reminds me Hollywood movies where american actors playing russians with horrible accent which I (russian) can't understand. But americans and other non russian speakers will think it's a real russian language. The same happens here with these vehicles, weapons and other stuff. 

Speaking of generalizations...

How do movies relate to the development of this game?
Something wrong with the weapons too? AK? Other stuff?

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38 minutes ago, Thenis said:

Can't we just agree that in the "world of Squad" the MT-LB prototypes were successful and were put into service. This is the thing about games, books, movies etc. You can take stuff from the real world but you can alter some stuff.


This is pretty much it, hence why we have fictional scenarios such as RU vs US in combined arms conflict or even the more bizarre RU vs MIL in the middle of Afghanistan - Because they can and it gives variation. Same thing with vehicles.

MTLB's were primarily added from my understanding, to give variation and give RU, MIL & INS something to all use, to fight U.S vehicles and give them low cost vehicles for transport/fire support. They were also the first vehicles made for track support which was a huge milestone. 

Basically, Squad is looking for authenticity, hence the realistic soldier load outs, equipment and camouflage, but sometimes gameplay, variation and balance comes into play and thats when devs can get a little creative.


 

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7 minutes ago, Nimbus said:

Speaking of generalizations...

How do movies relate to the development of this game?
Something wrong with the weapons too? AK? Other stuff?

 

It relates to things they make. Like all westerners imagine their "RUSSIAN WORLD" a one big icy part of a MOTHERLAND. You see what you want to see. To understand a nation you have to get into it's culture, language, traditions. But instead of this you prefer to live in a world where Russia meets your criteria based on internet and american movies. 

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6 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

It relates to things they make. Like all westerners imagine their "RUSSIAN WORLD" a one big icy part of a MOTHERLAND. You see what you want to see. To understand a nation you have to get into it's culture, language, traditions. But instead of this you prefer to live in a world where Russia meets your criteria based on internet and american movies. 

Right...

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OWI, the developers of Squad, have said many times that they want to include actual assets used by the various forces in game. As far as good gameplay allows they intend to stick to real abilities and "most common" configurations in all areas. I am sure they have done extensive research into what is already in game and also have plans to alter many items. They are human and have limited resources so there may (will be) many placeholders and perhaps even...MISTAKES!

 

They would never deliberately provoke any person or nation through game asset choices but I am sure they would appreciate constructive and expert advice from someone they feel they should respect. 

@z3k4I assume English is not your first language and this can forgive the apparent rudeness of the first post in this thread, perhaps it was not intended. Take care with the way you phrase your content, it is very easy to appear to readers as an angry d1ckhead.

 

You should assume OWI wants the best from Squad and if you can provide verifiable evidence of items which should be included or removed in a friendly way then they are far more likely to pay attention to you.

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17 minutes ago, z3k4 said:

 

It relates to things they make. Like all westerners imagine their "RUSSIAN WORLD" a one big icy part of a MOTHERLAND. You see what you want to see. To understand a nation you have to get into it's culture, language, traditions. But instead of this you prefer to live in a world where Russia meets your criteria based on internet and american movies. 

You  paint with a broad brush my friend.

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7 hours ago, Condemned117 said:

Firstly - I agree with z3k4. You are most likely guided by the imagination, adding this technique to the game. At the same time, nobody living in Russia consulted with anyone from anyone.
Mtlb is used in the Russian army, but only within the country. I did not see any confirmation of the use of this technique in real combat (in any other
A real conflict) over the past 40 years.

Especially in such modifications. With 30mm and with 14,5mm.

 

Well that part is blatantly false. MTLBs were used in pretty much every war that USSR participated in, especially vigorously - in the many post-Soviet civil wars, including the most recent one in Ukraine.

 

l9PVSI9.jpg

(Hello militia)

 

Yy1OaqCqP5w.jpg

(Hello militia x2)

 

1292155794_2.jpg

(MTLB with a repurposed MLRS system, Georgia 1991)

 

They are currently used in the Middle East with all sorts of weapons installed, and there are plenty of interesting modifications from various countries, chiefly because this vehicle is cheap, reliable, and capable of carrying extra weight.

 

1193932_original.jpg

(73mm BMP1 turret)

 

1191743_original.jpg

(dual 23mm, would be badass in Squad)

 

84674005.jpg

(Armenian Dakka, 57mm autocannon

 

297280_original.jpg)

(dual 14.5)

 

231729_original.jpg

(Polish, with 120mm mortar)

 

1323985858_zsu_sopel.jpg

(also Polish, AAA, dual 23mm plus mounted MANPADs)


However, it is true that MTLBs are not particularly suited for combat, and the 14.5 and 30mm are uncommon.

Also, looks like Ukrainians made their own 30mm version, and even sold a couple dozen to South Central Asia.
https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/МТ-ЛБМШ

 

MTLB-Shturm_11.jpg

 

84199_original.jpg

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MT-LBM VMK, MT-LBM 6MA and 6MB are not prototypes. These vehicles are used by 34th mountain brigade, 200th motor rifle brigade, 39th and138th separated motor rifle brigades and others. Soviet and russian ground forces always had motor rifle units with MT-LB as APCs and IFVs, usually in difficult regions, such as mountains, Ural and polar areas, Far East military districs. Current variants, armed with BTR modules, were developed by 21st Scientific Research Testing Institute of Automobile Industry of Ministry of Defense and were produced in the end of 90s by "Muromteplovoz" by the suggestion of Ministry of Defense.

 

 "Search" function is your best friend on these forums.

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