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Aniallator

New kit group: "Specialized", which SL has to approve

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Currently Squad has three kit groups; Command and Support, Riflemen, and Fire Support. With the kits in-game right now, this system is fine. However, eventually we'll start seeing kits like heavy anti-tank, engineer, anti-air, machine gunner, possibly even sniper. These kits are very specialized, very powerful, and should be extremely limited... so how to implement that? Simple. Put these kits in a fourth kit group, "Specialized". A squad would be limited to only one Specialized kit, and for someone to use it, the SL would literally have to approve it for them: if no one else is using a Specialized kit in the squad and a player opens the spawn screen and clicks a Specialized kit, they would not receive it, as first a popup would appear for the SL, saying "Allow PlayerXYZ to use the [whatever Specialized kit the player clicked] kit?" The SL could then click yes or no. If yes, the player is able to select the kit the SL approved for him (and not any other Specialized kits). If no, the player keeps his current kit.

 

With this system...

Kits like HAT, AA, MG, etc are limited to one such kit per squad.

Players literally cannot use such a kit without the SL's approval.

Solves the "Sniper Problem".

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The Squad Leader should have complete control to decide the loadout of his entire squad, not just a few "specialized" kits.

 

 

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There have been many solutions around this idea, 

I like them because it puts accountability on the SL's

 

But considering other conversations about limiting players, Not sure its something the devs want to see.

But I do like at least the SL's being able to control who is getting what just like vehicles get approved ect.

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39 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

The Squad Leader should have complete control to decide the loadout of his entire squad, not just a few "specialized" kits.

 

 

 

That's not necessary and would only end up being annoying for the SL. It's easy to tell your squad which kits to take, and if they don't take them, kick them.

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11 minutes ago, Aniallator said:

 

That's not necessary and would only end up being annoying for the SL. It's easy to tell your squad which kits to take, and if they don't take them, kick them.

 

 

This is true, but "annoying" an SL when you assume they track each persons kit through an entire match, is a bit.. odd?

Right either ANYtime someone wants marksman they ask the SL for it, 

Or the SL has to track who has what and then ask and then kick if they don't.

They both have similar "effort" exerted. Its much easier for an SL to be asked for something, instead of being asked to track something throughout a match. 

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4 minutes ago, KCIV said:

 

 

This is true, but "annoying" an SL when you assume they track each persons kit through an entire match, is a bit.. odd?

Right either ANYtime someone wants marksman they ask the SL for it, 

Or the SL has to track who has what and then ask and then kick if they don't.

They both have similar "effort" exerted. Its much easier for an SL to be asked for something, instead of being asked to track something throughout a match. 

 

Except that having the SL approve each and every kit is a lot less pleasant everyone else in the squad. Then of course you have squads with not a lot of teamwork where some mic-less SL is supposed to do this. And what if the SL goes AFK? That system just doesn't work.

Edited by Aniallator

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4 minutes ago, Aniallator said:

 

Except having the SL approve each and every kit is a lot less pleasant everyone else in their squad, who has to get their kit approved. Then you have squads with not a lot of teamwork where some mic-less SL is supposed to do this. And what if the SL goes AFK? That system just doesn't work.



its not each and every kit. As I recall it was about specialty kits. so at most 3 at any given time. (which is beginning of the game) and maybe a few times mid match when someone leaves and a new player joins.

your points about non teamwork SL's is actually a benefit. You Don't want a non teamwork no mic squad having free access to specialty kits playing in non teamwork solo play. The same way you SL approval for vehicles. You have to ask for it.

The number of times you have an AFK SL when you need the kit is rare, and also besides the point since an AFK SL has no rallies, ect. Since there already exists system based on the system of asking the SL its fair to say its not a valid argument against, Or if valid, not enough to prevent its testing.

This doesn't mean that you can't notify the SL with a message when a specialty kit is taken. IE "Yoloswagvapekit500" took marksman. 

This way SL doesn't have to track that information, and they can easily deal with that situation right away. 

Edited by KCIV

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1 minute ago, Aniallator said:

 

That's not necessary and would only end up being annoying for the SL. It's easy to tell your squad which kits to take, and if they don't take them, kick them.

 

No, it wouldn't be annoying. The current situation is annoying. What you're suggesting is annoying. Constant popups from whiny squad members wanting to be 1337 force with the Marksman. No thanks. My suggestions would be far less time-consuming than that.

 

Firstly, there's no way to really keep track of what kits your squad has or who has what unless you're staring at the squad list all day. And if you have 5-10 people cycling through your squad each match, it's really annoying to have to keep them up to date on that stuff in addition to everything else, as well. If I were to kick anyone who takes a kit without permission, I'd have to kick 99% of the people who join my squad.

 

Being able to preset your squad's loadout to any degree you'd like, through templates and on the fly, will allow you to communicate your needs to everyone before they even join the squad. All the current system does is create a hostile environment, miscommunication, useless communication, and frustration. What happens when you kick a player for not following your orders is they beeline straight for you and teamkill you. I ban people for that shit nearly every day I play. That's what this system does.

 

By being able to preset your squad's loadout, you are able to communicate what your squad does, what roles are still available in the squad, and what potential squad members can expect while in your squad. If you're running an infantry squad with a small recon element and some guy joins thinking he'll get in on some heavy infantry combat, but the only available slots are recon, that's currently not something that can be communicated to him before he's joined your squad and probably picked a kit and spawned already. When he's informed of this he can either refuse and get kicked(And probably try to TK you), refuse and not get kicked, accept, or willingly leave the squad, ending up stranded without a proper kit. None of these options are good, and only two are barely acceptable.

 

If you are able to show what potential squad members what their roles will be before they join the squad, all of this useless and negative communication can be removed from the game.

 

If you have a Mech Inf squad, a joining squad member might want to know if they're going to play as a Medic, a Rifleman, or an APC gunner. Current system: Need to be given that information after joining, probably also after selecting a kit and spawning. Squad templates: Player knows what roles are available before even joining the squad, and can choose whether to pick those roles or go for another squad without having to get into an argument with SL, get kicked from the squad, and then go on a TK rampage.

 

A lot of people don't want to squad lead exactly because of situations like the one above that arise all the time and require the SL to put his foot down. And when they reluctantly go SL anyway, they're unable to effectively do their part because they avoid those situations. The SL's authority is already affected at this point, and their squad members take greater and greater liberties. Eventually you end up with a bunch of lonewolves attached to a smaller squad.

 

It also aids in complex organizational structures. If you want to divide your squad into fireteams with specific functions and capabilities, you want those to be maintained throughout the match, even if half your squad changes in the meantime. Having to inform new squad members of what the fireteams are, who should go where, and who should do what every time they join is not good gameplay or communication. If you can set the loadouts of the fireteams, this is not something you have to deal with. The current system is a massive hindrance to any more complex gameplay.

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Guys there's a solution! It's called....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Join/find a private match! You won't find a lot of these problems there!

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I like the idea of the SL being able to "activate" roles so those roles are available for the squad to use, and ones he doesn't "activate" are unavailable. That way if you end up with a lot of cycling marksman idiots they can't take the kit and screw off unabated until you figure out you're short a man.

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16 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

-snip-

 

What I meant by "annoying" is a system where to use a kit, you have to request it where the SL gets a yes or no popup. If that were applied to all the kits, yes, it'd be annoying as ****, not to mention when you're in the middle of clearing a building. Sorry, I'm not about to go through two long threads from 2014... you started going on about squads being able to have three ARs and I stopped reading. I've never been TK'd by a pissy squad member and rarely have to kick people... if you get TK'd for that nearly every day maybe you're doing something wrong. Maybe that's just EU servers.

 

Anyway.

 

Something like this? When you create a squad, the squad isn't initially created but rather you're presented with a screen of all the kits available to you. You can then select kits squad members will be able to use, then hit "Done" and your squad is created with the kit restrictions you specified. If that's all that's to it that's fine!

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