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What is up with the limited conceptual perception of Squad ?.

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2 minutes ago, Romby said:

 

you clearly dont understand that what you did wasn't really that hard since militia has no counters to your BTR on a big open map like yeho.

 

i really dont get how your example of you annihilating militia on one of the most unbalanced maps should make militia players look forward to Russia getting T90s and MI24s.

 

Btw im looking forward to this myself since i know the devs in the future will add more tool to militia, making everything more fair.

 

... Holy molly. Read the edit.

 

What I do is replicating a military though process. I don't start hunting for squads, I try and shadow the most mobile assets and the most valuable. It happens that the techies are as lightly armored as the logis. Like it is in the real life.

 

Furthermore it's a wrong assumption to say that the BTR is too powerful. Quite the contrary, unless you are with a very good driver, chances are you're going to become dogfood pretty fast on Yehorivka. 

 

Also as i said, it's called Assymetrical warfare for a reason...DWI.

 

All is fair in love and war.

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Im sorry but i don’t agree about BTRs having a hard time on Yeho against militia at all. Yeho Rus vs Militia is the easiest map for BTR. You pretty much have to be a idiot driver to lose vehicle on that map. I know you see BTRs going down often but that doesnt mean it is hard (just that there is a lot of idiot drivers!). Chora is a hard map for BTRs!

 

Talking about assymetrical warfare is nice and all, but if you can't give one team sticks and stones and expect them to be excided about fighting a team with guns. And some might take offense to you saying everything is fine when you are part of the team with guns.

 

Btw all im saying is your argument would have been more interesting if you were part of a militia team that had backcapped russians on yeho and not the other way around.

Edited by Romby

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... I offered you two examples on the issues you have with armored assets when things go well or when they don't, you chose to pick up on the first one, albeit I clearly said, the game basically rested on 9 guys (1 squad and the BTR) because the BTR driver applied military sound thinking.

 

While the second map ended up as a loss despite all squads cooperating and me and the driver, doing exactly the same thing with the same game plan and exact same result in KD-ratio. In bonus the driver racked up 18 kills on the Fool's road. Basically we had a better round than the Yehorivka and we still lost. 

 

How can you lose a BTR in Yehorivka? Like I said very easily coming under fire from Techie, getting fixed and getting a couple of RPG's. A well organized squad will make your BTR ride very rough, especially as they can shoot your driver with one RPG and then proceed to kill you once your try to haul ass in the same fashion.

 

Also 50 cal emplacements are there for you. 

 

Chora a hard map...not particularly, drive along the river, keep the flanks, very easy to see people coming and the M72 is really a pain to aim with.

 

Also, My point demonstrates exactly that. Vehicles don't impact the game in the same way, you shouldn't use them in the same way. If you want BluFOR vs RedFOR then pick your servers differently. Or play Battlefield.

 

 

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The fear of full warfare in squad basically roots from being powerless i feel. Then again, it really depends how you/the enemy uses the vehicles. 
If they are used properly they can do alot of damage, if you just rambo into a BF you will lose your vehicle. Especially against militia whom have the AT nades and AT launchers. Now with the AT mines coming it will completely be a shitshow for vehicles.

Also all overal i welcome it, it will bring so manny more dimensions to the game and will force much more teamwork then it does now. 

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The debate between vehicles and infantry-only has been waged for many years, and  will likely continue for many more.  It's merely a matter of each individuals preference/opinion. I'm not sure why anyone would think the "vanilla" game play of SQUAD should be infantry-only though, from day 1 it's been marketed with vehicles.

 

Once SQUAD actually releases, if there aren't infantry-only servers...I'll put one up.  It's not that I'm against vehicles, I just preferred the flow of the game play when the game was infantry-only.   It felt more cohesive, tactical (in a sneaky sort of way) and teamwork oriented to me.

 

I think vehicles add more dimension to the game, but they can also become more of a cluster**** as far as teamwork is concerned. They're great in clan scrimmage and tournament settings, but their usage will always be a crapshoot in pubs.

Edited by Verdin

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1 hour ago, Verdin said:

The debate between vehicles and infantry-only has been waged for many years, and  will likely continue for many more.  It's merely a matter of each individuals preference/opinion. I'm not sure why anyone would think the "vanilla" game play of SQUAD should be infantry-only though, from day 1 it's been marketed with vehicles.

 

Once SQUAD actually releases, if there aren't infantry-only servers...I'll put one up.  It's not that I'm against vehicles, I just preferred the flow of the game play when the game was infantry-only.   It felt more cohesive, tactical (in a sneaky sort of way) and teamwork oriented to me.

 

I think vehicles add more dimension to the game, but they can also become more of a cluster**** as far as teamwork is concerned. They're great in clan scrimmage and tournament settings, but their usage will always be a crapshoot in pubs.


Lol public matches is just bullshit in general. Vehicles or no vehicles. i think those of us that take squad serious can agree on that

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22 minutes ago, -MG said:


Lol public matches is just bullshit in general. Vehicles or no vehicles. i think those of us that take squad serious can agree on that

 

I wouldn't say pub matches are necessarily BS, as I've played in some really good ones.  I think it's just a crapshoot, as to whether you can find a team in pub matches that will work cohesively together or not. That's just the nature of multiplayer pubs matches for most fps games, in general.

 

Without vehicles, pub matches can potentially have less chaos going on and more focus on the tactics of being sneaky...lol. 

 

It all comes down to how the game is played.

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16 minutes ago, Verdin said:

 

I wouldn't say pub matches are necessarily BS, as I've played in some really good ones.  I think it's just a crapshoot, as to whether you can find a team in pub matches that will work cohesively together or not. That's just the nature of multiplayer pubs matches for most fps games, in general.

 

Without vehicles, pub matches can potentially have less chaos going on and more focus on the tactics of being sneaky...lol. 

 

It all comes down to how the game is played.


I agree with your last sentence,other then that....There are always ways for trolls or salty individuals to ruin your day. They either start spammingtheir gun to give away your location and when you kick em they start Tk'ing and if you can't reach an admin; you're ****ed. Also a new trend going on....Placing FOBS all over the map that have no relevant strategic purpose as for increasing chances of winning a game. I can expand this shitlist more if you like even now we are partially ttied to Infantry gameplay. Let me not start about the fuccery on mobile end, like waisting Armed vehicles or getting logi's stuck or blown up.

Then again, depending on how realistic the dev's are going to make the damage models on tanks....they won't be invinsable. Each tank has it's weakness, even inreallife. 

 

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35 minutes ago, -MG said:

I agree with your last sentence,other then that....There are always ways for trolls or salty individuals to ruin your day. They either start spammingtheir gun to give away your location and when you kick em they start Tk'ing and if you can't reach an admin; you're ****ed. Also a new trend going on....Placing FOBS all over the map that have no relevant strategic purpose as for increasing chances of winning a game. I can expand this shitlist more if you like even now we are partially ttied to Infantry gameplay. Let me not start about the fuccery on mobile end, like waisting Armed vehicles or getting logi's stuck or blown up.


Then again, depending on how realistic the dev's are going to make the damage models on tanks....they won't be invinsable. Each tank has it's weakness, even inreallife.

 

I agree, all of that stuff happens, and more...but...not all the time. I've played in great pub matches and others that were disappointing at best, it's a crapshoot.  As you stated,  vehicles can potentially add even more "less than desirable" aspects of game play. 

 

Make no mistake, I'm not advocating for SQUAD to become an infantry-only game.  I'd just like to see server configuration options that would essentially allow "rolling back the clock" to a time before vehicles were implemented (like v4 or v5) and the game focused solely on infantry styled tactics.  Consider it merely an option for those that enjoyed that type of game play, or anyone who wants to take a break from the "vanilla" combined arms warfare.

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i wouldnt wory about the differnece with vehicals or infatnry as later down the track there will be more layers and randomized layers of all maps that.. most established communitys will have 3-4 options of server styles .. e.g infatnry only with respected layers, AAS only ... AAS/Insurgency and pure incurgency modes.. ii feel for those countrys that dont have that atm.. but can only say lead the way if nothing is about it wont take long to get a community runnng and its up to us as the player to help out.. unlike 95% of games we can steer this ship.

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On 12/14/2016 at 7:16 AM, KTMR29 said:

Honest to God, this game is a farcry from being "ruined" by vehicles. Actually like with everything crews are the deciding factor.

 

And even then, crews need to work out a plan to be effective AND deadly.

 

Yesterday I racked up 26-zero on Yehorivka and we won by 300+ tickets, mainly because the driver was focused on disrupting supplies and asset support (techies). We had only one commander leading the charge with most squads doing absolutely rubbish. 

 

FFW next game, very involved teams on a Fool's Road, much communication, and once again 27-1 but we lost by 26 tickets...the game is decided by how it stacks up and how the teams are made. Vehicles even with the best drivers are still too limited to really be dangerous or game changers.

 

When the game will feature heavy armour and full armament suite then some situations will be really lopsided but now, it's nothing.

 

So... the game isn't negatively impacted by vehicles despite you having a huge impact on the game by gaining a lot of kills, despite your team screwing the pooch?  When people who say the game is negatively impacted by games is because they're disproportionately impacting the game, with the concession that they're not solely what determines games?

 

I don't see how that makes any sense.  It's fine that you like vehicles, but the fact people can easily go 26-0 is part of why I dislike combat vehicles in games like these.

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On 16/12/2016 at 0:57 AM, NikolaiLev said:

 

So... the game isn't negatively impacted by vehicles despite you having a huge impact on the game by gaining a lot of kills, despite your team screwing the pooch?  When people who say the game is negatively impacted by games is because they're disproportionately impacting the game, with the concession that they're not solely what determines games?

 

I don't see how that makes any sense.  It's fine that you like vehicles, but the fact people can easily go 26-0 is part of why I dislike combat vehicles in games like these.

I've gone 50-4 with an SVD and we still lost by 60 tickets. And not further than two weeks ago. ZOMG SVD impacts the game negatively...or does it?

 

The BTR is a beast in select situations, it's a lame duck in other select situations.

 

You selectively read what you want. I'm saying that the BTR on itself doesn't change the combat basics. What it does change however is that infantry without the means to disable/destroy is dead meat. If that's what you're saying then yeah,  armored vehicles tend to need specialized assets to be defeated. Nice one captain obvious.

 

We tore it on the Fool's road with the driver and still lost. We did the same on the Yehorivka and won on a large margin. You never seem to understand this, like wtf...it's called bias. I understand that you don't like vehicles, but they are part of the game, avoid them when not able to defeat them, ambush them when you can, make sure they're corralled or limited to areas that they can't have much impact on, make sure they don't see many targets, make sure they're always on the move, a moving vehicle is less prone to sit and take potshots at exposed squads. And basically, have a good team, that one helps. 

 

On this point Romby is clearly far more accurate than you, symmetrical (although not as much) vehicular assets tend to equalize the exchanges. They also tend to force teams into specific tactics on how to deal with them. Less protected assets are victim to a bigger spectrum of threats, more protected are victims of a more narrow spectrum of threats. Yeah captain obvious...

 

It makes sense when you read and comprehend the whole post, obviously you didn't. I can't help you with that.

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Just a bit of work on adjusting the ticket loss on certain assets should help things along nicely.

Different factions, maps need to be played very differently, the public server type players just need to team up better, then the quality of command will decide the outcome more often than not.

But hey, nothings new here public matches are hit and miss - clan matches are better (simply because teamwork is better with guys and gals you play with regular).



 

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You could always just take away the vehicles for certain modes or maps.

The vehicles do not impair the infantry gameplay directly.

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I don't know what servers you blokes are playing on but 75% of the time on public servers vehicles are used great and efficiently. Of course there's nothing better than the entire team working together and cohesively as an organized platoon but regardless unless you're having a really bad day most squads usually work together well and once again I know they're not at their full potential because they aren't clan based.

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14 hours ago, Boomer-Australia said:

I don't know what servers you blokes are playing on but 75% of the time on public servers vehicles are used great and efficiently. Of course there's nothing better than the entire team working together and cohesively as an organized platoon but regardless unless you're having a really bad day most squads usually work together well and once again I know they're not at their full potential because they aren't clan based.

The typical experience on BigD is much different to the typical experience on US/EU servers :)

 

 

Edited by Cheesy_LeScrub

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4 minutes ago, Cheesy_LeScrub said:

The typical experience on BigD is much different to the typical experience on US/EU servers :)

 

 

Can attest to this, one of my fav servers. Damn shame though, used to be able to play on it @ 150 ping with no warping or bullet eating (from Canada), I switched ISP's and its just not possible anymore :(

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9 hours ago, Cheesy_LeScrub said:

The typical experience on BigD is much different to the typical experience on US/EU servers :)

 

 

Haha well I do agree that I prefer the BigD servers but I usually play on the 2FJ, Demos Playground as well as another one I'm forgetting. For the most part the teamwork element plays out well especially on 2FJ. Can't say anything about the other servers however.

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If PR taught us anything, it's that armor, CAS, etc will probably just end up costing your team tickets :) Bring them forth!

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On 12/18/2016 at 7:30 AM, Dragon7722 said:

You could always just take away the vehicles for certain modes or maps.

The vehicles do not impair the infantry gameplay directly.

 

See, that's a fine enough argument until you consider how many other people will actually be playing infantry-only servers.  Plus, I don't necessarily want only infantry; some of the current maps are horribly painful if they're infantry only due to the lack of trucks.

 

What I'd really like is for infantry-only maps to just have trucks.  Maybe technicals.  LAT needs something to do, after all.

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35 minutes ago, NikolaiLev said:

 

See, that's a fine enough argument until you consider how many other people will actually be playing infantry-only servers.  Plus, I don't necessarily want only infantry; some of the current maps are horribly painful if they're infantry only due to the lack of trucks.

 

What I'd really like is for infantry-only maps to just have trucks.  Maybe technicals.  LAT needs something to do, after all.

 

In PR the infantry layers have transport vehicles (trucks, humvees, choppers) but not heavy assets. I assume that's what it would be like in squad as well. 

 

http://www.realitymod.com/mapgallery/?map=beirut&mode=gpm_cq&size=16

Edited by Psyrus

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On 12/22/2016 at 2:52 AM, Psyrus said:

 

In PR the infantry layers have transport vehicles (trucks, humvees, choppers) but not heavy assets. I assume that's what it would be like in squad as well. 

 

http://www.realitymod.com/mapgallery/?map=beirut&mode=gpm_cq&size=16

 

As it is now, the infantry maps have no vehicles at all, even larger ones.  Hopefully this changes, but it probably only will if people make sure to tell the devs that it needs to.  There's no reason why there shouldn't be trucks in infantry maps as it is now.

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