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INYURBASE

sick of new squad leaders

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There is a huge problem that's ruining multiplayer: newbie squad leaders. Over and over again, on most servers, at the beginning of each game, squads form with SLs that don't even know how to put down FOBs. Perhaps only people with 500+ hours of experience should be able to be SLs? Or there needs to be an SL training course that unlocks the ability to be an SL. I don't even think squads should have access to fire support roles until SLs put down fobs.

 

Squad devs, PLEASE fix this, it is ruining the game!

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I'm usually not a fan of these kind of "locks", but when players are too selfish and don't know their limitations, the game may have to enforce this.

Want to be a SL? At least know the ****ing basics.

I didn't dare to pick up an SL kit before I knew how the game is being played. I observed what others did, what seemed to be "standard procedure", adopted it and moved from there. But ffs, why are some players such assholes and create squads when they can't even handle the role at all?

 

It just ruins it for everyone involved.

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Have you tried teaching them?

It's one thing if they tell you to get lost if you offer help but I sure hope you're not shitting all over them for trying something new and then immediately coming here to complain.

I like teaching someone how to do something right in the game because they'll probably teach a person or two and it keeps going.

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Their excuse is something along the lines of "how am I meant to learn how to SL if I don't start?". Well I'm not being cocky or anything but I wasn't selfish enough to think like that. I played under lots of SLs, some good, some bad, some great, and learnt from them. Then after about 120 hours I started SLing. You ruin your own experience and other people's experiences if you start SLing without any prior knowledge or experience. 

 

I don't think the devs would put such limitations on new players but I'm sure there'll be servers with mods that will put such restrictions. We've got servers that state you must have a mic to squad lead. They're probably going to implement a mod that allows you to SL if you have a mic. Not sure if a mod can check how many hours you have in the game.

 

It's not a foolproof method to find that somebody is fairly experienced with the game to check their hours as they might not have actually played the game for that amount of time but at least it increases the chances of having a SL who knows how the game works.

11 minutes ago, Rybec said:

Have you tried teaching them?

It's one thing if they tell you to get lost if you offer help but I sure hope you're not shitting all over them for trying something new and then immediately coming here to complain.

I like teaching someone how to do something right in the game because they'll probably teach a person or two and it keeps going.

They'll learn quicker being under an experienced player who's SL. 

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1 hour ago, Odd_fella said:

They'll learn quicker being under an experienced player who's SL. 

Only if the Squad leader teaches them as they go. It's like someone can be a great hockey player just by watching professionals.

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19 minutes ago, Rybec said:

Only if the Squad leader teaches them as they go. It's like someone can be a great hockey player just by watching professionals.

BS.

I didn't ask any squad leader a thing, I just observed. Worked well.

If I can do it, anyone can do it.

 

Stop finding excuses for the ignorant, lazy or impatient.

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3 hours ago, INYURBASE said:

There is a huge problem that's ruining multiplayer: newbie squad leaders. Over and over again, on most servers, at the beginning of each game, squads form with SLs that don't even know how to put down FOBs. Perhaps only people with 500+ hours of experience should be able to be SLs? Or there needs to be an SL training course that unlocks the ability to be an SL. I don't even think squads should have access to fire support roles until SLs put down fobs.

 

Squad devs, PLEASE fix this, it is ruining the game!

500 Hours is quite steep; I have 311 hours in and I'm very confident that I both know how the game works and how to SL.  Maybe bring that down to 200-250 hours...if a person doesn't know the basics by the point.....I'm nervous for them!

8 minutes ago, Lethargo said:

BS.

I didn't ask any squad leader a thing, I just observed. Worked well.

If I can do it, anyone can do it.

 

Stop finding excuses for the ignorant, lazy or impatient.

I'll have to say that observation alone was plenty for me as well; I"ll take advice but I don't think a person can only learn to SL by having a SL teach them.  Can't say that comparing this to hockey is a good analogy.

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4 hours ago, INYURBASE said:

There is a huge problem that's ruining multiplayer: newbie squad leaders. Over and over again, on most servers, at the beginning of each game, squads form with SLs that don't even know how to put down FOBs. Perhaps only people with 500+ hours of experience should be able to be SLs? Or there needs to be an SL training course that unlocks the ability to be an SL. I don't even think squads should have access to fire support roles until SLs put down fobs.

 

Squad devs, PLEASE fix this, it is ruining the game!

 

Interesting, but "fixing" that through a "500+ hours rule" or a SL training looks difficult to me...

 

3 hours ago, Lethargo said:

I'm usually not a fan of these kind of "locks", (...)

 

+1

 

If I join a squad, saying "hello everyone" and nobody answers, I leave it and join another one till I find a good one.

 

Or leave the squad, create another one with a significant name and invite players to join it. Most players who didn't like the old squad will switch to yours ; the ones who don't switch would most likely not be good squadmates anyway so don't care about them, and get back to battle with a fresh, cohesive and efficient all-new squad.

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6 minutes ago, Nightstalker21 said:

If I join a squad, saying "hello everyone" and nobody answers, I leave it and join another one till I find a good one.

 

Or leave the squad, create another one with a significant name and invite players to join it. Most players who didn't like the old squad will switch to yours ; the ones who don't switch would most likely not be good squadmates anyway so don't care about them, and get back to battle with a fresh, cohesive and efficient all-new squad.

That's pretty much what I do as well.

If no one even says hello, you immediately know what kind of squad you entered. A non-squad.

Basically just a group of lone wolves being in a squad so they can access the juicy kits.

 

I wonder why these people play this game at all.

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1 hour ago, Lethargo said:

Stop finding excuses for the ignorant, lazy or impatient.

How about the ambitious?

 

Maybe I have different ideas of the best way to learn than you guys but I find it pretty disappointing that you guys don't welcome the idea of someone wanting to be a squad leader that hasn't learned it in and out but is open for suggestions. I haven't had issues teaching someone as we go, you all make it sound like it's something you need to take a course for.

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Well, 

 

i guess you first have to determine the two types of "bad" Squadleads. 

 

The SL who dont talk at all, does his shit and is in , what was already mentioned, a lonewolf squad. 

 

If somebody leads a Squad for the first time and is little experienced in the game its quite obvious and i try to help him as i can. Mostly by trying to keep the Squad in order in firefights playing some kind of XO using the local chat.

U cant blame someone for beeing a noob. We all have been there. I try to help them if they accept help. 

 

Good Squadleading is IMO the most difficult thing to do in Squad. Requires Knowledge, Patience, Communicationsskills, Coolness, Multitasking and and and. 

 

A "Lock" makes no sense at all. If u would do aome Kind of SL Training Mission offline it would take exactly 20 minutes for the first YouTube How to Video. 

For Locking it to 500+ Hours? 

Dude, i right now have 380 Hours myself, started Squadleading with around 50 Hours and have barely played anything else. 

 

Saying somebody else ruins your experience cause he is a newb SL is not his fault. Nobody forced you to play with him. 

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Its pain and its right. People have to be in "right mood" to start do something. 

What does it mean "game mechanic restriction" 

It will do stuff without others player intervention. Players will be mechanically restricted. But it has more negative effects than positive. 

Players lost another "teambuilder" and "trust builder". they will rely on automatic mechanics. They will not give feedback. Lots of players are shy to say even hallo. Its important to have this pain and make people angry or happy. Because everything is about human relationships. 

If you want to build amazing game community you have to stay away from automatic game restrictions and let people do that. 

If people dont understand this basic psychologic well ... its important start think much deeper about it. 

Its not just "turn on Squad run and gun" but build something real like this community it need some behaviours, traditions and at least some communication. 

 

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****ing tell me about it, I don't mind newb SLs if they listen to suggestions, which I have had some that have really good potential. 

Edited by fantomactual

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It comes down to community. Either Teach them, Shame Them, or do it yourself. I hate it and definitely ruins the game for me when we have to teach our SL how to do anything. The people with 700+ hours, SL'ing should be second nature but we're all pretty much burned out. In my 800 hours of the game i've got maybe 20 behind fire support roles and the rest either rifleman or medic/SL. 

 

If you are new take medic kit, its the best "toss you in the water" role. Its got just enough responsibility, you are required to stick to teammates and forces interaction with the players. The problem is nobody is crash coursing these new guys. They all want the SAW or marksmen rifle and go play sniper elite or insurgency by themselves.

 

Force more newbies to be medics or take over SL and appoint them to be medic to follow you and learn. We've got a lot of new players, like A LOT A LOT, more than i thought we would get. Take the plunge and teach or at least explain importances of roles. 

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They should just open a squad because no one else does. U can't blame them for doing it but u can ask the newbie to give the SL to you if you're frustrated about.

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Let's categorize squad leaders:

  1. Newcomers who doesn't know anything
  2. SL who know everything, except how to win the round
  3. SL who do the right things at the right time <3
  4. Sniper/Recon/Vehicle/Tacticool whore squad
  5. No mic (not always bad)

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So a Squad Leader doesn't know what he is doing Do you: 

  1. Help him to learn by sticking with him and making observations throughout the game, helping with keys and obstacles which all new SLs have? 
  2. Suggest that you take over the squad but promise that you will explain during the game?
  3. Create another squad and say "Hey John, I noticed you were new to this. Let me know if you need help." or "Squad 1 don't forget your rally."
  4. Create another squad and suggest people join yours instead?
  5. Say in SL channel, "Hey John I noticed you didn't have SL kit. Did you know you need it, do you want me to put down an ammo crate for you?"
  6. Harass him to the point where he ignores you?
  7. Come on the forums and sulk?

Everyone was new once. Take some responsibility and make the game better through positive action. We already have enough whiners, :) the position may undergo a round of redundancies.

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I always try to help out anybody that needs it, I never contest their decisions but always offers better options, but unfortunately more often than not I have seen this toxic, toxic behavior in people that's really putting people off of SLing... And it's horrible, too many toxic people play the game. 

Edited by fantomactual

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Well everyone in squad should have a mic but still you get people who don't!!

 

to SL you must have a mic and a basic understanding of the game!! 

 

On the ZXD server we've kick people for not having a mic and when we're on we usually try to have at least 2 squad's up with 3 or 4 ZXD's in each to combat the retard SL's 

 

also guys if your not in a clan join one it makes playing squad soooooooo much better 

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Yeah it does, I had to leave my previous one due to the fact that, they preach a lot of shit and don't practice what they preach, went from working as a team, to this "I bought this game, I play it how I want to" type behavior, exchanging quality over quantity, what value does that quantity have when about 80% of the recruits don't follow what you train them? It's absurd really... good riddance thank god I ****ing left them, I care way too much about new players coming into the game and teaching them proper way to play as a team. 

Edited by fantomactual

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10 hours ago, Rybec said:

Only if the Squad leader teaches them as they go. It's like someone can be a great hockey player just by watching professionals.

Well you can become a professional hockey player by watching the professionals. It appears you don't agree with that. You can watch some of the best players in squad and see how they move, what decisions they make etc. 

 

If if you want to help new people SL, that's cool. Just gotta be considerate for the 7 other guys who want to play the game. If they're all happy to teach SL then that's cool. Not sure if other SLs would be cool with it. 

 

8 hours ago, Rybec said:

How about the ambitious?

 

Maybe I have different ideas of the best way to learn than you guys but I find it pretty disappointing that you guys don't welcome the idea of someone wanting to be a squad leader that hasn't learned it in and out but is open for suggestions. I haven't had issues teaching someone as we go, you all make it sound like it's something you need to take a course for.

 

No one said anything about a course, we just said watch and learn like the rest of us did. It's a nice idea to welcome new players as squad leaders and morally it's the right thing to do but pub games will become even more disorganised and not very fun to play if we welcome that. It'll be much more efficient to have them learn under somebody so that everybody enjoys the game a lot more.

 

They'll still have questions to ask and will want people's input on making a difficult decision but at least they know the basics. It's the ones who don't even know the basics that are trouble. 

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Might be a bit out of whack but have new players who purchased the game go through a mandatory tutorial explaining the basic mechanics of the game before letting them go on the public servers.

And maybe emphasize a bit more on what it means to be a Squadleader (And other roles as well; medic ect)

Some games apply this and it could possible give some more insight to the new players of what they can expect.

 

Thoughts?

 

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3 hours ago, T-7 said:

Might be a bit out of whack but have new players who purchased the game go through a mandatory tutorial explaining the basic mechanics of the game before letting them go on the public servers.

And maybe emphasize a bit more on what it means to be a Squadleader (And other roles as well; medic ect)

Some games apply this and it could possible give some more insight to the new players of what they can expect.

 

Thoughts?

 

I like it, get the basic rundown of the RP, FOB, Vehicles and how it's not like Battlefield as they cost tickets if lost and the logis supply FOBs, SL role.  Something quick like that shouldn't be too bad for a brand new player.

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