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Systemantix

Prevent Camping of FOBs/RPs?

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I'd like to see some kind of mechanic that will disable spawning if someone was killed within X number of seconds and/or Y number of feet from the spawn. Obviously it's not a viable location if someone is able to camp it, so why not disable it instead of allowing summer kiddies to rack up as many kills as they can, completely ignoring the tactical aspects of the game?

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I'd like to see some kind of mechanic that will disable spawning if someone was killed within X number of seconds and/or Y number of feet from the spawn. Obviously it's not a viable location if someone is able to camp it, so why not disable it instead of allowing summer kiddies to rack up as many kills as they can, completely ignoring the tactical aspects of the game?

Who is ignoring the tactical aspects? The one, who is killing spawning guys? Or the one, who won't warn his teammates via VOIP (a tactical instrument in this game, given by the holy devs), and let 'em, still unwarned, spawn in to get killed?

Those mechanics are all in the game. Just use them

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PR's way of handling this is that if there is an enemy withing X meters of the FOB, spawning is disabled. I'd like something like that at some point, maybe also mixed with something like you described. Not a permanent disable but until the enemy clears out.

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2 minutes ago, Ratface said:

PR's way of handling this is that if there is an enemy withing X meters of the FOB, spawning is disabled. I'd like something like that at some point, maybe also mixed with something like you described. Not a permanent disable but until the enemy clears out.

 

This is already present in Squad to some degree, however.. most players place FOBs in areas that are visible from a distance so sitting a little further outside the detection radius does the trick to avoid it.

 

Honestly, everyone should be wise enough not to spawn on a hot FOB. Once, sure.. if you're the first one simply let everyone else know and tell your SL to let other squads know as well, simple enough. Constantly spawning on a hot FOB and dying and then complaining about it in chat just shows that you're at fault.

 

One "tactical" aspect of Squad is knowing when to hold your spawns.

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2 hours ago, Systemantix said:

I'd like to see some kind of mechanic

 

isn't "using your brain, and don't act like the longterm memory of a goldfish" a veritable and proofed mechanism?

Edited by Metapher

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9 hours ago, Ratface said:

PR's way of handling this is that if there is an enemy withing X meters of the FOB, spawning is disabled. I'd like something like that at some point, maybe also mixed with something like you described. Not a permanent disable but until the enemy clears out.

It took several players to disable a FOB if I remember correctly. So even in PR someone could camp an FOB. But the much larger size of the map lowered the FOB density by a lot. Instead of an FOB every 400 meters in Squad currently you might find one a kilometer from the next.

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perfect as it is, spawn and die. if you want safety stick to pokemon (until the muggers get you)

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I'll put this here

On 3/1/2016 at 5:19 AM, SgtRoss said:

Players have several options to combat this and it is up to each team to decide what they want to do.

 

If you are leaving your radio in a concealed location, abandoning it, only to use it to spawn on in the hopes that the enemy won't find it. That was a decision an SL made and it comes with pros and cons, obviously. People need to take responsibility for their own actions and accept the consequences for their actions.

 

You have the ability to build and protect the FOB yourself.

 

You have the ability to try and hide it and not build anything.

 

You have the ability to use chat to tell your team someone is spawn camping.

 

You have VOIP to tell your Squad or SLs to tell other SLs about spawn camping.

 

You have the ability to organize a small team to kill the campers.

 

These are several options we provide you in order to make whatever decision you feel is the right one. 

 

Even then, we are still going to be adding assets to help you combat the enemy, but even then, there will still be ways for the enemy to get at you and there should be.

 

Some things in our game just won't be handed to you and will very simply be a choice players will have to make for themselves.

 

If you are an individual getting spawn camped, you have the power to change that. If your team is unwilling to help, that is a decision your teammates made, be frustrated at them. Adapt and overcome as Wookie404 stated.

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In Project Reality the FOB has a structure with a tent and some sandbags around it, and players spawn around this structure a bit more spaced, that gives them some cover depending on where the camper is and thus making it a bit harder for the camper to just shoot everyone who spawns, giving them a chance to return fire. In Squad you spawn closely beside a small radio structure which leaves you totally uncovered. Good thing is that you can hide FOBs inside small rooms, which is something you can't do in Project Reality.

 

So one option in Squad is to emulate PR FOBs by surrounding the radio with some sandbags or hescos so spawners can have some protection in case there is a camper at a distance. No need to make a super FOB, just put a few sanbags around it and its done.

 

Another difference from PR is the FOB capture bar. Right now it is a double edged sword: they are there to give FOBs the secondary objective meaning the devs have already mentioned, but they also give away FOB positions too easily. Not sure if there is another way to have it so we know we are capping a FOB without giving away its position, though.

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3 hours ago, Dubs said:

I'll put this here
 

 

Granted, how many times have you joined mid-game, saw a bunch of player markers on the map around a FOB, no one feels like constantly broadcasting that it's being camped, and you spawn in for the first time only to immediately die? I think it takes away from the whole experience and makes it feel cheap.

 

At the very least, something along the lines of highlighting it red/orange/yellow even if they aren't actively digging it up, just for the sake of preventing cheap shots. 

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I see otherwise that matter.

What really uncomfortable ; You know that when players enter the game is the X or Y team, you can see the location of the FOB in spectator mode and often changes team, and reports the position of the FOB.

It would be fair does not have access to the map and the information until it was definitely chosen the team.

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The tactical aspect of Squad that you seem to be forgetting, which is pretty much the core aspect of Squad, is communication.

 

If you are unable to communicate to your squad - and your squad leader to the rest of the squads - that a FOB is compromised, that's a problem with your team's communication, first and foremost. You can choose to keep spawning there, but that's all at your own risk - you know the FOB is compromised.

 

Blocking the spawn would be a nice little option for the teams that lack communication, or the players that are just braindead and/or ignoring the situation (or otherwise not aware of it); but that could be interpreted as catering to the wrong type of players. If you want to encourage good communication, it might not be the best choice to reduce the need for it.

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44 minutes ago, Karm said:

The tactical aspect of Squad that you seem to be forgetting, which is pretty much the core aspect of Squad, is communication.

 

If you are unable to communicate to your squad - and your squad leader to the rest of the squads - that a FOB is compromised, that's a problem with your team's communication, first and foremost. You can choose to keep spawning there, but that's all at your own risk - you know the FOB is compromised.

 

Blocking the spawn would be a nice little option for the teams that lack communication, or the players that are just braindead and/or ignoring the situation (or otherwise not aware of it); but that could be interpreted as catering to the wrong type of players. If you want to encourage good communication, it might not be the best choice to reduce the need for it.

 

 

Every time a FOB gets camped by somebody the other team is already fucked, no need to shit on them further by spawn killing. I can tell you this from many situations in PR - it has never and never will magically improve the situation or comms for that team.

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47 minutes ago, banOkay said:

 

 

Every time a FOB gets camped by somebody the other team is already fucked, no need to shit on them further by spawn killing. I can tell you this from many situations in PR - it has never and never will magically improve the situation or comms for that team.


SgtRoss quotes are awesome for future references.

On 3/2/2016 at 5:42 AM, SgtRoss said:

 

Nice, sucks no one spoke up on their side, eh?

 

Isn't "Communicate" even in our slogan for the game? Screw it, right?

On 3/2/2016 at 6:13 AM, SgtRoss said:

 

Yes, you could ask, or just spawn in at your own risk. If you die once, you'll know.

 

We are trying to avoid adding too many indicators to prevent it from turning into radar. We will see how we feel when we add in a more robust logistics system. We have discussed doing a color gradient that displays potential enemy influence on your bases resources, for example.

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53 minutes ago, Karm said:

The tactical aspect of Squad that you seem to be forgetting, which is pretty much the core aspect of Squad, is communication.

 

If you are unable to communicate to your squad - and your squad leader to the rest of the squads - that a FOB is compromised, that's a problem with your team's communication, first and foremost. You can choose to keep spawning there, but that's all at your own risk - you know the FOB is compromised.

 

The problem is not that the FOB is being camped. The problem is that the game allows you to spawn on it while it's camped. There is no way for the first one spawning there to know that it's going to be a hotzone, and it's almost certain others will follow in his wake, regardless of how quick you can let others know about the camper. This makes spawncamping a cheap and easy method to get kills and ruin the game for others, and I think the fun of others should be regarded higher than the camper's "fun".

 

You know, whenever I see an FOB in PR and I happen to be alone without the means to take it down, I'll start looking for a place in the vicinity to hide in until I have someone with me who is capable of taking it down. Sometimes I may have to kill a player who notices me in my hiding spot(since I'd still like to win), but for the most part, players who walk away from the FOB I am near can do so without any trouble. This is me being fair: I want the FOB down and I don't want to abuse the fact that I could pick them off cheaply. However, you cannot rely on everybody being as fair as I am, and since that's the case the game mechanics should prevent FOB camping just as much as lone wolfing. The latter has been given a satisfying solution in the form of the Recruit kit, now only the former needs one.

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When i decide to build a FOB, there is basically three options. 

 

1. My whole Squad stays there and defends it. A FOB - in my opinion - can be a tactical Position to provide Overwatch and security to a whole Area. Only though if u defend it. Further loosing the FOB is loosing 10 Tickets which equals 10 Deaths. 

 

2. The FOB is near a defensive Capzone. While the majority of my Squad 7-8 people stay in the capzone and defend it, there is at least one person to cover the FOB. Which means not standing directly next to it. But do the "Countercamping". Hide in a bush, look out for those scouts who are coming to camp the FOB and take them out. 

 

3. The FOB works as a Forward Hidden Spawnpoint on the flank we are just doing. I only do this kind of FOB when other Squadleads ask me to do this. Otherwise a RP is just fine. Honestly i am trying to prevent those kinda FOBs. It happens to often that the hidden aggressive FOB becomes the source of a neverending stream of people running to the Capzone, just to get shot and respawn on the FOB again. Like fresh meat for the grinder. 

 

Usually, as some posters before me mentioned, holding ur spawn is a viable tactic to do. If there is one man down in my squad, he waits for a medic. If there is 2-4 men down, and the revive is not possible, then they shall spawn as a group. If they get camped, the Squad falls back and secures the FOB. 

 

Either that or the whole Squad spawns if it gets wiped. If the FOB Camper not randomly has a grenade launcher equipped, its kinda tough to get 9 confirmed kills without getting taken out. Plus the fact, that a revived person doesnt count as a kill. 

 

There is no people in my Squad giving up and spawning randomly on a FOB 5 times in a row. 

 

I am sorry to say this, but there is ways to keep ur Spawn protected. If u are getting FOB camped all the time, it might maybe the time to overthink ur approach of playing this game. 

Edited by runningDuck

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If the FOB is being camped do the following things as SL.

 

1. Inform your squad and your team.

2. Don't spawn on it, use the rally or another FOB.

3. Retake the FOB.

4. Remove the FOB

5. Place a new FOB in a new location.

 

Problem solved.

 

What I don't understand is why other SLs wont retake the ground and remove the FOB and place a new one.

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sometimes a FOB is known to the enemy and still worth keeping, we have successfully used teh following tactic to rescue a camped fob:

 

Communicate, 

Coordinate,

Conquer.

 

We talked about the fob camper, we held our spawns so we could all spawn together and then on 3 we LAID THE SMACK DOWN. Some people died and were revived. We kept the fob and protected it as it was in a close quarters defence of a flag radius and was costing the enemy way more tickets than us.

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Don't worry man, wait for some BMP to deal with that shit. I completely disagree with you btw. It's up to your team to deal with these situations and not change the game mechanics.

 

Remember, you can do it to the enemy too

 

 

 

 

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I lol everytime. It would kind of defeat the purpose of the game play style to not allow people to camp reinforcements. just wait till 10 - 15 of you are in a vehicle my squad blows up :). No more FOB problems

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On 7/20/2016 at 11:41 AM, Systemantix said:

Granted, how many times have you joined mid-game, saw a bunch of player markers on the map around a FOB, no one feels like constantly broadcasting that it's being camped, and you spawn in for the first time only to immediately die? I think it takes away from the whole experience and makes it feel cheap.

 

At the very least, something along the lines of highlighting it red/orange/yellow even if they aren't actively digging it up, just for the sake of preventing cheap shots. 

So you join a server mid round. First you join a squad, then ask the sl where you should spawn. He will tell you if a spot is being camped. Or you start your own squad in which case you are now on the command net and you can ask the other leaders where they need the help and they will tell you if a fob is being camped. In either scenario the decision to not be lazy can save your life. 

 

Or you can bitch and moan and beg the devs for a terrible mechanic so you don't have to think.

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7 hours ago, MultiSquid said:

Why are we still talking about this?

 

Yeah I know, but we should. 

I've tried before to provide good reason to change it, but many people seem to be very narrow-minded. 

 

The game is in Alpha, it won't hurt to at least try some different ideas before release.

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5 hours ago, JarryHead said:

 

Yeah I know, but we should. 

I've tried before to provide good reason to change it, but many people seem to be very narrow-minded. 

 

The game is in Alpha, it won't hurt to at least try some different ideas before release.

 

You're right. That's why the way FOB's work will keep changing over time, especially when logistics comes in its first iteration. 

 

There's no need to change core mechanics of the game because of player error. Plenty of iteration is yet to come. :)

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