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S0NNy

Switching to Pistol

decrease switching to pistol time  

28 members have voted

  1. 1. should they make the switch to the side arm a little bit quicker than it is atm?

    • no, it is good as it is now
      8
    • yes, it has to be a little bit quicker (not just for gameplay, but for realismn)
      20
    • i have no idea
      0


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Hi guys,

 

i thought i make this topic and tell you guys my opinion about switching to the secondary weapon, the pistol.

 

i think it has to be a little bit quicker, not only for gameplay reason but for realismn. i never saw a trained soldier who needs 3-4 seconds (or more) to switch to his side arms.

 

i know many players think the same so what do u guys think

 

greetz

Edited by S0NNy

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Agree @S0NNy I'm hoping for a better switch of weapons when the new animation system is implemented,of course this decision be down to our DEV's preference.

Don't want to be as quick like the bollox we see in BF & others noobs shooters.

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I can't pretend to know anything about the reality of switching to side arms, or indeed any other item in Squad.

 

But, I actually think the current speeds are good - or maybe make them a little slower.

 

This action would help promote team tactical play.

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The Devs have a military advisor and many people with military experience suggesting these sorts of tweaks. Don't worry, they're aware of most of the inconsistencies with reality, but they're also making an effort to keep gameplay and realism balanced in order to provide the experience they're aiming for.

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The problem is current speed fits neither balance nor gameplay. It is possible to switch to the pistol much faster in reality. Although infantrymen usually don't study special fast switching techniques, player is not a soldier. Player is trained to play and use all assets he has. What if some players shoot in game better, than average rifleman in reality?

 

Gameplay aspect is ruined as well. There are no niche for sidearms. They are supposed to be a last chance weapon, but average amount of ammo per kit and ammo crates allows to ignore sidearms. Sidearms don't have any advantages compared to assault rifles. Deploying time is too long to use them when player doesn't have time to reload primary weapon. Thus, from gameplay point of view, they are worthless.

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currently no benefit from having a pistol, may as well reload. 

 

perhaps the medic could have a kickass pistol to help encourage medic players

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7 minutes ago, suds said:

currently no benefit from having a pistol, may as well reload. 

 

perhaps the medic could have a kickass pistol to help encourage medic players

 

As medic, I'd like pistol to be removed from kit. Everybody stays for non-combat non-optics medic, but Medics carrying 2 firearms (more than fire support kits are carrying) look weird for me.

 

P.S. And I don't want to play with medics who are attracted to this kit by guns, I'd like to play with medics who are attracted by ability to revive and heal.

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I think a lot of people are watching too many tactical drills (which are literally about mastering a technique and ultimately becoming faster and faster at it) and not enough actual combat footage when it comes to things like this. You are not in a hurry EVERY time.

 

The first issue is the animation system and the way weapons are handled by the game itself. Take switching to the M203 / GP25 as an example - they're considered two different weapons and as a result of this, the animation that plays looks like you put your weapon away and then bring it back out on screen again. With an incoming weapon system rework and animation rework already on going, I think we'll see different methods in place. Just have to wait and see.

 

The second issue is the fact that we don't have weapons on slings or attached to us in anyway, something that's quite common in real life combat for more modern / conventional forces, is it not? So, how would you make that translate into the game then? If you're in an oh shit situation, you can easy "drop" your weapon and reach for the sidearm quickly instead of being methodical or careful about it.. but in Squad (because it's a game) you literally put your weapon away because there's no animation alternative at the moment. You would only do this kind of quick transition when your weapon runs dry or it has a malfunction, so you're FORCED to swap to it. However, I'm pretty sure you still want to at least ATTEMPT to flick the weapon into safe. It really isn't a joke and it's not as lightning fast as it is in fast paced shooters.

 

Third issue. I can edit and render out tens of videos where sidearms have saved my life in Squad, especially when I get that dreaded dead man's click. They are useful and they really are a last ditch effort, you just have to be smart about it. Go prone really quickly, jump into cover, do anything to gain those extra few seconds so you don't get shot because I can guarantee Squad is not going to become one of those games where switching to the sidearm still pits you on a level field with someone coming at you with a rifle. It's one of the many punishing elements of the game which make it what it is.

 

That's also the fault of the player. I'm not going to sit here and tell you to do something difficult like count your shots, but it's your responsibility to at least have an idea of how many rounds you have left. If your primary weapon system goes dry then you're fucked, and yeah, you would transition to your sidearm / pistol as fast as you can especially when you're engaged with a direct target. That type of transition legitimately requires a sling or for you to flat out drop the weapon, so unless we get slings in Squad it's going to look weird (like it does in most games) when you die as soon as a primary weapon disappears. Honestly, I would love for this to be a feature and to see it in Squad. A normal weapon transition animation for when you don't need to be all "oh shit" and quick and a quick transition where you need it.. along with your primary just hanging... but from a game perspective, there's no real difference and it's just eye candy.

 

Transitions and having your weapon on safe IS A THING THOUGH. Don't pretend like it's not. That and in Squad you are not constantly engaged or in contact, so there definitely is a need to not have your generic drill type "do it as fast as you can you're about to die" transition. The animations and transitions are most likely going to be / already are being worked on and adjusted though. OWI is seriously great at stepping back and reworking systems to create a better game instead of riding out on broken or unfinished ones for the sake of pushing it out to the public.

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The pistol should only be used by the squadleader as an educational instrument (like it was in PR) or in skirmish battles where everyone went crazy anyway.

I never got shot by a pistol in PR in a game other than from my own squadleader or in skirmish. I hope it stays that way.

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19 hours ago, Assifuah said:

I think a lot of people are watching too many tactical drills (which are literally about mastering a technique and ultimately becoming faster and faster at it) and not enough actual combat footage when it comes to things like this. You are not in a hurry EVERY time.

 

The first issue is the animation system and the way weapons are handled by the game itself. Take switching to the M203 / GP25 as an example - they're considered two different weapons and as a result of this, the animation that plays looks like you put your weapon away and then bring it back out on screen again. With an incoming weapon system rework and animation rework already on going, I think we'll see different methods in place. Just have to wait and see.

 

The second issue is the fact that we don't have weapons on slings or attached to us in anyway, something that's quite common in real life combat for more modern / conventional forces, is it not? So, how would you make that translate into the game then? If you're in an oh shit situation, you can easy "drop" your weapon and reach for the sidearm quickly instead of being methodical or careful about it.. but in Squad (because it's a game) you literally put your weapon away because there's no animation alternative at the moment. You would only do this kind of quick transition when your weapon runs dry or it has a malfunction, so you're FORCED to swap to it. However, I'm pretty sure you still want to at least ATTEMPT to flick the weapon into safe. It really isn't a joke and it's not as lightning fast as it is in fast paced shooters.

 

Third issue. I can edit and render out tens of videos where sidearms have saved my life in Squad, especially when I get that dreaded dead man's click. They are useful and they really are a last ditch effort, you just have to be smart about it. Go prone really quickly, jump into cover, do anything to gain those extra few seconds so you don't get shot because I can guarantee Squad is not going to become one of those games where switching to the sidearm still pits you on a level field with someone coming at you with a rifle. It's one of the many punishing elements of the game which make it what it is.

 

That's also the fault of the player. I'm not going to sit here and tell you to do something difficult like count your shots, but it's your responsibility to at least have an idea of how many rounds you have left. If your primary weapon system goes dry then you're fucked, and yeah, you would transition to your sidearm / pistol as fast as you can especially when you're engaged with a direct target. That type of transition legitimately requires a sling or for you to flat out drop the weapon, so unless we get slings in Squad it's going to look weird (like it does in most games) when you die as soon as a primary weapon disappears. Honestly, I would love for this to be a feature and to see it in Squad. A normal weapon transition animation for when you don't need to be all "oh shit" and quick and a quick transition where you need it.. along with your primary just hanging... but from a game perspective, there's no real difference and it's just eye candy.

 

Transitions and having your weapon on safe IS A THING THOUGH. Don't pretend like it's not. That and in Squad you are not constantly engaged or in contact, so there definitely is a need to not have your generic drill type "do it as fast as you can you're about to die" transition. The animations and transitions are most likely going to be / already are being worked on and adjusted though. OWI is seriously great at stepping back and reworking systems to create a better game instead of riding out on broken or unfinished ones for the sake of pushing it out to the public.

 

I though about "sling" mechanics, what if this kind of switching could be interruptable by any movement or other action? For example, if you need to quickly switch to the sidearm or launcher, your primary weapon just hang on the sling and your character starts the standard animation of pistol/grenade launcher deploying. When you switch back to the primary weapon, standard pistol/RPG animation is playing, but primary weapon deploying is much faster ONLY if you were standing/walking during using of pistol/RPG. I.e., any active movement will require you to move your primary weapon from chest to the back.

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Why can't I dual wield both my rifle and pistol at once!? I could totally hold my M4 in my right hand and my Beretta in my left in real life. This game is arcade COD trash /s

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I think it should be a little bit quicker, but I don't think it should be blisteringly fast. Most people are taught to draw the pistol out of the holster, center it in front of them, bring it to eye level, then to point the pistol. This is the most natural way to align the sights and while it takes a bit of time, it doesn't take nearly as long as the current animation in game where your character ogles the pistol with his eyes and molests every bit of it with his hands before he's ready to fire.

 

I think the pistols could benefit from a change to a more realistic, shorter animation so that they can be used when necessary rather than just something that you pull out to say "hey, that's a nice model and sound!" on the range and then put it back away when it comes to actual gameplay. As it as now, making any more pistols is a waste because nobody uses them. 

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