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KilrPayne

Players getting 40 - 50 kills per game?

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What will it take to prove to you guys naysaying that high k/d like that are possible, even regular, and include the teamwork and communication that you all believe in? Killing is part of the game and the more you do with less deaths means a net positive of tickets. Combine that with locating enemy spawn points and clearing points and you literally have achieved what is intended here. Isn't taking the enemies land important? Well they won't leave nicely, you have to kill them. Communicating this all to your team and that's the cherry on top. Honestly, pub matches right now can become a clean sweep for people who have more hours and know what they are doing and where the enemies will hit and when(from the start of the game) even when you are on your own. If you play in squads with these people you can achieve even higher effective playing. Many players who also play in Squad League can achieve these things, suspicious accusations are vetted thoroughly. Honestly, if you've ever come across a hacker in a pub game it is pretty damn apparent, they move too quickly to aim and shoot at hills and rocks while locked on to their targets. Follow them if you are that suspicious or talk to an admin. Better yet I'm sure there is somewhere on this forum you can express your concerns and devs will hear if you have proof(videos). K/D is not proof enough.

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16 hours ago, TrEuDaT said:

To help educate the folks on this thread, hacks and exploits do in fact exist.  DaveBlueDevil, it was me that was saying it was complete BS for a person to go 70-2, where you argued that it was completely possible.  I would say 70-2 is not possible and is certainly an outlier in the normal distribution of KDRs.  I don't care if you say you spectated someone with a KDR that high and you say that it was legit.  You don't get to see what the player sees....ESP, aimbot...etc....all stuff that is client side.

 

When you see unusually high KDRs, I would definitely suspect this....

Edit: Please refrain from posting videos containing hacks in SQUAD. - FG

 

 

With that said, something like 30-5 is possible with teamwork.  But if you have someone on your team or squad that is scoring ridiculous KDR WITHOUT communicating where he or she is stating they are just good or have high twitch reflexes or awesome network or whatever.....suspect hacker and change servers.

that would definatly explain some "Im deep in the trees and get one shooted throught the trees" moments i had.

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There's tons of interesting replies here. Let me pick up on few points to continue a productive discussion. 

 

  1. Some are arguing that there is such a thing as "too high" of a KDR for a single player regardless of what else the player's team does.
  2. Others argue that high KDR amid a squad of otherwise low KDR suggest poor teamwork.
  3. Some argue that lone wolfs are not capable of getting KDR. 
  4. Consistently high KDR isn't possible

Here are some things to consider from the admin & clan side of things: 

 

  • Some players are exceptional (and fairly consistently so). Members of clans (FUBAR, SWF, CML, GHOST, HkD and more than a dozen others) practice together a lot. Clans work to cultivate those players and learn to work with their skills to make everyone better. Since clans recruit exceptional players when they can find them and then further cultivate all their players, clans (especially in pub matches) are pushing the KDR for their rounds higher and higher. Their call-outs are great and some of their members are just lethal *all the time*. 
  • As an admin spotting the exceptional players is fairly easy (you see the kills roll across in console while you're online) but a quick score check in spectate mode will show an early outlier. Trouble is always that in the first round you're waiting for that outlier and then having to watch them if they stay for a second round. With the way Steam IDs can be changed, if a player swaps their name in between rounds it can be hard to follow them. You have to "listplayers" grab their ID, look it up in SteamRep, and then check out their hours of Squad played/vac bans/name changes, before you really have a sense of what's going on. This process doesn't happen instantly and if the player leaves before the round ends, the players (and admins) may never be the wiser. It's a tough situation for admins right now since we're trusting EAC (working pretty well as far as we can tell) and the console isn't super efficient for what admins need it for. 

Here's how I feel about the points above on gameplay:

  1. Before the ticket bleed was increased, higher scores were more common. This was also before the optics changed and more sway was added. Since those changes (before v4) I saw several players get 70-90 kills and observed them personally and couldn't see anything overly suspicious at that time from the admin perspective. Lately the highest scores I've been seeing are 40-60. They are rare but frequent enough that I have no doubt that there are legitimate players getting these scores. The new, faster play with the increased bleed gives teams less time to kill/die--all scores are a bit lower now. I don't blink seeing scores of 30-40. Our FUBAR players who use grenade launchers routinely get 15-30 kills and when things go horribly for the OP (say putting a FOB on a point or losing all your flags) 30+ is pretty damned easy. 
  2. Low scores in a Squad where a single player is 2-3x more than everyone else isn't necessarily indicative of poor teamwork. It may indicate uneven skill but it could also indicate effective role player--medics needn't have many kills, some SLs lead from the back and direct others rather than lead the charge, snipers can be used for suppression/call-outs rather than kills, and defensive forces may lend their top player to other squads for flanks. Lots of factors here and, at least on a team with fellow clan mates, it's not a big deal. In pub matches it definitely suggest uneven skills and could indicate a hacker if they are the *only* one on their team who has such a score. 
  3. Lone wolfs (unassigned players) lack kits. This is a big deal and makes lone wolfing basically impossible unless there are numerous fobs for them to use. Recent changes to kit assignments made this even harder. Lone wolfs within a squad may have permission to flank (we sometimes give our top fraggers that latitude), but a player that isn't communicating with their SL *should be kicked from their squad*. SLers need to manage their forces and having one guy--even a lethal one--doing his own thing far from everyone else isn't what this game is about. 
  4. Consistency IS possible. Our top players are our top players *because* they're consistent. They don't always have a great round, but even their lows are probably much higher than the typical player's.

In the spirit of openness, here's a link to my IMGUR albums that includes dozens of round scores. They all feature me ([FUBAR] bluedevil) and you can see I'm not very lethal. I run SL (and try to manage my forces rather than lead their charge) but I more often run medic, so I'm not trying to kill folks unless I need to to pick my buddies up. I'm sure you'll find evidence of lots of things in these caps, but at least it is hard-evidence and consistent (since it's always me and my clan buddies playing together).   

 

As of 11:30 4/2/2016 album is still uploading another 20+ images. 

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11 hours ago, KilrPayne said:

Wow, lots of response on here!  lol

 

Glad to see the discussion though. But anyway, as far as the game I'm talking about. First Light does not lend itself well to sniping. To many valleys and trees. And to many places for enemy to flank you or your team. I don't know what this guy was doing, but I firmly hold that he wasn't playing fairly. If I remember correctly we weren't FOB camped, pretty well spread out and we lost the game by less than 20 I think.

 

This brings to mind another game, where my team was complaining about the accuracy of an enemy RPK. I became a victim of the said RPK later in that game. I saw his full auto bullets and tracers hitting the same spot on the rock i was prone behind for a couple seconds. Mind you he was approx 200 yards away. He went 40 something and like 3. Next game again 38 and something low. Finally i switched to his team and told him I was gonna follow his ass around.... lol guess what, he decided that game that he would only single shot fire. He went 17-2 that game. Guess you don't get quite as many kills with a no recoil gun if you're not running full auto. Of course his teammates insisted he wasn't hacking. Whatever, I know a clue when I see it.

 

It's one thing to get 40 something kills on occasion with the right conditions. Consistently though, I call BS. I'm leery of those who vehemently defend those players too. As if they know the moral values of the online player they've never met. They're either naive or using the same hack.

 

Dude I applaud you! If more people took their heads out of their A#$ there wouldnt be so many cheats.

 

Spoiler

CHEATERS ARE ALL THE SAME!

 

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Can't deny there are't many legit players out there but the water get's muddied with the sophistication of cheats these days i mean most people think of a cheat using a hack as full on frenzy switching aim this way and that and getting 1 hit kills at all ranges but that is only the most obvious tip of the ice berg. Serial cheats don't persist just to get caught they shell out for the best hacks and alter their behaviour to fool even the most scrupulous of eyes on them. It's even more harder now days than it's ever been  to tell who is good and who has artificial help.

 

I remember when i used to Admin a BF3 server and i kept getting accusations towards a certain player i checked his K/D 10/20 nothing suspicious there so i ignored the reports til later when another person brought the guy up so i switched teams and when i found the guy he was behind a shipping container committing suicide. I shadowed him for a while and found that although his ingame stats seemed legit the sneaky bugger was sliding off to suicide after every few kills he got in order to keep his K/D down.

 

Iv also heard that many of these big hack sites have large communities with guides to keeping a low profile, some of the premium hacks even include early warning and counter measures towards spectators. In BF4 i know there was such a feature with some hacks if they got followed in spectator mode a warning would pop up this was confirmed when in one instance a suspect player blatantly said in global chat  Hello now f*** off and stop watching me!. The real hard ones are the players that don't use aimbots to snap to targets and 1 shot kill ( and man some of those are getting better at smoothing out movement like avoiding snapping to targets outside of your soldiers field of view) and just use the ESP feature to augment their own natural, input knowing where enemies are on the map and in which way they are facing these people if they are smart can pick and choose engagements and stage them so as a victim your often none the wiser. 

 

Sometimes it's better to be ignorant and i wish i had not have looked too far into it myself  how successful some of these feckers are at staying under the radar  because as a gamer it's soul destroying to think every time i play there potentially is one wolf hiding among the sheep. It's a full blown war on it's own between the hack developers and gaming industry the playing field is constantly shifting Anti cheats and hack devs constantly secretly evolving and trying to stay one step ahead of the other. The unfortunate side effect is everyone above average even the legitimately good players will get treated with suspicion but if you have done nothing wrong then just accept it comes with the territory and see it as a compliment.

 

 

Edited by Axle84

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I once got an infinitely high k/d ratio. I had 3 kills, 0 deaths.

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10 minutes ago, Karm said:

I once got an infinitely high k/d ratio. I had 3 kills, 0 deaths.

I genuinely giggled

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5 hours ago, davebluedevil said:

There's tons of interesting replies here. Let me pick up on few points to continue a productive discussion. 

 

  1. Some are arguing that there is such a thing as "too high" of a KDR for a single player regardless of what else the player's team does.
  2. Others argue that high KDR amid a squad of otherwise low KDR suggest poor teamwork.
  3. Some argue that lone wolfs are not capable of getting KDR. 
  4. Consistently high KDR isn't possible

Here are some things to consider from the admin & clan side of things: 

 

  • Some players are exceptional (and fairly consistently so). Members of clans (FUBAR, SWF, CML, GHOST, HkD and more than a dozen others) practice together a lot. Clans work to cultivate those players and learn to work with their skills to make everyone better. Since clans recruit exceptional players when they can find them and then further cultivate all their players, clans (especially in pub matches) are pushing the KDR for their rounds higher and higher. Their call-outs are great and some of their members are just lethal *all the time*. 
  • As an admin spotting the exceptional players is fairly easy (you see the kills roll across in console while you're online) but a quick score check in spectate mode will show an early outlier. Trouble is always that in the first round you're waiting for that outlier and then having to watch them if they stay for a second round. With the way Steam IDs can be changed, if a player swaps their name in between rounds it can be hard to follow them. You have to "listplayers" grab their ID, look it up in SteamRep, and then check out their hours of Squad played/vac bans/name changes, before you really have a sense of what's going on. This process doesn't happen instantly and if the player leaves before the round ends, the players (and admins) may never be the wiser. It's a tough situation for admins right now since we're trusting EAC (working pretty well as far as we can tell) and the console isn't super efficient for what admins need it for. 

 

 

Well said davebluedevil (Duke?), the learning curve with this game is very steep at the beginning and people just can't seem to figure out how it's even possible to get those high kill totals as this game doesn't hold your hand like most mainstream FPS games. It's a teamwork game and when you play with the same guys over time your communication/tactics get really sharp, you know all the common approaches on the maps, and everyone gets better at the twitch/spotting aspect individually over time. It's not uncommon for our squads to have 100+ kills in a round and an occasional 40-50 kills from one of the heavy hitters..... the advantage of everyone just reacting the right way immediately and aggressively to  certain situations is pretty devastating on pub players. We don't aim for high kill counts though, this is a product of attacking/defending the objective. 

 

Aggressive defense at work here....most underrated tactic in the game:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=651472727

 

(Side note, I know some people are against clans or think it's lame, but if you really want to enjoy this game to its fullest I highly suggest you either join a clan with guys you get along with or just start making friends and playing with the same crew regularly. The more cohesive squads we have in game, the greater the competition...... the greater the fun.)

Edited by Wookie404
spelling

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7 hours ago, MadMak said:

Please, do not post cheat videos here.


It is very interesting to me that they don't want video's that show how cheaters cheat on the forum.  Seems the more information people have, the better they can see what some people can do, and can then detect it.  

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2 hours ago, Karm said:

I once got an infinitely high k/d ratio. I had 3 kills, 0 deaths.

 

I know it's not a popular way to play Squad right now, but this is how I play. Very cautious. For me, since I can never rack up them high K/D scores, my main obj is to not die. I know it happens but I play the game as if I only have 1 life, no respawns. Haha, people would be so bored watching me play!

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Only skimmed through most of this thread

 

Some points I'd like to make

 

First off, it is completely possible to have kill counts that high without cheating or exploiting.  I haven't broken 40 yet, but I have gone a few rounds with mid 30's.  I've seen 1 or 2 people with 40/50 kills ever.  Not to say that some people aren't cheating some how, but just because someone has a lot of kills doesn't mean anything in relation to that unless you have proof they are cheating.

 

Secondly, just because someone is doing good and has a lot of kills doesn't mean they are working WITHOUT their squad.  Someone said "they were probably off doing their own thing".  That is most likely just not true.  All of the times I've gotten high K/D ratios its been working with a full squad and backing up/being backed up.  Going out alone just creates more of a risk to die.  Going with your squad means you have covering fire, back up, numbers, etc.

 

Thirdly, it can all just depend on the situation, the map, the day, the person, etc.  There are 1 or 2 maps that I play where I know I am most likely going to get a lot of kills with any role, just because I play that map well.  Its the same for everyone.  Just because someone goes 36-8 on one map but 12-9 on the next map doesnt mean they were cheating before. 

 

This was one of my best, under 30 but still really good.  I forget what map that is called but it is the one I am best at for sure.

 

DDC10D7451C32E4C9F9FBBD5C0EADD7D31F6B5B8

Edited by Converge

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34 minutes ago, IWI-GALIL5.56FA said:

 

I play the game as if I only have 1 life, no respawns.


This so much, man! Here, have a cookie +1... No, wait, better yet, have a star! +*

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On 4/3/2016 at 10:57 PM, arbopa said:


It is very interesting to me that they don't want video's that show how cheaters cheat on the forum.  Seems the more information people have, the better they can see what some people can do, and can then detect it.  

The Developers, I'm sure, are well aware of the cheats that exist for their game. And server admins are typically players with a lot of experience in playing the game and thus knowing what to look for. We don't post videos, or links, and even try to avoid references to cheats and/or their creators, because there's no point giving these cancerous fucks free advertising on the game's own forums

 

 

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11 hours ago, =AMG=Cheesy_LeScrub said:

The Developers, I'm sure, are well aware of the cheats that exist for their game. And server admins are typically players with a lot of experience in playing the game and thus knowing what to look for. We don't post videos, or links, and even try to avoid references to cheats and/or their creators, because there's no point giving these cancerous fucks free advertising on the game's own forums

 

 

Dude in simple terms, your dead wrong! Its not advertising its EXPOSING.  

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8 minutes ago, shawn7186 said:

Dude in simple terms, your dead wrong! Its not advertising its EXPOSING.  

Majority of the time, hackers don't care if they get banned. They know they'll get caught. They play to ruin experiences, make people rage etc while having fun with their cheats. When you post videos of hackers, you're pretty much feeding their goal of tears. Its also advertising hacks for other hackers to have a look and thus they get off on all the angry people too and maybe the hack coder will get more sales too.

 

 

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15 hours ago, =AMG=Cheesy_LeScrub said:

 And server admins are typically players with a lot of experience in playing the game and thus knowing what to look for.

 


But the average players are not.  And they are on the various servers far more than the admins.  I hardly ever find a server WITH an admin.

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25 minutes ago, arbopa said:


But the average players are not.  And they are on the various servers far more than the admins.  I hardly ever find a server WITH an admin.

And if you're not an Admin you can't do anything about it anyway-- except have a potentially unfounded suspicion that a player is cheating. Did you type that for the sake of being contrarian? Because you didn't really make a point. And you should potentially seek out community servers you know have Admins. Indeed, I don't think I ever play on servers without at least two active Admins on, or within very easy TS/Discord/Steam reach.
 

3 hours ago, shawn7186 said:

Dude in simple terms, your dead wrong! Its not advertising its EXPOSING.  

No. I'm not wrong. Why? Ask Dubs.
 

3 hours ago, Dubs said:

When you post videos of hackers, you're pretty much feeding their goal of tears. Its also advertising hacks for other hackers to have a look and thus they get off on all the angry people too and maybe the hack coder will get more sales too.

 

/Thread.
 

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Theirs  no such things as  infinite/auto grenade launchers or wall/aim cheats in squad !   

"Nah' everyone who plays SQUAD, are just highly skilled players".... Can you feed me some more bullshit ?

Edited by Devastation

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2 hours ago, Devastation said:

Theirs  no such things as  infinite/auto grenade launchers or wall/aim cheats in squad !   

"Nah' everyone who plays SQUAD, are just highly skilled players".... Can you feed me some more bullshit ?

 

No one is saying either one of these statements, hyperbole much?

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Going to add my two cents.

 

I highly doubt anyone is cheating.  I have seen some pretty incredible KDR's.  How .... no idea.  Think my personal best is like 26-3 or 30-3, something like that.  I know there's a few others like Desmo that can achieve those numbers.  All about timing and putting yourself in the right spot.  Lone wolfing it would be hard to do that but it's still possible.  

 

Just my 2 cents.

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5 hours ago, =AMG=Cheesy_LeScrub said:

And if you're not an Admin you can't do anything about it anyway-- except have a potentially unfounded suspicion that a player is cheating. Did you type that for the sake of being contrarian? Because you didn't really make a point. And you should potentially seek out community servers you know have Admins. Indeed, I don't think I ever play on servers without at least two active Admins on, or within very easy TS/Discord/Steam reach.
 

No. I'm not wrong. Why? Ask Dubs.
 

 

/Thread.
 


One does not need to be an admin to know what to look for, then potentially follow someone around recording to catch it.     But I know those big ego admins think they are the only one that matters.  As for 'seeking out'...   there are only so many active servers with decent pings, you take what you can get.  

 

/thread.  LOL.   Ego much? 

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