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IMcQueenI

Ability to build/dig fighting positions as a rifleman

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It'd be nice to be able to 'dig in' without the need for ammo creates. WW2 online had a system were by you could construct a small piece of cover while prone (see this image:  http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:Shovel_f.jpg).

 

750px-Shovel_f.jpg

 

These things are made of dirt and wouldn't need any ammo to resupply. 

Obviously you'd have to restrict the amount of these you can construct but one or two per person hopefully wouldn't cause any major problems for the server.

 

Any thoughts? 

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I like this idea a lot, good memories from service time with the field shovels. Specially during -25C winter season. But to keep the maps from turning into whack-a-mole fields it should be somehow restricted. In Finland every single infantry man carries a field shovel but I don't know how in US / NATO countries.

 

1. If it is given to every soldier, make the build time long for classes not Riflemen or Engineer.

2. If it is given to only selected kits, give it to Rifleman and Engineer classes. This would be another reason to get rifleman over more specialized kit.

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I like this idea a lot, good memories from service time with the field shovels. Specially during -25C winter season. But to keep the maps from turning into whack-a-mole fields it should be somehow restricted. In Finland every single infantry man carries a field shovel but I don't know how in US / NATO countries.

 

1. If it is given to every soldier, make the build time long for classes not Riflemen or Engineer.

2. If it is given to only selected kits, give it to Rifleman and Engineer classes. This would be another reason to get rifleman over more specialized kit.

 

 

Yeah if squad is anything like PR (in which only certain classes had a shovel) then I imagine it'd only be restricted to those classes. 

To stop the maps turning into whack-a-mole fields maybe limit it to one or two uses per life.

 

Somehow I doubt it'd be a major problem considering squads will be able to construct so much anyway, especially if these fighting positions are very small. 

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Yeah if squad is anything like PR (in which only certain classes had a shovel) then I imagine it'd only be restricted to those classes. 

To stop the maps turning into whack-a-mole fields maybe limit it to one or two uses per life.

 

Somehow I doubt it'd be a major problem considering squads will be able to construct so much anyway, especially if these fighting positions are very small. 

 

 

I didn't remember how it was implemented in PR, just that there were shovels. I think they have pretty solid idea on the implementation based on that then if this feature ever comes  :ph34r:

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I didn't remember how it was implemented in PR, just that there were shovels. I think they have pretty solid idea on the implementation based on that then if this feature ever comes  :ph34r:

 

In Squad, when an SL would place a deployable (FOB or weapon), people would have to "dig" them with a shovel until they were completely built. Kept SL's from going solo and placing FOBs everywhere, rifleman would have to be with him to dig them for a good amount of time before they were constructed and usable.

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That would actually be really cool. You could construct, build it up it as a normal rifleman, and after it's finished, some time has to pass before you can do that again, to avoid some kind of spam.

 

The question is if that it's realistic for grunts, I think it would be more realistic to dig foxholes, but this probably won't be a thing the Devs have to make use of terrain deformation (which I heard of is a pandoras box, technically speaking).

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I like the idea of general infantry to be able to dig and make things. Small things like fox holes and such. Maybe make it so you need another squad members approval/help to make them? So they don't get too out of control or go against the squads wishes. Something like

 

-Soldier 1 has placed plans for a foxhole (This is a squad wide notification)

-The foxhole requires a vote. Another squad member can come over and press E to vote yes (If no votes happen the outlay disappears after a while) 

-The foxhole can now be dug 

-If Soldier 1 wishes to make another he must wait for the cooldown period to end and the new foxhole makes the old one be destroyed 

 

Just a quick idea. Can be worked to be improved and would certainly need to under go play testing.  

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i dont think we'd need any rules or restrictions on this. just a 5-10 second shovel animation and viola, you have an extra 15-25 cm of dirt in a 90-180° arc for protection and weapon resting while prone. defense 101 really.

 

foxholes are another story.

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I like the idea of general infantry to be able to dig and make things. Small things like fox holes and such. Maybe make it so you need another squad members approval/help to make them? So they don't get too out of control or go against the squads wishes. Something like

 

-Soldier 1 has placed plans for a foxhole (This is a squad wide notification)

-The foxhole requires a vote. Another squad member can come over and press E to vote yes (If no votes happen the outlay disappears after a while) 

-The foxhole can now be dug 

-If Soldier 1 wishes to make another he must wait for the cooldown period to end and the new foxhole makes the old one be destroyed 

 

Just a quick idea. Can be worked to be improved and would certainly need to under go play testing.  

 

What if Soldier 1 is alone, rest of the squad is dead and reinforcements are coming but few minutes away. The enemy is taking a 30-60 secs break from advancing while scanning and reloading. On fairly open ground the best possible solution would be to dig in as fast as possible within the other natural cover and wait for reinforcements to arrive.

 

Now Soldier 1 is in a situation where he can't build a personal protection foxhole for.. personal protection.

 

My point with this is is that the voting and having another member present would limit a good functionality in situations where it exactly is needed. Wouldn't the restriction be easier to be done with cooldown and amount limitations. Basic rules that come to mind:

 

1. Soldier 1 can only make 2 foxholes, after 3rd is made the 1st disappears

2. Have a long (5 minutes?) cooldown between the 2 foxholes that can be made. It takes some stamina after all. This prevents anybody from modifying the battlefield from favoring you way faster than possible in reality.

 

If you really want to tie it in the teamplay aspect just make it so that you have to be in a squad with an actual SL, and that he needs to accept the build but not by being present?

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What if Soldier 1 is alone, rest of the squad is dead and reinforcements are coming but few minutes away. The enemy is taking a 30-60 secs break from advancing while scanning and reloading. On fairly open ground the best possible solution would be to dig in as fast as possible within the other natural cover and wait for reinforcements to arrive.

Now Soldier 1 is in a situation where he can't build a personal protection foxhole for.. personal protection.

My point with this is is that the voting and having another member present would limit a good functionality in situations where it exactly is needed. Wouldn't the restriction be easier to be done with cooldown and amount limitations. Basic rules that come to mind:

1. Soldier 1 can only make 2 foxholes, after 3rd is made the 1st disappears

2. Have a long (5 minutes?) cooldown between the 2 foxholes that can be made. It takes some stamina after all. This prevents anybody from modifying the battlefield from favoring you way faster than possible in reality.

If you really want to tie it in the teamplay aspect just make it so that you have to be in a squad with an actual SL, and that he needs to accept the build but not by being present?

I think in a situation like that he should retreat and provide intelligence instead of digging in and surely dying. Voting system can go though. Better to teach players to get squad approval instead of forcing a vote. I think a foxhole should require more than a single person to be made in a reasonable amount of time though. Similar to how PR is with one shovel on a target taking forever

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Like I wrote, that scenario is of open ground and retreating there would be even more suicidal. In such scenarios I find it silly to limit the player because his SL is not present and next to him. I would like to see foxhole as an environmental modification allowed for the squad member when he needs it and forcing SL to decide the spots might reduce the features usability. It can still be done so that lonewolfs are not able to use it.

 

EDIT:

 

When I have been talking about foxholes in this topic, I also mean shallow bumbs as well (not even knee deep but to hide you totally/partially while prone).

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I don't think you really need foxholes, but I like the idea of berms/shallow trench.  I can see a situation where your squad or just a few of you are waiting in ambush on a ridgeline and either wouldn't want to or couldn't build a FOB. Or defensive positions around a FOB. Only one per soldier up at any one time, or once per spawn.

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