oblivio69

Squad radar

283 posts in this topic

It's a bit strange how there's a lot of opposition to STHUD, but a lot of excitement and agreement over doing essentially the same thing in a much less useful format on the PR-style compass. I highly suggest some of you check out the video on STHUD, STGI and ST Name Tags. I'm certainly not going to say that Squad absolutely needs to replicate these, but I will say that I believe they are very well designed, and are worth looking to for inspiration.

 

STHUD especially packs a lot of good information into a concise format. Who's in your squad, who's near you, roughly how far away they are, what kit they have, where the compass directions are... STHUD is an extremely useful bit of HUD that offers a lot of situational awareness regarding your squad, making it easier to see and keep track of who is around you. This is a multitude more information than the PR-style compass can convey. Add an indicator of the bearing you're currently facing, and we'd have a seriously powerful little HUD element.

 

I completely agree. No way the compass markers would be at all intuitive or give you a decent idea of where everyone is. It would also get way too cluttered way too fast and only work for people that are in front of you anyway. The STHUD bridges the gap between a game and RL, since IRL you'd have a much better idea of where everyone is. Even with free-look this is impossible to completely simulate in a game. And that's why we need something similar to the STHUD. Gameplay > realism is how this game should be and this is a good example.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well if gameplay beats realism we will end up with cod

 

Gameplay over realism has always been the philosophy of PR.

 

CoD doesn't have good gameplay anyway.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I realize that but the game is still based on reality and going through with this would unnecessarily sacrifice additional realism in an effort add more convenience. I would prefer the game HUD to be much more minimalist if than shactac. Ultimately this session is up to the devs but just a compass that shows direction of SL and FL and a M map that shows all your squad it's SL and FL and the SL of other squads is all that is needed. The compass would show the direction you need to go to reach your SL/FL whether he is right next to your or across the map.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I agree the full map should only show squad leaders. I think the compass would still be best to show the direction of all friendlies within ~25m, faded out to nothing by 50m. It's not about navigation, it's about spatial awareness, and being able to know your buddy is behind to your left would help prevent you from being surprised and accidentally shooting him if you turn around before he announces himself.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

full map should show friendly squad and a shacktac hud look a like show squad members that are 50m away from you. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I agree with the colored tics on the compass, both for SLs to see designated FTLs and other SLs(with distance fade) and the FTLs to see other FTLs and SL.  I also like the idea of medics being red tics on a wounded soldier's compass, or the wounded soldiers as red tics on the medic's compass, maybe both.  I don't believe there should be a minimap with moving players (except for the CO at mainbase).  I think the SLs should be able to see anything the commander orders of any squad on the map, (as if drawn on the map by the SL) and SMs should be able to see what their SL has drawn for them.  No one would ever see each other moving as icons on a map, except the commander. All positions ought to be communicated, like IRL, by radio communications.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well if gameplay beats realism we will end up with cod

And if we go for full realism the game will automatically uninstall once you get hit by the first bullet.Gameplay and realism is not black and white. It is about balance and compromise between the two.You dont want to shovelfor 4 hours to create a foxhole. You want to symbolize that task with 20 seconds of shoveling animations :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes... 20 seconds of shovelling animations.. :(

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes... 20 seconds of shovelling animations.. :(

everybody loves you, chuc :3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes... 20 seconds of shovelling animations.. :(

 

I ofc mean a looping one. get back to your cage Chuc!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I personally love STHUD, but im satisfied with the compass. I wouldnt mind having a little radar though ^^

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No tacked on HUD components just for squad mates. The best compromise is to add indicators on the compass at the bottom of the screen like some have said.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No tacked on HUD components just for squad mates. The best compromise is to add indicators on the compass at the bottom of the screen like some have said.

 

Please define "tacked on Hud component". Putting indicators on the compass accomplishes the same thing but is much less useful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I really dislike the idea of a radar, I think it should remain as it is in PR with the addition of tics indicating SMs, FTLs, and SLs

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It's a bit strange how there's a lot of opposition to STHUD, but a lot of excitement and agreement over doing essentially the same thing in a much less useful format on the PR-style compass. I highly suggest some of you check out the video on STHUD, STGI and ST Name Tags. I'm certainly not going to say that Squad absolutely needs to replicate these, but I will say that I believe they are very well designed, and are worth looking to for inspiration.

 

STHUD especially packs a lot of good information into a concise format. Who's in your squad, who's near you, roughly how far away they are, what kit they have, where the compass directions are... STHUD is an extremely useful bit of HUD that offers a lot of situational awareness regarding your squad, making it easier to see and keep track of who is around you. This is a multitude more information than the PR-style compass can convey. Add an indicator of the bearing you're currently facing, and we'd have a seriously powerful little HUD element.

 

Had to quote this as I agree with the benefits stated here of the STHUD.

 

I really dislike the idea of a radar, I think it should remain as it is in PR with the addition of tics indicating SMs, FTLs, and SLs

Also quoted this to just say I feel the opposite - the STHUD type of implementation of situational awareness makes the gameplay more fluid, while not being somekind of unrealistically overpowered feature.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yes i'd really love a version of shacktac hud in squad, it is one of the best arma add ons and i would love to see it as an option in squad.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the squad radar idea, similar to what is STHud is.  

 

 

Maybe it could work, but it would probably get too cluttered with squad marker and 7 squad members all shown there. Plus it's limited to direction you're facing.

This is true, but in older versions of PR, and BF2/2142 themselves had small arrows surrounding your vision indicating the direction of your squadmates if they were off-screen. Something similar could be implemented.

I'd be all for inclusion of the STHud exactly as it is, complete with colouring squad members and all but some people really don't want it. In the end, having the option to choose between the three of them (SThud, Compass, traditional PR/BF systems) would be great

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

No radar. Wanna know where your buds are? Look around and ask in local.

Cluttering up comms and forcing you to take your attention away from combat are not really great solutions for the lack of simulated peripheral vision.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course there is a "simulated peripheral vision". You can do a 180º turn with your head/mouse in 1/10 a second and then do another 180º. You can be aware of the whole area only looking to the monitor. :)For best results, use Character Focus. :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Turning your view != Peripheral vision.

 

IRL most people have around 180º FOV, while in games we are restricted to a practical value of around 90º FOV. We have about half the horizontal range of vision in games that we have in real life, losing around 45º of vision on each side of the screen. Situational awareness is something that must be constantly maintained. Your proposed "solution" to look left and right is extremely cumbersome and is actually detrimental to your overall situational awareness as you have to break sight with your primary focus to check where your squadmates are to know whether you are in formation. This is especially so in high intensity close quarter engagements where your squad is moving as a team and need to ensure that players won't walk into another teammate's line of fire, move in a position that blocks friendlies and breaks formation, or not properly covering their sectors because they couldn't see that a teammate beside them was already watching that direction. Their focus is already devoted to scanning for enemies and engaging them when they appear, and turning away to check that they are still in formation could leave their squad exposed.

 

A squad formation HUD would be greatly beneficial to squad cohesion while not affecting gameplay in a negative manner as only your squad shows up on the radar, and only for a relatively small distance. You cannot gain any unfair information from it. It is "realistic" in the sense that it is a representation of an actual human being's spatial awareness, or at least moreso than whipping your head back and forth would be. And if you really just don't like it, why not just turn it off?

 

Character Focus has nothing to do with this problem.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now