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Locked squads Good Idea or bad idea?

Squad locking   

400 members have voted

  1. 1. Locked squads will be good for the game

    • Yes
      278
    • No
      118
    • I am going to comment anyway!
      11


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Thanks but if this was 2 or 3 years ago I would jump at that offer. I can't believe they never actually sold PR as it looked like a quality product. I only learnt about PR from that Squad was going to be its spiritual successor. Now I can't get past the graphics style of BF2. I've been spoilt by modern fidelity and I can't go back. Besides I have Squad to play.

Joke's on you there, though.

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I'd rather it be coded into the game designated mortar or logistics or armoured squads or what have you that you can be SL of rather than free for all squad making with squad locking.

Think of the corollary, people join a squad that ends up deciding to play the transport role, because nobody else wants to do it. Now you've already got too many players or the players who weren't expecting to fill this role.I'd rather it be coded into the game designated mortar or logistics or armoured squads or what have you that you can be SL of rather than free for all squad making with squad locking.

Think of the corollary, people join a squad that ends up deciding to play the transport role, because nobody else wants to do it. Now you've already got too many players or the players who weren't expecting to fill this role.

That's how I thought it would be but I am not sure how that would work either. As i understand it If you're a tank crew and you lose your tank you won't get another one for 20 mins. It's not like BF when it will spawn in fairly regularly. What is that two person Squad going to do for 20 mins. Perhaps the PR vets can give some insight.

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This is exactly the kind of game play that is present in BF. You are welcome to play how you like on random servers but don't be surprised when other try to join and remind you it's meant to be a team game. Your squad is off doing their own thing, not communicating or coordinating. You have also taken the m4 to aid you in being undetected while you lone wolf it out. I very much doubt this is the way OWI intend for people to play

 

By all means flank the enemy and find their fobs, get all those kills you are trying for but have the rest of your squad provide overwatch ready to move in and cap that point you either cleared out single handedly or, most likely, revive you. You can't cap on your own and taking out a fob alone is very risky in case they spawn.

 

Take note guys, this is exactly the type of play those who desire locking squads want from the game no matter how they dress it up.

 

Interesting how you're trying to point out ''lone wolving''   to be a ''Lone wolf''  aren't you supposed to be alone in order to be clasified as a ''lone wolf'' ?  

The fact that you call me a lone wolf based on that clip, tells me that you're one of those people that does the ''Duckling formation'' as i pointed out earlier.  

You need visual confirmation to see that your teammates are with you, i don't.  My mate was 50m on the other side of the hill, attacking them from the opposite direction creating crossfire.  If you want me to explain what crossfire means, ill gladly tell you.  It's in the name however. 

 

 

First clip i was getting tired of the other squads.  They have been trying to take down that for atleast 10-15min.  Doing the same fucking thing over and over again, going for a frontal attack.  Guess what happens? They can't move forward.    

Ran up there, shot 3 grenades and cleared 12-15 enemies in their fishbowl FOB by simply not going for that frontal attack. 

 

Second clip: My squadmate has capped the flag (it only takes 1 person to cap a flag, something i don't understand why theres always 20 people standing on a single flag at start of rounds).  

Okay, so he capped the flag.  I am sitting at the edge of the village to scout enemies coming in.  Where are the other squads? sitting on the hills doing fuck all. 

Again, we're not the people that are doing the ''Duckling formation''.  He's still within my area and able to help me. 

 

1:37 see how i fall back? i communicated with my squad member that happens not be a random (because a random would probably not even realize where i am, as no one in the game ever checks their maps).   The squad member came and killed the guy from another angle. 

 

''M4 as aid to be undeteced''  clearly showcased in this clip. 

This is common sense for the most. And probably crucial on this map as the main battle is in the city which is mostly close quarters.  

Tell me, did any of those fuckers even look behind them after i shot the first guy? 

 

Half a squad wiped and delayed.

 

Third clip do you honestly think, you could've timed that with randoms? without having your squad members shoot them on sight probably missing every shot?

 

Fourth clip This was again a situation where we're spread out very well, they spotted a FOB.  And i went after the squad that capped the objective that was fully unguarded.  Nailed the squad, walked back to my squad members to see if they needed any further help with the FOB they found (which was obviously their main supply of reinforcements for that capture).   Meaning the re-capture would be easier as they now had to spawn somewhere else.

 

 

 

 
''By all means flank the enemy and find their fobs, get all those kills you are trying for but have the rest of your squad provide overwatch ready to move in and cap that point you either cleared out single handedly or, most likely, revive you. You can't cap on your own and taking out a fob alone is very risky in case they spawn.'' 
 
 
Taking out a FOB is extremely easy, all it takes is common sense and discipline. Plain and simple.
 
Find out where they spawn, go there without getting noticed, let 2 people sit on the fob, let the 3rd guy clear the area and backstab those that just spawned as they never notice they are getting shot from the back because you full squads never communicate with each other. 
 
3rd guy comes back, creating a instant lock on the fob so they cant spawn anymore. Dig it up. 
 
That doesn't mean you need 3 people to take out a FOB, it's very do-able with 2 people aswell.
The FOB turns red when 2 Hostiles are on the FOB and the FOB has dropped/decreased to 75%.
 
 
Again, you can't get unnoticed to a enemy FOB with randoms in your squad as they will shoot on sight :).
 
 

 

You can't cap on your own and taking out a fob alone is very risky in case they spawn.

 

 

Risky? what? You lose 1 ticket if you failed, against the potential 10 that you can take.

 

 

 

We had to wait atleast 10 minutes if not 15 min, for our team to actually get to us.

 

Taking out FOBs is essential, as it is their main source for reinforcements.  And that those kills come with it?  we can't help it, seriously can't.   It's the enemies stupidity for not communicating telling others people are on their FOB. No they just keep spawning on that shit despite dieing on that FOB 4 times in a row.

 

Guess what happens if you take away the main supply of reinforcements?  yes, thats right. It allows your team to move up as they will encounter less resistance.

 

They are litteraly donating these kills, thinking they are that 1 special person with super reflexes that can possibly shoot that person that is on their FOB. NOW THATS BATTLEFIELD MENTALITY.

 

 

 

This is a effective defensive line we put up, unlike duckling squads.   

We're all able to see each other, and help if it was needed.  Not to mention the information you gather by setting up is valuable especially at the start of rounds.   

Which side of the map will contain the highest concentration of enemies?  Alot of valuable information that you can send to the squads on the cap point so that they can get ready for a possible attack.

You might lose a single guy 1 ticket, but who the fuck cares about a death if it gains something more valuable? 

 

You seem to be more focused on our kills then we are.

 

 

46ad750525.jpg

 

Lone wolving... ha...

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That's how I thought it would be but I am not sure how that would work either. As i understand it If you're a tank crew and you lose your tank you won't get another one for 20 mins. It's not like BF when it will spawn in fairly regularly. What is that two person Squad going to do for 20 mins. Perhaps the PR vets can give some insight.

This is true, and its one of the reasons the squad system needs to be flexible. If your tank gets killed in PR by enemy air it would be wise to grab an anti-air vehicle to guard the other 2 tanks in your squad, while you wait for your own to respawn. You can also ask the APC-squad if they have a spare one you can borrow. Alternatively you can just make yourself usefull as infantry or by driving supplies around the map for example.

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I read all of your post Business Turtle and the thing that came across strongest is you don't want to team play because everyone else is useless. If you don't allow anyone to play with you and teach them how to play well then that's not really helping either.

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They wait for another tank. Also, what are they going to do now the dedicated tank squad is no longer useful? Make anoher squad? Or just rename / reuse the existing squad.

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They wait for another tank. Also, what are they going to do now the dedicated tank squad is no longer useful? Make anoher squad? Or just rename / reuse the existing squad.

Being a dedicated tank crew squad or a named locked tank crew squad amounts to the same thing just with fewer arguments. I liked Gorzu's reply to explain how the tank crew could still remain useful if they lost their tank while they wait.

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They wait for another tank. Also, what are they going to do now the dedicated tank squad is no longer useful? Make anoher squad? Or just rename / reuse the existing squad.

 

Being a dedicated tank crew squad or a named locked tank crew squad amounts to the same thing just with fewer arguments. I liked Gorzu's reply to explain how the tank crew could still remain useful if they lost their tank while they wait.

 

AAV ought to be watching over Tanks from start if their are air assets.

For waiting they can just INF.

 

trainn.jpg?1260328965

 

If you want to see a system that works then suppress your gag reflex because of the outdated graphics and try PR. It has a good system that worked for over 10 years, and lockable squads are one of its base components. Now, I'm not saying we shouldn't innovate. If we could come up with a better system that would give everyone a fair chance of playing what he wants, why not. But at the moment putting locks on squads is the easiest solution until a better one can be found.

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It looks to me that squad size in PR was dictated by the original BF2 game that the mod was built on. OWI are building a game and not a mod so have much more freedom in what the can achieve. Isn't that also one of the many reasons they're going the route that they are?

 

I put it out there that locking squads in PR was the only way they could achieve dedicated squads that were not oversubscribed. Please correct me if that is wrong.

 

Just because something was done one way in the past does not mean there isn't a better way when you have access to more recent innovations.

 

@ MultiSquid - It looks like you could do with one of the new innovative hype trains by your pic.

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Choice selection edited  :blink:

 

LOL. Still waiting for that convincing argument discussion point that can help me finally decide either way.

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It looks to me that squad size in PR was dictated by the original BF2 game that the mod was built on. OWI are building a game and not a mod so have much more freedom in what the can achieve. Isn't that also one of the many reasons they're going the route that they are?

 

Not entirely correct. Squad and player sizes were limited by the game at first, but I can't tell you how easy or hard it was to bypass the system. I know they had some 200 player events with god knows how many players per squad before the release of 0.98 but decided that it was too much stress on the server and thus halved it when releasing 1.0. The increased player count of 100 then required larger squad sizes compared to vBF2's 6 because making more than 9 squads was not possible due to the engine(9x6=54, barely enough) and thus the squad size was changed 8 in order to accomodate the increased player count.

 

I put it out there that locking squads in PR was the only way they could achieve dedicated squads that were not oversubscribed. Please correct me if that is wrong.

 

Just because something was done one way in the past does not mean there isn't a better way when you have access to more recent innovations.

 

 

 

I guess it's a vBF2 feature first that kept grievers out of your squad or so that you can play with your mates. Sometimes people may not crowd an asset squad, but I would bet 9 times out of 10 asset squads would be full if it weren't for the ability to lock and then you would have people arguing over who takes what and "I said it first!" instead of being able to play properly.

 

That's entirely possible. But until somebody has this stroke of genius and nothing is done a large portion would prefer the tested, traditional way like we're used to.

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hmmmm, this is a hard one.... u want that teamwork feeling up high so everyone could join and if your playing with your (own) squad u should play with 9 members.... u can get teamkillers and soundspammers and that type of irritating guys. i say : NO LOCK :ph34r:

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Interesting how you're trying to point out ''lone wolving''   to be a ''Lone wolf''  aren't you supposed to be alone in order to be clasified as a ''lone wolf'' ?  

The fact that you call me a lone wolf based on that clip, tells me that you're one of those people that does the ''Duckling formation'' as i pointed out earlier.  

You need visual confirmation to see that your teammates are with you, i don't.  My mate was 50m on the other side of the hill, attacking them from the opposite direction creating crossfire.  If you want me to explain what crossfire means, ill gladly tell you.  It's in the name however. 

 

 

First clip i was getting tired of the other squads.  They have been trying to take down that for atleast 10-15min.  Doing the same fucking thing over and over again, going for a frontal attack.  Guess what happens? They can't move forward.    

Ran up there, shot 3 grenades and cleared 12-15 enemies in their fishbowl FOB by simply not going for that frontal attack. 

 

Second clip: My squadmate has capped the flag (it only takes 1 person to cap a flag, something i don't understand why theres always 20 people standing on a single flag at start of rounds).  

Okay, so he capped the flag.  I am sitting at the edge of the village to scout enemies coming in.  Where are the other squads? sitting on the hills doing fuck all. 

Again, we're not the people that are doing the ''Duckling formation''.  He's still within my area and able to help me. 

 

1:37 see how i fall back? i communicated with my squad member that happens not be a random (because a random would probably not even realize where i am, as no one in the game ever checks their maps).   The squad member came and killed the guy from another angle. 

 

''M4 as aid to be undeteced''  clearly showcased in this clip. 

This is common sense for the most. And probably crucial on this map as the main battle is in the city which is mostly close quarters.  

Tell me, did any of those fuckers even look behind them after i shot the first guy? 

 

Half a squad wiped and delayed.

 

Third clip do you honestly think, you could've timed that with randoms? without having your squad members shoot them on sight probably missing every shot?

 

Fourth clip This was again a situation where we're spread out very well, they spotted a FOB.  And i went after the squad that capped the objective that was fully unguarded.  Nailed the squad, walked back to my squad members to see if they needed any further help with the FOB they found (which was obviously their main supply of reinforcements for that capture).   Meaning the re-capture would be easier as they now had to spawn somewhere else.

 

 

 

 
''By all means flank the enemy and find their fobs, get all those kills you are trying for but have the rest of your squad provide overwatch ready to move in and cap that point you either cleared out single handedly or, most likely, revive you. You can't cap on your own and taking out a fob alone is very risky in case they spawn.'' 
 
 
Taking out a FOB is extremely easy, all it takes is common sense and discipline. Plain and simple.
 
Find out where they spawn, go there without getting noticed, let 2 people sit on the fob, let the 3rd guy clear the area and backstab those that just spawned as they never notice they are getting shot from the back because you full squads never communicate with each other. 
 
3rd guy comes back, creating a instant lock on the fob so they cant spawn anymore. Dig it up. 
 
That doesn't mean you need 3 people to take out a FOB, it's very do-able with 2 people aswell.
The FOB turns red when 2 Hostiles are on the FOB and the FOB has dropped/decreased to 75%.
 
 
Again, you can't get unnoticed to a enemy FOB with randoms in your squad as they will shoot on sight :).
 
 
 

 

Risky? what? You lose 1 ticket if you failed, against the potential 10 that you can take.

 

 

 

We had to wait atleast 10 minutes if not 15 min, for our team to actually get to us.

 

Taking out FOBs is essential, as it is their main source for reinforcements.  And that those kills come with it?  we can't help it, seriously can't.   It's the enemies stupidity for not communicating telling others people are on their FOB. No they just keep spawning on that shit despite dieing on that FOB 4 times in a row.

 

Guess what happens if you take away the main supply of reinforcements?  yes, thats right. It allows your team to move up as they will encounter less resistance.

 

They are litteraly donating these kills, thinking they are that 1 special person with super reflexes that can possibly shoot that person that is on their FOB. NOW THATS BATTLEFIELD MENTALITY.

 

 

 

This is a effective defensive line we put up, unlike duckling squads.   

We're all able to see each other, and help if it was needed.  Not to mention the information you gather by setting up is valuable especially at the start of rounds.   

Which side of the map will contain the highest concentration of enemies?  Alot of valuable information that you can send to the squads on the cap point so that they can get ready for a possible attack.

You might lose a single guy 1 ticket, but who the fuck cares about a death if it gains something more valuable? 

 

You seem to be more focused on our kills then we are.

 

 

46ad750525.jpg

 

Lone wolving... ha...

squad 4 is thinking HURRY UP squad 2 and 1  :D  :lol:

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"Be the change you wish to see in this game" - Meka tataku

If you think squads shouldn't be locked, then don't lock your squad. Perhaps even encourage others to do the same, but give the people who want their squad locked an option to do so.
It clearly has it's pros and cons, but I demand free will! Fuck yeah B)

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What are the cons of locking a squad. 

Join a server to find 12

4 man squads all locked

 

and no one left has a mike or speaks your language

 

and yes you could go join another  server but sometimes all the low ping servers are full or empty 

 

and then you go play something else and that doesn't help squad !

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Yes to locked squads, but we REALLY need a "request to join squad" command, allowing players looking for a squad to "ping" the SL of a locked squad.

I find in PR that sometimes a SL locks his squad, then loses some players, but doesn't realize it and ends up with a 2-3 (inefficient) man locked squad.

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Meh. As long as it isn't spam-able I guess. Using team chat is sufficient for now in my opinion. We'll see what the devs come up with.

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Yes to locked squads, but we REALLY need a "request to join squad" command, allowing players looking for a squad to "ping" the SL of a locked squad.

I find in PR that sometimes a SL locks his squad, then loses some players, but doesn't realize it and ends up with a 2-3 (inefficient) man locked squad.

That's a good idea. Maybe you can attach a message to it and you can type like "teamwork oriented guy, played with your SM *name before, may I join? "

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Yes to locked squads, but we REALLY need a "request to join squad" command, allowing players looking for a squad to "ping" the SL of a locked squad.

I find in PR that sometimes a SL locks his squad, then loses some players, but doesn't realize it and ends up with a 2-3 (inefficient) man locked squad.

 

I feel like this is a pretty good compromise and solution to the debate as a whole. Obviously there will need to be balancing and anti-spam measures in place but that's to be said with nearly anything online.

 

One thing I think we need to make certain we don't do is create a divide in the community. It felt like after the mass player influx in PR, clans stuck to their locked squads and did nothing else.

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One thing I think we need to make certain we don't do is create a divide in the community. It felt like after the mass player influx in PR, clans stuck to their locked squads and did nothing else.

 

So there is history then with PR, where locked squads ended up being little clicks of players ignoring anyone else.

 

Case closed // kinda the reason I do not wanna see locked squads. To me defeats the object of being a team anyone and everyone should be allowed to join. And only if ya an Ass get kicked.

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