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Locked squads Good Idea or bad idea?

Squad locking   

400 members have voted

  1. 1. Locked squads will be good for the game

    • Yes
      278
    • No
      118
    • I am going to comment anyway!
      11


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4 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

 

They're confirmed. But there's also tanks, transport choppers, mortars, etc.

 

 

There is nothing about locked squad that excludes new players. Stop claiming this bullshit. What if I'm running a 6-man squad that's full of new players? What then?

 

With smaller squads, there will be more squads to choose from, and more squad leaders to choose from. Your bad arguments are bad.

Well, shit for brains are you going to be running 6 man squads on every goddamn server ?  NOPE !!!!!  

  So almost everyone gets locked out of a squad on each server.. because you want to run a 6 man squad on only 1`server.

That is real intelligent !..... smh

Edited by Devastation

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You still miss the point of locked squads @Devastation . A group of friends don't want to play with randoms. Period. I already mentioned all the negatives on my posts before but there's not one thing that comes from randoms. Maybe an extra medkit if we are 5 but thats it.

Add that most groups don't speak english inside their squads (that does not mean SLs don't speak english in SL channel) and you have an amazing squad experience for the poor SL that couldn't lock his squad. 

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53 minutes ago, Frontliner said:

 

They don't play alone, there's like 6-8 other squads available(in PR). Scratch 2-4 squads manning assets and you have 2-4 squads to choose from.

 

And if all SLs decide they want no new people in their squads? You say i had 2-4 squads to join. As i played PR this wasn't my experience at all. Most rounds there were 0 to 1 squads to join. You are not the only player who prefered playing with only friends in PR! So around every second time i booted up PR i was running around alone on a massive map. Once i tried to make my own squad as a totally new player. Guess why i never go into PR.

 

1 hour ago, Frontliner said:

From your words it seems you're somehow under the misconception that you're entitled to receive a slot in my squad. You aren't. Has nothing to do with you being a noob or somebody else being a noob, if I don't know you, don't count on it.

May i suggest you stay in PR or play COOP Arma mission. There you never have to deal with people you dont know.

 

1 hour ago, Frontliner said:

No need to be upset, it's just how I handle things. Others do it differently, some don't care. Who's right? I don't know. I just want to have a good time, that's all.

Yes you want to have a good time, but dont want to help others having a good time and learn game.

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1 hour ago, Romby said:

btw i want to comment this again. You make a locked squad with 5 of your friends and you choose the kits 2 medics, AR, LAT, Breacher and a SL. How does 3 randoms joining you make you lose a medic??

 

That was me recounting past experiences with squads compromised fully of noobs.

 

The reason I lock a squad with 6 experienced players(in PR!) is that I(usually) have more than enough firepower with me to wipe out opposing full size squads, whilst being more nimble and faster than them on the offense. I noticed way too often adding one or two random players causes my squad to lose cohesion at no real benefit - noobs are too often distracted, lag behind, get spotted too easily or shoot everything in sight.

 

Quote

Honestly if you dont want to play with people you dont know i suggest playing COOP Arma missions or making a event like Squad Ops only for experienced players. If you want to join public servers and enjoy having other people (experienced/newbies) playing the role of organized teammates or enemies then you have to do your part as well. That means sometimes having new people in your squad and pushing them in right direction. Will it always be fun. No i guess not. But is part of the game

 

ArmA is trash, others may disagree but that's how I feel you best describe its """gameplay""". I'm currently not that invested in Squad, but now even less so since PR 1.4 is announced and the tournament number 12 is underway with me being a squad leader.

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3 minutes ago, ukigumo said:

You still miss the point of locked squads @Devastation . A group of friends don't want to play with randoms. Period. I already mentioned all the negatives on my posts before but there's not one thing that comes from randoms. Maybe an extra medkit if we are 5 but thats it.

Add that most groups don't speak english inside their squads (that does not mean SLs don't speak english in SL channel) and you have an amazing squad experience for the poor SL that couldn't lock his squad. 

i say this again. My i suggest that that group of friends play Arma Coop missions. There they can do what they what and there is no community they have to contribute to.

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21 minutes ago, ukigumo said:

You still miss the point of locked squads @Devastation . A group of friends don't want to play with randoms. Period. I already mentioned all the negatives on my posts before but there's not one thing that comes from randoms. Maybe an extra medkit if we are 5 but thats it.

Add that most groups don't speak english inside their squads (that does not mean SLs don't speak english in SL channel) and you have an amazing squad experience for the poor SL that couldn't lock his squad. 

 

What do you think the kick button is for ? Create a Squad for you & your friends have your friends join in the squad,  if there is not enough room just kick the random person or persons !   Why the hell would you want to run a 6 man squad anyway this isn't battlefield !

Edited by Devastation

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31 minutes ago, Devastation said:

 

What do you think the kick button is for ? Create a Squad for you & your friends have your friends join in the squad,  if there is not enough room just kick the random person or persons !   Why the hell would you want to run a 6 man squad anyway this isn't battlefield !


Because it is easier to coordinate, especially if you know the  other people.
 

31 minutes ago, Romby said:

i say this again. My i suggest that that group of friends play Arma Coop missions. There they can do what they what and there is no community they have to contribute to.

 

5 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

There is nothing about locked squad that excludes new players. Stop claiming this bullshit. What if I'm running a 6-man squad that's full of new players? What then?


In other words, locked squads doesn't mean that new players will be locked out, only that uncooperative new(and old) players will be locked out - in addition to only having as many people as you need for what you want to do that match, not having to worry about lone-wolfs in your squad.


I'm going to quote myself here as I think it's a pretty good compromise to having locked squads
 

Quote

Then there would have to be a rule that you can only lock a squad, if there's enough squads to go around.
So that the requirements to lock a squad would have to be:
- there is a ratio of less than 2:1 locked:unlocked squads on the team
- you have atleast 4 people in the squad you want to lock


Now make it so that the server host can set the ratio to whatever and you're set.

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17 minutes ago, Romby said:

And if all SLs decide they want no new people in their squads? You say i had 2-4 squads to join. As i played PR this wasn't my experience at all. Most rounds there were 0 to 1 squads to join. You are not the only player who prefered playing with only friends in PR! So around every second time i booted up PR i was running around alone on a massive map. Once i tried to make my own squad as a totally new player. Guess why i never go into PR.

 

Well, I did say it was easier back in 0.95-1.0. You've got to stay persistent(I also said that), I, too, was locked out of squads and had no real options to choose from. It sucks, but the only to make others realize what they are missing out on is to show them that they are missing out. Join trans, grab a logi, ask others if they need supplies, repairs, whatever. Do Recon with 2-3 other people, report contacts from behind enemy lines, find out where the enemies have their FOBs and assets stationed. Solidify your team's defenses by building back up FOBs or deny/limit enemy armour movement by building a FOB with AT/AA on the flanks. That's four things you can do on your own if you have to, that doesn't require a whole lot of training as a squad leader and are still valuable to the team's success as a whole.

 

I guess now that Squad is around nobody really has to try to make a name for themselves in PR, but to go ahead and tell me that I'm the problem when I faced AND overcame all of the problems you have is ridiculous. Did you honestly believe for just a second that I got where I am now by luck, by coincidence, by chance, by bitching on the PR Forums that I was locked out? You've given up. That thought never crossed my mind.

 

Quote

May i suggest you stay in PR or play COOP Arma mission. There you never have to deal with people you dont know.

 

Oh, I'll be staying in PR for a while longer, no doubt about that, but this ArmA trash can go where the sun doesn't shine.

 

I did say that my Squad squads are always open(even if I could lock them) because I don't know anyone yet. How you manage to confuse that with me not wanting to interact with others baffles me.

 

Quote

Yes you want to have a good time, but dont want to help others having a good time and learn game.

 

I'm afraid my personal perception is paramount to what I'm doing when playing. I accept the fact that I may do it on the backs of some players but that's life.

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Well, I am only going to say this once....If the DEVS  want to listen to the  BF & COD  kids that just bought SQUAD recently, then so be it !!! 

Go ahead and lock the squads, and watch how fast Squad goes to shit & turns into a bunch of lone wolves running and gunning around without  teamwork BECAUSE THEY WERE LOCKED OUT OF THE SQUADS ! 

  Don't say i didn't tell you so !

 

 

Happy Thanksgiving

Edited by Devastation

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51 minutes ago, Peerun said:

In other words, locked squads doesn't mean that new players will be locked out, only that uncooperative new(and old) players will be locked out - in addition to only having as many people as you need for what you want to do that match, not having to worry about lone-wolfs in your squad.

I agree that you need to be able to lock transport, tank, heli, mortar/artillery, recon and logi squads. I just dont think people should be able to lock normal infantry squads. The way to learn the game as a new player is as infantry and we should help people getting into these squads.

 

51 minutes ago, Peerun said:

Now make it so that the server host can set the ratio to whatever and you're set.

it is an interesting idea. What about just 2 types of squads. Infantry squad (with all the current kits) & Lockable squad (Available kits are SL, medic, marksman (one per team), crewman, pilot and normal rifleman (without scope). The lockable squads can then be used for all the jobs that require locked squads.

 

48 minutes ago, Frontliner said:

Join trans, grab a logi, ask others if they need supplies, repairs, whatever. Do Recon with 2-3 other people, report contacts from behind enemy lines, find out where the enemies have their FOBs and assets stationed. Solidify your team's defenses by building back up FOBs or deny/limit enemy armour movement by building a FOB with AT/AA on the flanks. That's four things you can do on your own if you have to, that doesn't require a whole lot of training as a squad leader and are still valuable to the team's success as a whole.

Of cause all these are perfect jobs for new people who dont understand the game. Being a SL and trying understand FOB building mecanics is just perfect for new players.

 

48 minutes ago, Frontliner said:

I'm afraid my personal perception is paramount to what I'm doing when playing. I accept the fact that I may do it on the backs of some players but that's life.

I dont care if my kind of fun ruin the fun for other people in my team. Great contribution to community!

48 minutes ago, Frontliner said:

It sucks, but the only to make others realize what they are missing out on is to show them that they are missing out.

Yes best way to get to know the new kid in class is having birthdayparties without him a few years. After he realises what he is missing he will want to stay around.

Edited by Romby

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4 minutes ago, Romby said:

Of cause all these are perfect jobs for new people who dont understand the game. Being a SL and trying understand FOB building mecanics is just perfect for new players.

 

Yes, hence my recommendation. If you think leading a full size squad is easier to manage and less frustrating than deploying FOBs you're wrong. I mean, I guess Squad's mechanics are a bit different and PR's FOB emplacements have their buggy moments but it's nothing that cannot be overcome by taking the time to read the manual and some hours of practice. The person who introduced me to PR(he himself was a noob) was driving around with me for hours and hours, building FOB after FOB.

 

Quote

I dont care if my kind of fun ruin the fun for other people in my team. Great contribution to community!

 

How about you read the part again where I said that my SLing in Squad is completely different from me leading in PR?

 

MY SQUADS ARE ALWAYS OPEN. Is that finally enough? No? MY SQUADS ARE ALWAYS OPEN.

 

Of course the greatest contribution is whining on the forums.

 

Quote

Yes best way to get to know the new kid in class is having a birthday party without him a few years. After he realises what he is missing he will what to stay around.

 

I know it's easier to deal with the position of others if you're making a strawman argument(rather a strawman example in this case), but I suggest you stop it. Two can play that game and it doesn't go anywhere.

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1 hour ago, Romby said:

i say this again. My i suggest that that group of friends play Arma Coop missions. There they can do what they what and there is no community they have to contribute to.

Funny thing is i have several thousands of hours played in BF:PR and I want it. Also the overwhelming majority wants it. 

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@Devastation, what the hell are you even talking about? I'm not saying I'm going to run exclusive 6-man newbie squads. I'm saying that there's no mechanism in squad locking that automatically filters out new players from joining, so the people in my squad could all be veterans or new players.

 

This goes for you too, @Romby. Squad locking does not mean "block anyone with X hours of Squad from joining the squad". Anybody is able to join a squad before it gets locked, and there's nothing in-game that allows you to tell how experienced the players in your squad are.

 

So if I make a 6-man squad, nothing about that is excluding new players from joining that squad any more than a 9-man squad does.

 

Squad locking DOES NOT exclude new players in any way. Stop arguing this nonsense.

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16 minutes ago, Frontliner said:

How about you read the part again where I said that my SLing in Squad is completely different from me leading in PR?

 

MY SQUADS ARE ALWAYS OPEN. Is that finally enough? No? MY SQUADS ARE ALWAYS OPEN.

 

Of course the greatest contribution is whining on the forums.

 

I always play SL as well and my squads are also always open.

 

I agree with you that the most fustrating thing is a bad squad. A bad team makes you lose, but it is still fun as long as you have teamwork in squad.

 

Actually i dont understand why you dont want 3 randoms in your squad. My experience is that the 3 randoms players will behave a lot better if majority of squad is serious and listens to orders. The serious players have an effect on the randoms. Normally a squad only turns to shit if you have a majority of players who dont follow. I hate that as well. Yesterday i had a horrible round (our team won) because my squad didn't follow at all and used squad chat for all coms (no local).

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16 minutes ago, Tartantyco said:

This goes for you too, @Romby. Squad locking does not mean "block anyone with X hours of Squad from joining the squad". Anybody is able to join a squad before it gets locked, and there's nothing in-game that allows you to tell how experienced the players in your squad are.

 

So if I make a 6-man squad, nothing about that is excluding new players from joining that squad any more than a 9-man squad does.

 

Squad locking DOES NOT exclude new players in any way. Stop arguing this nonsense.

People like frontline wants the locked squads to make a 6 player squad with his 5 friends. A full locked squad prevents others from joining (that was what always happened in PR). What you are describing is not a locked squad. That is just a smaller open to everyone squad.

 

Im not against smaller squads for jobs like tanks, helis, artillery and so on. I am against locked inf squads for a group of experienced players who dont want to help new people learn.

 

To quote myself:

 

58 minutes ago, Romby said:

What about just 2 types of squads. Infantry squad (with all the current kits) & Lockable squad (Available kits are SL, medic, marksman (one per team), crewman, pilot and normal rifleman (without scope). The lockable squads can then be used for all the jobs that require locked squads.

 

Edited by Romby

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@Tartantyco

 

  Pretty sure the locked squad in PR worked like this: when you locked squad noone could join. So you made a squad and had your friends join. Then you locked squad and kicked the randoms that got into squad. Now because squad was locked noone else could join. This is what a lot of people want in squad.

Edited by Romby

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24 minutes ago, Romby said:

This is what a lot of people want in squad.

 

There will be your open squad so people can join, or someone's else.  Or you can ask in chat if there are REALLY no other spots, someone will open IF you ask.

You did not pay me to be let in, I do not owe you or anyone else anything, I bought this game to enjoy it with friends, I do not care if you think this is wrong. If I want my squad to be locked right now,  on a licensed servers I have a right to kick anyone for any reason as it's stated in guidelines for admins who have a license, so be it, I'll do just that and that will cause a lot more damage than just some locked squads. 

Edited by rincewind

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I'm so tired of this pointless banging on the wall.

 

The locked squads WORK. They have WORKED for years in PR, they are tried and tested, it's a FACT.

 

I'm starting to feel like the people who are oh-so-worried about the new players getting shut out are actually the same people who know they would be the ones getting locked out, because they: 

  • can't work with others 
  • won't lead their own squad
  • are just as***les in general

and they just can't find a group to play with, so they have to resort  to random squads all the time. Anyone else who's at least semi-intelligent, polite and able to suspend his own ego for the time being can and will find people willing to share their playtime with them on a regular basis.

Edited by MultiSquid

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13 minutes ago, MultiSquid said:

I'm so tired of this pointless banging on the wall.

 

The locked squads WORK. They have WORKED for years in PR, they are tried and tested, it's a FACT.

 

I'm starting to feel like the people who are oh-so-worried about the new players getting shut out are actually the same people who know they would be the ones getting locked out, because they: 

  • can't work with others 
  • won't lead a squad 
  • are just as***les in general

and they just can't find a group to play with, so they have to resort  to random squads all the time. Anyone else who's at least semi-normal, polite and able to suspend his own ego for the time being can and will find people willing to share their playtime with them on a regular basis.

First of all i almost always play SL. When i play medic i always have highest score in squad because i heal and revive. Teamwork is no problem and i have lots of people on my steam friendlist who i meet in squad (pretty much only play on one clan server and therefore see a lot of the same people).

 

Locked squads didn't work in PR in my opinion. To often you joined and say a locked inf squad with 5 guys. Guess the people in that squad though the system worked perfectly. They never had to deal with other people and therefore had a great time.

 

Now you will say i should just make a squad that new players can join. But honestly i dont fell like being the only SL playing with new guys on a server where all other squads are locked. If it ends there i will probally lock my squad as well. Think all SLs should pull their part. If each SL takes 2-3 new guys they wornt ruin their experience. Btw im not saying i dont think you are allowed to kick people who doesnt follow. I do the same (and they should add a system so people i kick cant join my squad again). But I dont like the SLs who will just lock squad and therefore help no new players learn the game.

Edited by Romby

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2 hours ago, ukigumo said:

Funny thing is i have several thousands of hours played in BF:PR and I want it. Also the overwhelming majority wants it. 

 

I don't see how you deduce anything but the majority want the option for the uncommon scenario.  If you constantly play with a locked squad and you aren't a special kit, maybe the problem isn't other people.

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21 hours ago, Tartantyco said:

 

What are you going to do when you make an Attack Chopper squad that seats two players? Are you going to be running 7 infantry players in addition, leading them from the cockpit?

 

Let them know it's a air asset squad, and ask them if they'd like to stay and be my maintenance crew, or join the fight in another squad. :)

I see your point, but would you join an air only squad as infantry?

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19 hours ago, CageMatchKimsey said:

 

Neither have I..   even a rare occurrence in years of Battlefield.  But the option would probably be a good thing to have.

 

True, and I don't really have an issue with locked squads, just don't think we need them yet.

 

The only issue I worry about is too many Sniper/Spotter 2x man squads doing nothing to help the team.

 

Looking forward to see how it all pans out!

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1 minute ago, MauserGDog said:

 

Let them know it's a air asset squad, and ask them if they'd like to stay and be my maintenance crew, or join the fight in another squad. :)

I see your point, but would you join an air only squad as infantry?

 

I wouldn't, but people do all the time. They end up being lonewolves.

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