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Here is some base building theory, somewhat inspired by the thread about grenade defence in fobs. This is the doctrine that i would adhere to when building Fobs but i hope we can have a discussion and see other interesting designs for reasonable fobs that are not super fobs.

 

The common mistake people make is to think they are playing tower defence or zombie apocalypse, thus what they often do is barricade doors thus making it harder for a squad to get out of a FOB and then eventually just being blocked and just easier to kill, many people build defences that actually make it harder to defend and easier to attack. I'll try to explain the doctrine that i follow when making any kind of FOB or defences.

 

Some assumptions I work by:

  1. Explosives is the primary danger to any FOB
  2. FOBs designs should contain as few items as possible so that they are realistic to build, atleast at the core.
  3. FOB defences should Never restrict friendly exit possibilities thus bottlenecking them.
  4. FOB defences should Never make it easier for the enemy to use explosive weapons against defenders
  5. FOB defences should Deny aproaches and areas in which would be a desireable aproach
  6. FOB defences should attempt to create zones in which the enemy can easily be killed

Notice, I am not suggesting you should build FOBS in harms way, but if you do this is some advice for you.

 

Part 1 FOB on a Point

 

When you have a FOB on a point it will be assaulted, and most likely will be showered with grenades, people will attempt to shoot through holes in the wall, and try to get inside a corner to camp the FOB area in order to get kills. For this reason, you usually should Not build FOBS directly on points. However in certain maps like Chora, you have large open grounds, with no bushes to hide in, and building fobs on the fields of Chora makes it extremely easy to kill your squad once discovered as their is no cover at all. So let's take a look at the exception case where building a FOB on a point or indeed just any compound is actually a good idea.

 

Most points are located near or in buildings, and so most FOBS are probably made inside a compound. The trick here is to have mobility to get out of the compound when needed, being able to fire from the compound, and also avoid being spawn killed by rockets and other weapons.

I've made an example using lilac estate on how to use defences to make it much harder to attack without blocking yourself in, let's go through that.

 

LWpSC7T.png

 

I've marked the entrences with blue triangles.

 

If you look at triangle 1, usually the enemy will sit here and fire rockets in diagonally and kill people in the other corner or center of the compound, by placing a hesco wall a bit away from the entrance you obstruct their line of sight while you are still able to exit. I've placed a line of sandbags to cover entrance 1, with RPG or grenade fire, even if they remove the hesco in that entrance this wall would prevent them from firing near entrance 3, while also giving a good place to fire upon the entrance in which they would have no cover.

 

Entrance 2 and 3 have hesco walls outside and inside, this is to prevent people from firing rockets through the door, thus friendlies can sit behind the wall and fire out of it, without the risk of being blown up by a rocket that comes through the door next to them, notice also that each window (marked in teal) and firing position has a hesco behind them to prevent people from shooting through windows into the compound if they manage to get all the way up to the wall.

We deny house 1 with razor wire, as house 1 serves little purpose in terms of defence, but serves as a good position for an attacker to cover the courtyard.

 

Entrance is already fairly hard to attack since you have to enter a room that can be grenaded or rocketed quite easily, the defences here serve to compartmentalise an area for a grenadier to sit and coer the house entrance, usually the enemy would throw grenade over the wall before entering the house, but it's very difficult landing a grenade inside a small area between 2 hesco walls. This area is of low priority to build though, as the place can also be covered from house 4.

 

It's 4200 points of hesco walls which is somewhat expensive but completely doable. The 5 Hescos that should be made first and are the most important are the ones on the inside of entrance 2 and 3 and the one covering the window at the top of the compound.

 

 

AliJGNC.png

 

Here is a hypothetical example of how i would construct a FOB in the middle of an open field or top of a hill. It's not based on any map, just the idea of protecting a spawn.

As you can see it would be impossible to fire rockets inside, while the defenders would be able to hit the rear of a hesco in order to clear attackers hiding outside the wall, of course the hesco protecting the gates could be removed thus the second layer around the radio, more single hescos could be added for extra defence against grenades.
 

Another lilac estate illustration with kill zones added.

 

http://i.imgur.com/A9pIv0W.png

 

My Lilac Estate ground plan for editing

 

http://i.imgur.com/FYxix2M.png

 

Part 2 - General tips and tricks

  • If you build a FOB somewhere in order to fortify it, you should remove the radio when you are done so that it cannot be sieged, then relocate it to a more hidden place.
  • Don't ever build the "bunker" on top of buildings, the bunker has a roof, and anyone with a rocket will actually have an easier time putting a rocket into a bunker on a roof, than hitting people without the bunker just hiding behind sandbags on the roof top.
  • As a general rule, there should be no wall behind the firing position than the firing positions own wall, otherwise you're giving the enemy a larger target to hit with explosives.
  • Compartmentalise: When you make a fire position, consider adding sandbags between them so that explosives that land inside won't kill everyone to the left and right of it.

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Edit to "Part 1 FOB on a Point":

Building a FOB on a A- or D-flag is a bad idea in - probably - 95% of the cases.

 

Since i'm telling this people in-game about 10 times a day, i will try to keep this very short:

Loosing the flag = Loosing tickets

Loosing a FOB = Loosing tickets

Respawning on a flag which is forced to be attacked by the game mode = Loosing tickets

Those 3 ticket killers combined can decide a match.

 

In most cases you have way better control of a flag when you set a FOB hidden behind/next to a flag and controling the area AROUND it, instead of dying in a constant nade-rain on the flag. 

FOB's are like honey, they force everybody to throw everything they got on it. So you better hide the honey.

There's also a few cases where it's a good idea to build it on the point - e.g. the Insurgency mode.

 

I like your idea and the effort you've put into this. It's a good explanation of building a clever defence set up. 

I just wanted to make clear: It's not always a good idea to build FOB's on points, especially with many new guys on your team who like to click the "Give Up" button faster than Germans eating Sauerkraut.  ;)

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Another lilac estate illustration with kill zones added.

 

http://i.imgur.com/A9pIv0W.png

More seriously though, I think a much more minimal defence is adequate. You pointed out some fairly decent defence positions here, which would by themselves already eliminate the risk of rockets shooting in (for example, "house 3"). The walls you blocked off are walls they have to jump up to get in, which is absolutely lovely to pick off enemies jumping over.

 

If you have to make a FOB on a control point (I'd only really recommend that if you can be pretty sure you'll be defending it all match, or if it is all-or-nothing, which is rare), I'd recommend building it outside-but-in-range. If you do build it inside, I'd recommend just blocking the windows, adding a few sandbags for cover against incoming nades (for example next to house 1, using house 1 walls + 2 sandbags triangle for safe cover of entrance 1; and one sandbag in house 2), sealing the front house 1 entrance, and just using the rest of the buildings to your advantage.

 

If you make your FOB inside an objective just to fortify it, I recommend destroying it after you're done, and rebuilding it at a distance to spawn back on (in range, so you can still have an ammo crate up).

 

Defence wise, don't get too tied up inside a compound. A few people inside on smart spots covering the right entrances, a few outside in sneaky locations covering the walls and calling out incoming enemies. Generally a way better defence than clusterf-bunkering up on a fob.

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I should probably have said this aswell, I agree building a FOB on a point is a bad idea in most cases, but people do it a lot, also Lilac Estate on Chora is probably one of the most difficult places to attack in the game if it is defended in the right way, and i consider it one of the few exceptions where it is actually bennifical to build a FOB on a point, the compound south east of Lilac is a much more stealthy place to put it, but considering how open Chora is numbers usually seem to win the field battles, however it is possible to defend Lilac with a single squad against several.

 

I'll add in the OP that building Fobs on points isn't a very good idea usually.

 

I added a Part 2 with some tips, taking into account things you guys said aswell.

Edited by Carl Hamilton

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I should probably have said this aswell, I agree building a FOB on a point is a bad idea in most cases, but people do it a lot, also Lilac Estate on Chora is probably one of the most difficult places to attack in the game if it is defended in the right way, and i consider it one of the few exceptions where it is actually bennifical to build a FOB on a point, the compound south east of Lilac is a much more stealthy place to put it, but considering how open Chora is numbers usually seem to win the field battles, however it is possible to defend Lilac with a single squad against several.

 

I'll add in the OP that building Fobs on points isn't a very good idea usually.

In my experience you just have to cut off reinforcements to the point (north / north-east / east mostly) and have a few people slowly but securely clear the compound. Unless they have a fob inside; then you just gather friendlies at the south and east side (rally 20m in the bushes/behind a wall), hug the walls as soon as you can, and just secure the outside walls, taking down the fob by numbers from the outside. Breach after FOB is destroyed. Also, a stealthy approach (split approach if needed) is half the work.

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Interesting Lego mentality, were's the wire? Its so forgotten by SL's and it can be a god send to defenders. Attackers don't like to deconstruct it cause you can be seen.  

 

Your defense is nice but expensive and take a long time tying up squad for a extensive time, Ok when seeding but not when your in the middle of the match.  Wheres the overhead defence and positions for ammo boxes. 

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I should probably have said this aswell, I agree building a FOB on a point is a bad idea in most cases, but people do it a lot, also Lilac Estate on Chora is probably one of the most difficult places to attack in the game if it is defended in the right way, and i consider it one of the few exceptions where it is actually bennifical to build a FOB on a point, the compound south east of Lilac is a much more stealthy place to put it, but considering how open Chora is numbers usually seem to win the field battles, however it is possible to defend Lilac with a single squad against several.

 

I'll add in the OP that building Fobs on points isn't a very good idea usually.

 

 

Just because 'people do it a lot' doesn't mean it's the right tactic. I'll keep nading and tubing that compound till you're bleeding tickets for fun.

 

Regarding fob's on Chora. On any of the 5 flags from center to North, a well coordinated squad can take any of those flags, FOB'd up or not. 

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Interesting Lego mentality, were's the wire? Its so forgotten by SL's and it can be a god send to defenders. Attackers don't like to deconstruct it cause you can be seen.  

 

Your defense is nice but expensive and take a long time tying up squad for a extensive time, Ok when seeding but not when your in the middle of the match.  Wheres the overhead defence and positions for ammo boxes. 

 

I figure people don't need help putting down their ammo boxes or figuring out where to put their troops, also if you on a public server good luck telling every single guy one at time where to go and make them stay there, if you are leading a team of people you actually know, you probably won't need the help telling them where to go in the first place. :)

 

I don't put razor wire on the entrance because it prevent my own troops from leaving the compound fast, and flanking missions are the best defence.

 

 

Just because 'people do it a lot' doesn't mean it's the right tactic. I'll keep nading and tubing that compound till you're bleeding tickets for fun.

 

Regarding fob's on Chora. On any of the 5 flags from center to North, a well coordinated squad can take any of those flags, FOB'd up or not. 

 

You'd litterally not be able to use your tube effectively against LiLac Estate in this condition, and grenades would be guesswork aswell. One doesn't need every single obstacle i put down, to make it pretty much impevious to long range explosives, Only about 5 of those hesco walls, which could be replaced with double sandbags come to think of it.

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You'd litterally not be able to use your tube effectively against LiLac Estate in this condition, and grenades would be guesswork aswell. One doesn't need every single obstacle i put down, to make it pretty much impevious to long range explosives, Only about 5 of those hesco walls, which could be replaced with double sandbags come to think of it.

 

 

Every compound on Chora is open to tubes and RPG's. There are elevated positions with direct firing lines into all the flag compounds. Someone with skill on the m203 will keep that capzone peppered for as long as he wished. 

 

Grenades is simple, two guys stacked up on each wall ~circa 20 paces apart and under arm throw over the walls. The kill zone from the nades cover the majority of the inside wall. Which ever point(s) you penetrate into the compound, move in and sweep up the stragglers in the middle. 

 

It is easier to write it down than implement, I'll give you that, but still extremely achievable  :)

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Here is some base building theory, somewhat inspired by the thread about grenade defence in fobs. This is the doctrine that i would adhere to when building Fobs but i hope we can have a discussion and see other interesting designs for reasonable fobs that are not super fobs.

 

The common mistake people make is to think they are playing tower defence or zombie apocalypse, thus what they often do is barricade doors thus making it harder for a squad to get out of a FOB and then eventually just being blocked and just easier to kill, many people build defences that actually make it harder to defend and easier to attack. I'll try to explain the doctrine that i follow when making any kind of FOB or defences.

 

Some assumptions I work by:

  1. Explosives is the primary danger to any FOB
  2. FOBs designs should contain as few items as possible so that they are realistic to build, atleast at the core.
  3. FOB defences should Never restrict friendly exit possibilities thus bottlenecking them.
  4. FOB defences should Never make it easier for the enemy to use explosive weapons against defenders
  5. FOB defences should Deny aproaches and areas in which would be a desireable aproach
  6. FOB defences should attempt to create zones in which the enemy can easily be killed

Notice, I am not suggesting you should build FOBS in harms way, but if you do this is some advice for you.

 

Part 1 FOB on a Point

 

When you have a FOB on a point it will be assaulted, and most likely will be showered with grenades, people will attempt to shoot through holes in the wall, and try to get inside a corner to camp the FOB area in order to get kills. For this reason, you usually should Not build FOBS directly on points. However in certain maps like Chora, you have large open grounds, with no bushes to hide in, and building fobs on the fields of Chora makes it extremely easy to kill your squad once discovered as their is no cover at all. So let's take a look at the exception case where building a FOB on a point or indeed just any compound is actually a good idea.

 

Most points are located near or in buildings, and so most FOBS are probably made inside a compound. The trick here is to have mobility to get out of the compound when needed, being able to fire from the compound, and also avoid being spawn killed by rockets and other weapons.

I've made an example using lilac estate on how to use defences to make it much harder to attack without blocking yourself in, let's go through that.

 

LWpSC7T.png

 

I've marked the entrences with blue triangles.

 

If you look at triangle 1, usually the enemy will sit here and fire rockets in diagonally and kill people in the other corner or center of the compound, by placing a hesco wall a bit away from the entrance you obstruct their line of sight while you are still able to exit. I've placed a line of sandbags to cover entrance 1, with RPG or grenade fire, even if they remove the hesco in that entrance this wall would prevent them from firing near entrance 3, while also giving a good place to fire upon the entrance in which they would have no cover.

 

Entrance 2 and 3 have hesco walls outside and inside, this is to prevent people from firing rockets through the door, thus friendlies can sit behind the wall and fire out of it, without the risk of being blown up by a rocket that comes through the door next to them, notice also that each window (marked in teal) and firing position has a hesco behind them to prevent people from shooting through windows into the compound if they manage to get all the way up to the wall.

We deny house 1 with razor wire, as house 1 serves little purpose in terms of defence, but serves as a good position for an attacker to cover the courtyard.

 

Entrance is already fairly hard to attack since you have to enter a room that can be grenaded or rocketed quite easily, the defences here serve to compartmentalise an area for a grenadier to sit and coer the house entrance, usually the enemy would throw grenade over the wall before entering the house, but it's very difficult landing a grenade inside a small area between 2 hesco walls. This area is of low priority to build though, as the place can also be covered from house 4.

 

It's 4200 points of hesco walls which is somewhat expensive but completely doable. The 5 Hescos that should be made first and are the most important are the ones on the inside of entrance 2 and 3 and the one covering the window at the top of the compound.

 

 

AliJGNC.png

 

Here is a hypothetical example of how i would construct a FOB in the middle of an open field or top of a hill. It's not based on any map, just the idea of protecting a spawn.

As you can see it would be impossible to fire rockets inside, while the defenders would be able to hit the rear of a hesco in order to clear attackers hiding outside the wall, of course the hesco protecting the gates could be removed thus the second layer around the radio, more single hescos could be added for extra defence against grenades.

 

Another lilac estate illustration with kill zones added.

 

http://i.imgur.com/A9pIv0W.png

 

My Lilac Estate ground plan for editing

 

http://i.imgur.com/FYxix2M.png

 

Part 2 - General tips and tricks

  • If you build a FOB somewhere in order to fortify it, you should remove the radio when you are done so that it cannot be sieged, then relocate it to a more hidden place.
  • Don't ever build the "bunker" on top of buildings, the bunker has a roof, and anyone with a rocket will actually have an easier time putting a rocket into a bunker on a roof, than hitting people without the bunker just hiding behind sandbags on the roof top.
  • As a general rule, there should be no wall behind the firing position than the firing positions own wall, otherwise you're giving the enemy a larger target to hit with explosives.
  • Compartmentalise: When you make a fire position, consider adding sandbags between them so that explosives that land inside won't kill everyone to the left and right of it.

 

 

 

Not bad not my method but...

 

Not bad

 

I'll not post mine cause of desire to be a secret squirrel but not bad.

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Building an FOB not an issue, losing an FOB is. Love throwing one down , couple of defences then demolish and move on.

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